From: <>
To: <>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 363
Date: Friday, January 12, 2001 5:38 PM

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There are 13 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: De Lorean on Jim Varney E! True Hollywood story
From: "Gabe" <>

2. Temp compensating struts

3. torsion bar
From: "Thomas B" <>

4. Re: An end to the shock and spring debacle? (another volley)

5. How is he a failure???

6. Re: Re: One More thought on the D's doors
From: "Stian Birkeland" <>

7. My opinion on how the D handles and East TN meeting
From: Aaron Posey <>

8. Re:An end to the shock and spring debacle? (another volley)

9. Re: Gasket Question.
From: "DMC Joe" <>

10. A comment on Metrics

11. Re: laughing?
From: "mdrig" <>

From: "Tyler Graves" <>

13. Re: How is he a failure???
From: "Tyler Graves" <>

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 16:44:56 -0800
From: "Gabe" <>
Subject: Re: De Lorean on Jim Varney E! True Hollywood story

A friend saw that show and told me that one of Jims friends reported he had
taken the delorean on the highway and gone 140 mph. I thought that was
ridiculous, the chances of it are very low. My guess is that Jim didn't
upgrade the car but if he did, not just would he have to do that but he'd
also have to get an upgraded speedometer that went up to 140. I think that
this friend just guessed they were going 140 because the speed had exceeded
the factory speedometer that only goes up to 85

----- Original Message -----
From: <>
To: <>
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2001 2:43 PM
Subject: Re: [DML] De Lorean on Jim Varney E! True Hollywood story

> Nick,
> Jim Varney's Delorean sat here in Gallatin,TN for about 5 years. It was
> gutted on the inside, ( the 2nd owner was going to restore it). All the
> were still kept, just taken out of the car.It was later sold to a list
> who lives in KY. My understanding was that after checking it out and
> it up. It started and ran fine. It was an 81 with lines in the hood,( no
> flap). The current owner might want to pipe in here with the rest of the
> details.
> Bruce Battles
> Vin # 06569
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Before posting messages or replies, see the posting policy rules at:
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:


Message: 2
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 20:23:25 EST
Subject: Temp compensating struts

In a message dated 1/11/01 10:18:47 AM Eastern Standard Time, writes:

<< I can think of one possible improvement, a temperature compensating 
 strut, >>

Since the struts lose their lift in time, (as well as having less lift in 
cold weather,) I've been thinking about getting a second set so that with the 
right torsion bar adjustment, I can use my new struts for extra lift in cold 
weather, and the older ones instead in warm weather.  Easier than adjusting 
the torsion bars twice a year.  Just haven't gotten around to trying it yet.  
Of course an automatically adjusting strut would be even easier.  But a lot 
of extra engineering, perhaps.

vin 11174 
in the driveway... I don't drive on salt!  :-p


Message: 3
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:50:30 -0000
From: "Thomas B" <>
Subject: torsion bar

I am a little embarrassed to ask this:  How does the torsion bar work 
in the door of the Delorean anyway?


Tom (


Message: 4
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:23:13 EST
Subject: Re: An end to the shock and spring debacle? (another volley)

***** Moderator's Note *****
Am I going to have to give you guys a timeout?

I think we have established that the community of DeLorean parts and
service providers do an exellent job of supporting the marque and 
recent posts indicate that DML subscribers are in violent agreement.
Please continue any further discussion on this topic offline.

<<My original posting earlier this week apparently offended some 

> people, people who coincidentally or otherwise happen to praise the 
> products and services of PJ Grady in their DML postings. My intent 
> was not to portray Rob's products or services as shoddy in any way. 
> My choice of the word "cheapie" was a bad judgement on my part. I 
> have the utmost respect for Rob's technical knowledge and abilities. 
> Rob is one of the best customers that De Lorean Motor Company has, 
> and I believe that he, Debbie and their staff provide an excellent 
> and needed service in their region of the country. While I disagree 
> with his assertion that front springs are sufficient to perform an 
> adequate job in upgrading the suspension properly (see above), people 
> will always disagree. It's when people like Steve, Gary, and now, 
> Dan, take it personal and begin to make veiled (and even open) 
> accusations that it denigrates the spirit and intent of the DeLorean 
> Mailing List.
> James Espey
> DeLorean Motor Company
> Houston, Texas>>

  My original post was simply a reply to a post made by Steve Robano agreeing 
that I believed the front spring set offered by other DeLorean Vendors was a 
good quality item that worked very well.  It is from personal experience 
having bought them and used them on my car that I spoke.  My comment was 
anything but an "accusation" as you put it.  It was also certainly not 
"denigrating" in any way.  If you read my original post again maybe you will 
be a little more objective and less defensive.  I ended the post saying "I 
don't know ANY DeLorean Vendor who sells inferior products"  that includes 
DMC Houston obviously.  As you stated your choice of denigrating words such 
as "cheapie", when referring to another parts suppliers products, was wrong.  
I do not see any other post using denigrating comments.  Mine certainly did 
not.  All I said in essence was that I believe all suppliers deserve credit 
for their hard work and time and their fine quality items they offer the 
DeLorean Community.  Are we on the DML not allowed to defend a product we 
have purchased from another part supplier when we see it referred to as 
"cheapie" or in any other bad way?  Aren't most post from new owners, asking 
those who have used a part purchased from a DeLorean Parts supplier, for 
their opinion on its performance?  Your opinions are always welcomed on the 
DML from what I have seen James. I hardly see how when other members of this 
list offer their opinions in an intelligent manner, you can accuse them as 
being denigrating.  My original post is below I would appreciate it if you 
could tell me how it is possibly denigrating or accusatory.  Once again I 
said "I don't know any DeLorean Vendor who sells inferior products"  If I see 
one of the products I have purchased spoken about I feel I have the right to 
simply offer my opinion as well.  I have bought many items from DMC Houston.  
I have no complaints about them.  If the situation was someone referring to 
an item I had a good experience with from DMC, in a negative manner,  I would 
respond in same.  No James I don't like it when I see anyone denigrate the 
spirit of the DML.  Putting down any one of the DeLorean Vendors who give so 
much of their time and effort does upset me and anyone who appreciates the 
closeness of the DeLorean Community I think would agree.  I take you at your 
word that it was a bad judgment call on your part and would have accepted 
that.   There is no need for you to continue it by saying accusatory or 
denigrating comments were made which is simply untrue. If anything your post 
above, praising Rob and Debby and the other suppliers, repeats the theme of 
my original post below.

Gary Gore

My Original Post:   
    I also see this trend developing recently as well unfortunately.  There 
are many fine vendors and parts suppliers out there that are extremely 
courteous to DeLorean Owners.  They provide excellent service and make 
excellent products.  However they do not always have the time to read and 
reply to the DML.  They are more than happy to take the time on the phone and 
help you in any way possible.  DMC Joe, Don Steger, and Rob Grady,  to name a 
few.  Every one has different opinions on what is best for their car.  I have 
the front springs replaced on my car with ones from PJ Grady.  They are 
anything but "cheapie"  They are excellent in quality and make for an 
improved ride and even out the spacing in the wheel wells.  The rear stock 
springs are fine and are designed to support the weight of the engine.  Only 
the front was raised originally to meet specs for the US market.  As I said 
to each is own when it comes to your DeLorean.  I don't know any DeLorean 
Vendor who sells inferior products and have never seen it mentioned here on 
the DML or inferred to until recently.

Gary Gore
VIN 3360

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 5
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 00:05:44 EST
Subject: How is he a failure???

Hello all,

While watching one of my favorite "history lessons" The Space Age (between 
USA and USSR back in the 60's and 70's), on the history channel, the program 
was called Blunders in History or a name of that nature. Now, if you watch 
the title screen, it shows past people or events the program covered. If you 
lok real closely, you see John Z. DeLorean walking out of a courtroom, or 
building looking like it. 
I guess my point is, I hate how so many people view the car, company, and 
sometimes, even the man as a failure, or sometimes in my experiences, even a 
joke. I wish that people knew just how good the car and his vision along with 
ideas really were, and that just a few simple fixes make it an almost 
flawless car. I mean, most modern day cars that you see when they first come 
out, they have bugs, I mean everything does for the first year or so. Heck, 
my dads Explorer dropped its tranny 50,000 miles into its life. (I dislike 
Fords by the way) I mean, why don't they ever cover the Bricklin? Or other 
failed cars that only were made in the hundreds? No, most articles and shows 
I have seen or read about the DeLorean or even John Z., have been negative 
towards his attempt at something that could have been much greater than we 
already see it. Why don't they show how fast and good he brought Pontiac 
production? How about how he got the Trans Am up and running, or the Tempest 
lines better?
But, I guess its just wishful thinking for a 20 year old with a dream for a 
D, and his anger for all of the bad publicity that we owners and enthusiasts 
get. (Even in my own thinks his fords are better runners than a 
well kept D)

Just a thought I guess, and thanks to ALL the D owners who have kept the 
"vision" alive and helped show that its not a "blunder" or "failure" in our 
automotive history.

Dave Loffler
Johnston, RI

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 6
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 07:45:05
From: "Stian Birkeland" <>
Subject: Re: Re: One More thought on the D's doors

Nah, the torsion bars are also made of stainless steel :-)

Best wishes
Stian Birkeland

VIN # 06759

>From: "Steve Rubano" <>
>Putting a rubber boot over the Torsion bar IMHO is a bad idea. It
>can/will trap moisture in the boot and possibly rust the torsion bar.

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at


Message: 7
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 23:32:41 -0800 (PST)
From: Aaron Posey <>
Subject: My opinion on how the D handles and East TN meeting

The DeLorean, in my opinion,is the car that is the most fun
to drive. Watching the reactions of the people in the
neighboring car is espicially fun.  However, I have to
agree with some other people that the handling and
performance is somewhat to be desired.  I do have to say
that my new DTS, which is a luxury car, does take off
faster from the line and can take the corners better than
my DeLorean; but we are talking 20 years in engineering
advancements. I have friend with a TT, which the D was
compared in handling to on a previous post, and that is all
she talks about is the way the car handles compared to
previous Porsches she has owned.  I do have to say that the
DeLorean handles very well but there are a lot of cars in
its class that do handle a bit better. I have driven a LOT
of cars being in the car business. Although, mostly have
been luxury ones. I have had my share of Corvettes and
Porsches come my way.  I would take the D any day over
those cars, even though they may out handle my DeLorean. 
Even with the upgraded suspension set from DMC Houston, I
don't see how it can out handle any of the above mentioned
cars, including the new TT.  

I will be in Houston in June for the events and to drive
the automatic performance/handling upgraded D!  I am not
fully convinced on what new shocks and springs can do to a
vehicle to greatly improve a vehicles driving
characteristics.  I guess I am soured by my Grand Cherokee
which I spent hundreds in "improving" the suspension with
hi grade components but ending up with a worse ride in my
opinion. That is a SUV and we are talking sports cars so
enough on that. I guess I will see in June!  I do have to
say that I like the look of the front end lowered only, not
the rear. The rear looks to be the right height. I do agree
if I am going to do a suspension upgrade on a D, all four
springs should be replaced and the front lowered, but not
the rear.

I do know after all this talk of performance/handling
upgrades that I would like a 2nd DeLorean to just do all of
this to. I am going to keep my current one as close to
concourse as possible, it has 1050 miles on the odo as of
today. If it weren't for DMC Joe, Rob Grady, and all of my
local D friends I would never consider getting a 2nd one.  

This brings me to another thought.  I have had a good
number of responses for people wanting to meet in the East
Tennessee area.  If anyone in KY,VA,NC,SC,GA,AL or anyone
that wants to drive their D's to meet some owners and have
a good time, just email me.  I am working on a location,
date, and activities to do.  I would like to meet sometime
before the end of February.  I have a teaser web page up at  with a cool pic of my D in front of the
sunsphere that was built for the 1982 World's Fair.  


Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!


Message: 8
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:54:42 EST
Subject: Re:An end to the shock and spring debacle? (another volley)


     Wait a second here.  First you say and I quote:

<<"a DeLorean...we contend outhandles any car in it's class, and as well as 
many modern cars, including the Audi TT.">>

    In that statement you clearly compare the De Lorean to the Audi TT saying 
that it "outhandles....many modern cars, including the Audi TT".  Now in a 
second post to the DML after you were being questioned about that same 
statement, you took the time to write out an entire paragraph (not worth 
repeating) saying how bad the Audi TT was.  Are you now saying that the Audi 
TT is a crappy handling car?  If you think its suspension was designed 
poorly, then why did you compare it to the De Lorean originally?

    As far as I know the Audi TT is a good handling car and I don't think any 
suspension upgrade on a De Lorean will make it outhandle any other modern car 
in its class including an Audi TT.  But I'm sure the upgrade from Houston 
will help the DeLoreans handling a good deal.

    Your comment towards Steve, Gary, and Dan I did not find very nice 
either, from my point of view they were just bringing up good points about 
their opinions towards your comments on the DML. 



Message: 9
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:55:36 -0500
From: "DMC Joe" <>
Subject: Re: Gasket Question.


Your best bet would be to order DeLorean factory spec gaskets. The PRV valve
covers rarely leak, most DeLoreans equipped with the factory installed
gaskets are still bone dry. We have found that most leaks occur with
non-rigid gasket replacements.

"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <>
Web Site: (TEMPORARY)<>

----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Rooney <>
To: <>
Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2001 6:26 AM
Subject: [DML] Gasket Question.

> I was planning on replacing my rocker cover gaskets soon. But I had a
> quick question first. Is instant gasket alright to use, or would it
> be more advisable to purchase a set from DMC Houston and use factory
> original? The stuff says that it can be used for head gaskets and
> that the engine can be used within 1 minute of application. Ideas?
> -Robert
> vin 6585


Message: 10
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 05:11:24 EST
Subject: A comment on Metrics

I have a couple of comments in regards to recent postings, without naming 

Referring to a recent posting and since this is tech talk:
    There is no such thing as a 1/4 Centimeter! It is either 0.25 cm or 2.5 
    (Or somewhere between 3/32nd and 7/64th's. Maybe 5/48th's?) ;-)
    In this case maybe 2 - 3 mm would do?  
    Only in the way outdated US/English measurement systems are both        
    fractions AND decimals used (for reasons of modern necessity). 


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 11
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 08:26:26 -0500
From: "mdrig" <>
Subject: Re: laughing?

A guy approached me while gassing the D yesterday, saying he hasn't seen one
that';s not all beat up (!) Asked about finding parts, saying they had first
AMC then Ford motors. I told him he was thinking of the Bricklin. Then he
said "I bet there's not a hundred of them left", saying when they were new
he thought $25000 was a lot for a car (so did I!). Then he said "I bet you
wouldn't even sell yours for that". I said, well I might consider it.
Thought he might make an offer, but he didn't.
Well, the cars do get attention!
----- Original Message -----
From: <>
To: <>
Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2001 5:42 PM
Subject: Re: [DML] laughing?

> Yeah, some people are like, "So, find any crack in the seats yet?"
> Most people don't know what really happened, and most think John DeLorean
> dead or in jail.
> John Feldman
> VIN 4275
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Before posting messages or replies, see the posting policy rules at:
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:


Message: 12
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:15:02 -0000
From: "Tyler Graves" <>

I stumbled upon an interesting page of the FAQ that seems to have all 
but disappeared.

This looks to be a very valuable resource to someone just starting 
out with their D. Was this a project page that never got finished? 
The rest of the FAQ is also invaluable, BTW :-)



Message: 13
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:57:21 -0000
From: "Tyler Graves" <>
Subject: Re: How is he a failure???

> my dads Explorer dropped its tranny 50,000 miles into its life. (I 
> Fords by the way) 

Thank you.

>(Even in my own thinks his fords are better runners than 
> well kept D)

Perhaps I should pull up in my '81 D and have your dad compare 
his '81 Ford with it. Oh, he probably doesn't have that anymore... 
wonder why?

Might I also add, most everyone that I mention my D to has said 
something along the line of "can you imagine what his cars would be 
like if he was still making them today?". I can imagine. I can also 
imagine that I would have two of them in the driveway.

2 cents