Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2000 3:10 AM
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 122

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There are 6 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: More on Auto Transmission and the Transmission Governor
From: "Mark Hershey" <>

2. dherv and others

3. Starting woes
From: <>

4. Engine surges
From: "Michael R Dixon" <>

5. Limited Edition expansion
From: Lee <>

6. Re: cooling problem!
From: "Chris Parnham" <>

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 4 Jul 2000 23:45:28 -0500
From: "Mark Hershey" <>
Subject: Re: More on Auto Transmission and the Transmission Governor

Sorry,  Bob. Your info on the ZF4 is both interesting and entirely correct;
I just didn't read your post carefully. Have had lots of private E-mails on
A/T and other "D"questions and have had to skim 'em all a little; I've
probably been more confusing than helpful in answering their questions :-(

And many thanks to all of you who have written such kinds words thanking me
for this info. Some of you don't even have auto transmissions! This DML list
has helped me countless times and I can finally say I've at least partly
returned the favor.

Like Bob said... I, too, would like to know what components have actually
failed in the field. About half convinced that really poor factory solder
jobs account for more intermittent failures than anything else. And there
seems to be more intermittent failures than firm ones, judging from
feedback. Perhaps we should do an Egroups survey and see what symptoms are
reported. Might get a few new clues....

My sample of five or so is statistically way too small to draw any
conclusions. Interestingly, I haven't seen any comparitor chips fail yet,
although I expected to from the design. So far only electrolytic capacitors
(all five governors, 10 capacitors total) and driver transistors (three out
of 10) have actually failed. All 10 capacitors failed Open, so the governor
continued working fine under normal conditions but events like cooling fans
coming on or locking the doors while driving would introduce transients and
the comparators would sometimes (but not always) get confused.  In one
reported case cooling  fans would come on and sometimes the car would
downshift to Second, then upshift again just fine a couple seconds later!
Other than caps and drivers, a resistor that controls downshift seems to be
under rated; two were cracked and one showed signs of overheating. General
flakey operation seems improved by adding bypass caps (a parts addition,
technically not a failure).

The governor is, as you say, quite simple and with a very few changes could,
I think, be made reliable. Keeping my fingers crossed on my most recent
mods; so far (about 10 days), so good. Getting hot here in Dallas so we'll
be doing a little stress testing. :-)

I wish I had the time to do a micro controller....a PIC micro and a small
a/d convertor connected to the existing governor's "alternator" could do it;
just don't have the time to do the firmware. The hysteresis loop would be
the only tricky part of the programming---the speed/throttle position
voltage the causes the comparaters to drop out a solenoid to upshift is
higher than the voltage that causes the comparator to release the same
solenoid. You sure don't want the transmission chattering in confusion right
at the voltage threshold point! You can see this on the D(with a working
Governor) by letting the car coast and noting the vehicle speed at point of
downshift is considerably less than the upshift speed. Guess the Micro could
be programmed to keep track of rate-of-rise / fall rate and set a
acceleration / deceleration flag or something to help determine when to
energize/de-energize the solenoids. Oh, well, reckon this isn't the place to
go designing a replacement... but hey, it would be cool to program your own
personal upshift/downshift curve with a laptop in your front seat...

\\ Mark

----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Brandys <>
To: <>
Sent: Tuesday, July 04, 2000 9:21 AM
Subject: Re: [DML] More on Auto Transmission and the Transmission Governor

> You are correct about the Ds trans computer.
> I compared its design to that of the the ZF4.Bosch computer.  I really
like the
> Ds design because of its simplicity.


Message: 2
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2000 09:00:44 -0400
Subject: dherv and others

Dear list,
Just a quick note to the list to highly, let me repeat, highly recommend John
Hervey for electrical parts for your D. His info can be found in the Buy and
Sell section of the list's homepage. I should have wrote this sooner but...
John was extremely nice to talk to and very helpful. I'm mechanically sound
(used to work on helicopters and the D is a joy by comparison) but a bonehead
when it comes to electricity. John was easy to understand and absolutely great
to talk to. This guy has three D's and you can tell by talking to him that he is
a master of the Delorean electrical system and is freaky for Deloreans. If
you're looking for electrical parts for your car- John is the man to talk to.
While I'm at it I gotta thank Warren down in Houston who has also been a
pleasure to deal with and, of course, DMC Joe for all of his postings to the
Sorry to sound like a commercial, but these guys are no less than a boon to the
D community.
Matthew Gailey 3946


Message: 3
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2000 09:32:59 +0200
From: <>
Subject: Starting woes

Maybe a hanging starter (this could happen sometimes), take a hammer and hit
the starter 3 or 4 times.
On my car it works.

Klaus Steiner
VIN 5980, Germany

>  Date: Sun, 2 Jul 2000 15:22:02 -0400
>   From: "Matthew P. Olans" <>
> Subject: Starting woes

> Ok,
>        I've had VIN #10365 for about a week now.  The company who shipped
> the car killed the battery in transit.  I could start it if I jumped it
> it would run fine but after shutting down it didn't have enough juice to
> restart.  So I bought a new battery today.  I put it in today and now
> nothing happens.  Well, ok, everything else works, but when I turn the key
> don't hear the fuel pump and when I try to crank I get one click.  The
> lights go off as if it's ready to start but it never turns.  The battery
> 100%.  I checked the fuses and they all look good.  I'm at a loss and I am
> not much of a mechanic.  Any ideas before I have it flatbedded??
> atthew


Message: 4
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2000 08:57:10 -0500
From: "Michael R Dixon" <>
Subject: Engine surges

Recently I have had a re-occuring  problem.  While traveling in 5th gear the
engine surges and the voltage increases.  Why?
I've also noticed that while at an idle the engine doesn't idle smoothly.
It doesn't cut out it just surges every now an then.   Any ideas?
Michael R. Dixon
The Investment Center
Securities Offered Through Harbour Investments Inc.
One Odana Ct.
Madison, WI. 53719
(608) 274-7744
Securties Licensed in OK. CO.


Message: 5
Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 03:25:11 -0700
From: Lee <>
Subject: Limited Edition expansion

Hello All,

	Ok enough already.........I get the picture....Please ease off the edition
help thread,
I give in!

	With more than half of the existing edition owners responding over the
July 4 holidays offering several solutions. The two most often offered were
 "Expand the edition to include the edition owners who dropped out", and
"expand the edition until it at least pays for it's self". Several other
comments were, even if doubled the kits, they would be a rear and hard to
find item as collectable go, and I would rather see you just add some
editions instead of producing a special edition of 20, these would be more
valuable than the previous 100 kits.

	OK I propose the following given the general consensus of existing edition
owners. I will expend the edition by 50 kits, but with some limitations.

	1. Edition 101 will not be started until edition 100 has been shipped,
this includes the
special free kits and any make up on lost or damaged kits.

	2. Edition 101 to 150* will first be available to any one on my complete
reservations list. This means that if a person was on the reservation list
and is not now a current owner, that person will have an opportunity to
become an owner. Let me make it clear that the reason most original
reservation owners who were dropped from the list was because they failed
to respond in the allowed purchase enrollment period, failed to respond at
all, and a few bounced checks. 

	3. The additional editions will be produced on an as required basis with
no set delivery date and done when I can find the time to do the work and
as before purchase arrangements must be completed before any work on an
edition begins. (This is a DML member only sale).

	4. There will be no waiting list or reservation list, you want one contact
me by e-mail
and make your arrangements. Former reservation certificate holders who are
not now edition owners have 30 days or until August 5, 2K to contact me and
exercise their edition option. I know exactly who you are, so be sure to
include your "ORIGINAL RESERVATION NUMBER" when contacting me You will
receive a new edition number. After August 5, 2K any remaining editions
will be available on a first come first serve basis with the above
limitations applying. I am also imposing a two editions per DML member
limitation, so if you already are an owner, you can acquire a second
edition, but only after the former reservation holders have had their

	5. The cost:  With out increasing the edition cost substantially there is
no way I will ever break even (if labor is considered) let alone make a
profit. I have done an estimate of what the additional editions materials
will run and added the amount I am now out of pocket for the current
edition, less the amount for free editions.

	Remaining editions (4 kits in stainless and 3 in Gold) are priced at
$140.00+ S&INS

	Edition 101 through 150   are priced at $160+shipping and insurance.
	All shipping will be via UPS 2nd Day. 

	Current open market trading price for the edition is $416.00 as registered
with me for title and certificate of authentication.


Please make all res ponces to this post to me in private e-mail - or ..........replies to not be posted


*	Two kits have been set aside for the DML to auction off with proceeds to
be used by DML moderators to support the DML.

CAUTION :   Any individual or group discharging a nuclear device or weapon 
inside Los Angeles city limits may be fined $500 - and/or serve 30 days in
county jail.

It's the LAW!


Message: 6
Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2000 13:56:10 +0100
From: "Chris Parnham" <>
Subject: Re: cooling problem!

Cliff, its a long slow job re-filling the system..there is something
currently running on the same subject on the DML..basically you have an air
lock, keep filling up the bottle and loosening off various hoses until you
have it as full as you can. run for a few minutes, let stand till cool,
re-fill will get there eventually!

Chris P Derby 95

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cliff Andrews" <>
To: <>
Sent: Tuesday, July 04, 2000 10:55 PM
Subject: [DML] cooling problem!

> hi everyone.. today i replace 3 of my coolent hoses
> around the engine. I replaced the hose going to the
> coolent bottle, the hose going into the water pump and
> the hose going out of the pump. Now when i took off
> the old ones coolent came rushing out. I assume it was
> not all of it. I put the hoses back on and filled the
> coolent bottle to the max line, the coolent bottle
> didnt drain into the hoses very much it just filled
> the bottle and sat.  I turned on the car and let it
> run for a while.. my temperature started to raise and
> no fans kicking on, also the level in the bottle did
> not lower. So if i let it run it would eventually
> overheat.  What am i doing wrong? Helpppp!
> -Cliff Andrews
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