From: dmcnews_at_dml_egroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2000 9:12 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_egroups.com
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 250

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There are 10 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???
From: "Robert Rooney" <dmcvegas_at_dml_worldnet.att.net>

2. Vin#0001 Bricklin for sale
From: Delorean17_at_dml_aol.com

3. Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???
From: "Rob Hook" <robhook_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>

4. DeLorean Model
From: TomHuntington_at_dml_delorean.com

5. RE: Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???
From: "Jack & Virginia Stiefel" <stiefel_at_dml_minalco.com>

6. RE: Lotus Esprit windshield
From: "Aaron Husak" <aaronhusak_at_dml_hotmail.com>

7. Clutch part 3
From: paulheymeson_at_dml_thefreeinternet.co.uk

8. New owner has questions,
From: RJRavalli_at_dml_AOL.com

9. Re: Actual Production Numbers (was: DeLoreans made)
From: "jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net " <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

10. RE: Actual Production Numbers (was: DeLoreans made)
From: Knut Grimsrud <knut.s.grimsrud_at_dml_intel.com>





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 23:07:01 -0000
From: "Robert Rooney" <dmcvegas_at_dml_worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???

   I seriously doubt that there is any such product as a "Sunroof 
Deflector". More then likely this is just one of those generic auto 
auto parts sites that simply lists the same products over and over 
again that are universal fit for any vehicle. Ie headlights, light 
bulbs, carpet cleaners, etc... Somebody probably just goofed when 
they included this item in for the DeLorean.

   On the flip side of this, I have seen gullwing doors that had sun 
roofs installed. It was on an old Bradley GT kit car. Sitting inside, 
it gave the car a more airy and open feel. The down side of course 
was they looked somewhat of an eye-sore on the out side. Because the 
Bradley was a simple kit car, the doors were much lighter and 
simpler. So the benefit was that you could remove the plexiglass to 
make it a moon roof.

   This could be done to the DeLorean. But to make it look more like 
it came from the factory, clips would need to be used to secure the 
glass. A traditional rubber lib would look nastly and would kill the 
simple uniformity of the car. Try to picture a piece of glass on the 
roof, but it would be mounted BELOW the stainless steel. It would 
fit, seal, and look just like the quarter panel glass. The down side 
is that it would kill both the look of the car, and possibly kill 
the "cockpit" feeling in the passenger compartment. I would also be 
worried about opening and closing the doors on a sharp incline. 
Craking/shattering the glass would be a problem since that's where 
the door is most prone to twist at.

-Robert
vin 6585



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_egroups.com, "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> I have heard many crazy stories at car shows.  I've heard the 
sunroof story
> too.  A teenager told me that he used to have a Delorean and it 
came with a
> small sunroof in each door.  He thought they were aftermarket.  I 
thought he
> was telling a tall tale.  If they exist, maybe someone has some 
pictures?
> 
> Walt    Tampa, FL




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Message: 2
Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2000 11:33:56 EDT
From: Delorean17_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Vin#0001 Bricklin for sale

Hello List,
    I know this isnt a Bricklin list but I just thought I would post it here 
because I know many people on here are interested in Bricklins too.  please 
do not respond to this post and call the phone #'s below if you are 
interested the car.  I hope the moderators don't mind me taking up one 
message:).  I have seen the car and its condition is immaculate.
1974 BRICKLIN VIN #0001 
-First production Bricklin built-
-Seen on the tonight show with JOHNNNY CARSON
Sold at Kruse auction in January 0f 76 by the IRS on M.S.O and remained 
untitled until 1999.  The car is 100% original and even has the original 
hydraulic doors.  It has 13,000 factory driven miles and is the original 
suntan acrylic.  Has a 360 AMC-v-8 4 barrel carb.  The car has spent much of 
its last 24 years in various museums in Illinois.  Car is being sold by the 
second owner located in Grand Rapids Michigan.  The car runs great and is 
fully operational.  This is an untouched original part of automotive history, 
Not often does a vin#0001 vehicle get in to the hands of the public and here 
is your chance to own for $25,000.  serious offers entertained!.  call Scott 
at 616-459-8890.  SERIOUS BUYERS ONLY PLEASE!  give him a call and he can 
email you pictures.

Thank You
David
#2496-



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Message: 3
Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2000 15:41:50 -0700
From: "Rob Hook" <robhook_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???

I really don't think adding sunroofs to the top of the doors would degrade
their strength at all.  That portion of the door is very flimsy anyway.  If
you push on it (don't try it unless your headliner is out) you'll see that
they easily give way and pop downwards.  I've thought about sunroofs for a
while but didn't want to modify original doors like that.  It would
certainly cut down on the claustrophobic feeling inside the DeLorean.

As for a "hood" scoop, I've always been playing with the idea of a scoop
that goes up from the rear of the car (using plexiglass so you can still see
out the back) to the top of the roof like alot of the GT-1 cars we see now.
Neat idea but something I'd do in my spare time, which right now amounts to
about 2 minutes per month.  Oh well.

--Rob Hook





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Message: 4
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 13:36:35 -0000
From: TomHuntington_at_dml_delorean.com
Subject: DeLorean Model

   DMLers, I came across this website the other day and thought I 
would share it with you. It is a great way to persuade manufacturers 
to make either a diecast or a plastic model of the DeLorean. Thanks!

The website is: http://www.modelcarhub.com/makeitform.htm




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Message: 5
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2000 14:26:13 -0400
From: "Jack & Virginia Stiefel" <stiefel_at_dml_minalco.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???

Simply put, a "sunroof deflector" is a similar to the window vent deflectors
that help keep the air form flowing intothe cabin to fast.  I owned a car a
ling time back that had such a piece. When you removed the glass,this piece
lockedin the same connectors. It was smoked like headlight covers....  I
guess it is kind of likeasunroof bug deflector lol. Some cars even have then
integrated into the sunroof -- ie Toyotas and Hondas sometimes have them.

Jack & Virginia Stiefel
'81 DeLorean DMC-12 Vin 03461 August 1981 Build DeLorean NYS Lic: 1981 DMC
'97 BMW Z-3 Convertible V-6
'98 Dodge Ram Quad Cab Lariat
'99 Dodge Durango SLT-Plus
'01 Chrysler PT-Cruiser -- on its way
Visit our homepage at www.geocities.com/stiefel.geo/new
<http://www.geocities.com/stiefel.geo/new>



-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Rooney [mailto:dmcvegas_at_dml_worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Friday, October 06, 2000 7:07 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_egroups.com
Subject: [DML] Re: Sunroof?? Hood Scoop???


   I seriously doubt that there is any such product as a "Sunroof
Deflector". More then likely this is just one of those generic auto
auto parts sites that simply lists the same products over and over
again that are universal fit for any vehicle. Ie headlights, light
bulbs, carpet cleaners, etc... Somebody probably just goofed when
they included this item in for the DeLorean.

   On the flip side of this, I have seen gullwing doors that had sun
roofs installed. It was on an old Bradley GT kit car. Sitting inside,
it gave the car a more airy and open feel. The down side of course
was they looked somewhat of an eye-sore on the out side. Because the
Bradley was a simple kit car, the doors were much lighter and
simpler. So the benefit was that you could remove the plexiglass to
make it a moon roof.

   This could be done to the DeLorean. But to make it look more like
it came from the factory, clips would need to be used to secure the
glass. A traditional rubber lib would look nastly and would kill the
simple uniformity of the car. Try to picture a piece of glass on the
roof, but it would be mounted BELOW the stainless steel. It would
fit, seal, and look just like the quarter panel glass. The down side
is that it would kill both the look of the car, and possibly kill
the "cockpit" feeling in the passenger compartment. I would also be
worried about opening and closing the doors on a sharp incline.
Craking/shattering the glass would be a problem since that's where
the door is most prone to twist at.

-Robert
vin 6585



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_egroups.com, "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> I have heard many crazy stories at car shows.  I've heard the
sunroof story
> too.  A teenager told me that he used to have a Delorean and it
came with a
> small sunroof in each door.  He thought they were aftermarket.  I
thought he
> was telling a tall tale.  If they exist, maybe someone has some
pictures?
>
> Walt    Tampa, FL



Before posting messages or replies, see the posting policy rules at:
www.dmcnews.com/Admin/rules.html

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 18:59:31 GMT
From: "Aaron Husak" <aaronhusak_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Lotus Esprit windshield


James Espey Wrote:

>I'm dying to know how much an Esprit windshield costs...it HAS to be more 
>than the less than $400 NOS  and aftermarket windshields cost. If we can 
>prove that the Esprit windshield costs more, can we please kill this thread 
>forever?  :-)


From the Lotus Esprit Mailing list:


> >    The best price I found was at Lo-Can Glass for $595 + shipping. That 
>was
> > for the non-OEM glass, but it was tinted, and looked exactly like the
> > Triplexx original. Lo-Can also sells the OEM Triplexx brand for around 
>$670.
> > These prices are just for the glass. You have to install it yourself. If 
>you
> > want to have someone else put it in for you, Lo-Can will ship it to a 
>local
> > glass installer for you.
> >


oops. forgot that part. I ordred the carriers and finishers separately from
Sports Car World, but they might be cheaper somewhere else. Here's the part
numbers and prices from SCW:

Qty    Part #                    Description                Price

    2    A082U5870F    Carrier, finisher, side   $16.95
    1    A082U5868K    Finisher, Windscreen, RH  $17.50
    1    A082U5867K    Finisher, Windscreen, LH   $19.95
    1    A082U5869K    Finisher, Windscreen,  Top    $65
    1    A082U5871F    Carrier, Windscreen top finisher     16.55
    6    A075U0588Z    Spacer, 6mm, Windscreen
    4    A082U7065F    Spacer, 4mm, Windscreen     .95 cents each

Lotus also specifies a "Betaseal Kit" to do the actual sealing. Apparently
Betaseal Kits are no longer available anywhere. I used 3M Fast setting 
Urethane
for the sealer, and 3M pinchweld primer to prime the frame. These products 
are
supposedly superior to Betaseal, and you can get them at your local auto 
paints
supply store. I also suspect that the carriers and finishers are pretty 
generic
parts, and you probably could find WAY cheaper sources. I intend to look 
next
time.

Good luck,



>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

This was for a Stevens body car, not a Guigaro, but I suspect prices would 
be similar, and definitely more than James' price.

-AH



http://www.continentalthunder.homestead.com

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Message: 7
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 20:55:14 -0000
From: paulheymeson_at_dml_thefreeinternet.co.uk
Subject: Clutch part 3

Hello Members,

Although the manual says the clutch is self adjusting is this true?
I've never heard of a self adjusting clutch on a hydrolic clutch 
before and as mine seems to be slipping I wondered if it can be 
adjusted the clutch is only 6000 miles old!

Fluid is full up no leaks on master or slave cylinders.
If it can't be adjusted maually the only thing I conclude is oil on 
the plate?

Please help.

Paul.United kingdom.




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Message: 8
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2000 19:07:39 EDT
From: RJRavalli_at_dml_AOL.com
Subject: New owner has questions,

[MODERATOR's NOTE:  Richard's e-mail address is RJRavalli(at)aol.com]

I just bought an 81 with over 100k miles on it.  Body is in great
shape but the engine looks like it's going to need some work.  Yeah, 
I'm one of those owners who doesn't know a WHOLE lot about
the car or cars in general, but I'm willing to learn.

Now yes, I'm leaking coolant (more cliches).  The hoses look new and
I can't tell where it's leaking from.  Since I'm not a car person myself,
(and the only thing I'm familiar with are 1980s Fords) any 
suggestions on where I should take it or what might be wrong?

Since this is probably a very common question that gets posted here
alot, let me ask something more specific: I live in Modesto, CA...are 
there any owners in the central valley area who would be willing to 
offer some kind of personal advice on repair issues?  It also needs
a good deal of interior work,

Any help would be appreciated...please respond or e-mail me at
RJRavalli_at_dml_aol.com.

Richard


Please respond or send e-mail directly to RJRavalli_at_dml_aol.com. 
Thanks,

 



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Message: 9
Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2000 00:53:01 -0000
From: "jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net " <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Actual Production Numbers (was: DeLoreans made)

As a manufacturer of automobiles DMC was required to isssue a 
certificate of origion for each car made unless built for testing, 
certification or prototyping. Also each car that was built was then 
financed to a bank for working capital so there should have been a 
large paper trail. I think also they would have to keep a tally for 
the D.O.T. and the E.P.A as far as automatics to manuals and how many 
to each state.There would also have been shipping documents and 
customs paperwork to follow each car.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_egroups.com, James Espey <james_at_dml_u...> wrote:
> For years the commonly accepted number of DeLoreans made has been 
> 8583. The DOA uses this figure, but does not say what it is based
on 
> or where they got it. They break it down as follows:
> 
> 1981 - 6539
> 1982 - 1126
> 1983 - 918
> 
> Assuming that there were no VIN's skipped during the 1981
production 
> run (00500 - 07199), that would indicate that 6699 were built as 
1981 
> models. The assumption that no numbers were skipped, particularly 
> early in production is a a very large assumption.
> 
> However, one would think that there would be no reason to skips 
VIN's 
> in the 1982 model run (010000 - ?). The count of 1126 appears to 
have 
> come from a service bulletin showing the VIN range of 10000-11126.
A 
> quick check of the VIN chronology shows that there VINs as high as 
> 11784 for the 1982 model run.
> 
> Knut Grimsrud's statistical analysis of the DeLorean Owners 
Directory 
> data, in the form of the "DeLorean Production Chronology" indicates 
> that the exact number is somewhere in the low-9000's and can be 
found 
> here:
> 
> http://www.dmcnews.com/faq/n_chron.htm
> 
> Interestingly enough, a recent phone conversation I had with Barrie 
> Wills, the original DeLorean Motor Company Director of 
Manufacturing, 
> also recollected that the actual production was somewhere around 
9100.
> 
> Unless documentation/information surfaces from a former Belfast 
> employee or Consolidated in Ohio, the exact number will probably 
> never be known.
> 
> James Espey
> DeLorean Motor Company
> Houston, Texas
> 
> 281/568-9573
> 800/USA-DMC1
> http://www.delorean.com
> 
> >Is the exact number of DeLoreans made 8,583? More or less??
> >
> >John Feldman
> >VIN 4275
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 10
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2000 18:14:00 -0700
From: Knut Grimsrud <knut.s.grimsrud_at_dml_intel.com>
Subject: RE: Actual Production Numbers (was: DeLoreans made)

James wrote:

> Knut Grimsrud's statistical analysis of the DeLorean Owners Directory 
> data, in the form of the "DeLorean Production Chronology" indicates 
> that the exact number is somewhere in the low-9000's and can be found 
> here:     <http://www.dmcnews.com/faq/n_chron.htm>
>
> Interestingly enough, a recent phone conversation I had with Barrie 
> Wills, the original DeLorean Motor Company Director of Manufacturing, 
> also recollected that the actual production was somewhere around 9100.

Ken just posted the latest DOD and with each new DOD I get a copy
of the raw data to update the chronology study. With the latest data,
plus additional data from documents James has discovered, the latest
statistical analysis again indicates that the number of cars
manufactured is around 9100-9200. I'll have the latest stats done in
another week or so and will send out a note when the latest analysis
is available on the DMCNews web site.

As James indicates, it is actually fairly easy to show that the 8583
number is incorrect, however, it's much more interesting to attempt to
determine the correct number.

	Knut




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