From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 460
Date: Saturday, March 17, 2001 4:49 AM

Before posting messages or replies, see the posting policy rules at:
www.dmcnews.com/Admin/rules.html

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com

There are 24 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Vanity Plate Ideas
From: lovdmc12_at_dml_aol.com

2. Re: Door alignment
From: CBL302_at_dml_msn.com

3. Re: Door alignment
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

4. MODERATOR Comment on Torsion Bar Topic
From: "Dave Swingle" <dswingle_at_dml_enteract.com>

5. Re: Fuse Box Cover
From: srubano_at_dml_optonline.com

6. Re: removing fuel pump
From: Travis Graham <thgraham_at_dml_home.com>

7. Re: liability contract for shows
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

8. Re: Re: Gold DeLorean - Plus Torsion Bars
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

9. Re: Door Solenoids
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

10. Re: Vanity Plate Ideas
From: Cory Whitehead <carman_at_dml_yesic.com>

11. Re: Vanity Plate Ideas
From: "Patrick Cowan" <LilRedCivic_at_dml_cox.rr.com>

12. Re: Door Solenoids
From: "David Swingle" <dswingle_at_dml_enteract.com>

13. Fw: Gold DeLorean
From: "murrayempire" <murrayempire_at_dml_ntlworld.com>

14. Aftermarket radio wiring
From: theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com

15. First Problem!!
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_hscis.net>

16. Re: Aftermarket radio wiring
From: Les Huckins <jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net>

17. my car runs!!!! (sort of)
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com

18. Re: First Problem!!
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_sybercom.net>

19. RE: Aftermarket radio wiring
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>

20. Re: my car runs!!!! (sort of)
From: CBL302_at_dml_msn.com

21. Re: First Problem!!
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net

22. Re: my car runs!!!! (sort of)
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net

23. Renting out a DeLorean
From: "IN2TIME" <Gary_at_dml_IN2TIME.com>

24. Removing Doors-NOT
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 13:21:14 EST
From: lovdmc12_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Vanity Plate Ideas

I have found that since most people associate our cars with BTTF and that 
vanity plates relating to the movie are easier for most people to get.  I 
personally have 88 MPH for my vanity plate.  I also thought of Gigawat and 
Mrfusion.

Brian
VIN 1597



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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 20:11:47 -0000
From: CBL302_at_dml_msn.com
Subject: Re: Door alignment

I beg to differ from you,But the CORRECT answer is YES,you can remove 
the doors,(and reinstall)WITHOUT removing the Torsion bars,it IS far 
more dangerous for somebody who has never removed a torsion bar,to 
try to remove a torsion bar,just to remove the door,I have done it 
this way since 1982,and NEVER had any problems,THE main thing is to 
remove the strut and THE FOUR BOLTS ONLY(the horz.bolts) that go THRU 
THE HINDGES(the swivel part of the hindges) and Directly into the 
door DO NOT UNDER ANY CONDITION REMOVE ANY BOLTS THAT ATTACH THE 
HINDGES TO THE BLACK BODY OR THE(2) BOLTS THAT hold the torque on the 
torsion bar,You must also remove the T panel to disconnect the wiring 
harness from the door,If anybody doubts this I can post a picture in 
the files section of one of my Deloreans WITH the doors removed,and 
the struts still in place under torque.Also the door MUST BE IN THE 
FULL OPEN POSITION(SUPPORTED)to be able to remove the door. 

Claude
000570     

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., jtrealty_at_dml_w... wrote:
> The answer is NO. You MUST remove the torsion bar to remove a door. 
Be 
> very careful working around the torsion bar, see the archives and 
old 
> posts on the subject. It also isn't worth the work re-aligning the 
> door after removing. Get a string and tie the door part-way closed 
as 
> you sit on the door sill. Tape all sharp edges inside or you will 
get 
> sliced up.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757



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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:13:35 -0500
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Door alignment

Removing the torsion bar is necessary to remove the door from the door
frame.

DMC Joe

"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <dmchelp_at_dml_att.net>
Web Site: <www.deloreanservices.com>

----- Original Message -----
From: <mrvideosawyer_at_dml_netscape.net>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 10:24 PM
Subject: Re: [DML] Door alignment


> Group,
>
> Can doors be removed without taking out torsion bars??  The insides would
be easier to work on when on the bench.
>
> Jim
> Vin4149 "ELMO"






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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:04:45 -0600
From: "Dave Swingle" <dswingle_at_dml_enteract.com>
Subject: MODERATOR Comment on Torsion Bar Topic

This thread is a great example of the angst that moderators sometimes have
when a difficult topics hit the list. We have two disparate opinions on
whether doors can be removed with or without removing the torsion bars
first. Both are mechanically correct. Both processes are DANGEROUS to the
uninitiated. The moderation philosophy has been NOT to try and judge
technical merit of posts (with a few obvious exceptions), but to let the
list correct itself. This is what is going on here.

So - as always please take the time to judge for yourself whether or not you
are qualified to perform any procedure dialoged here. The moderators, the
list, and anyone else but yourself cannot be held responsible for the safety
of body parts (yours or your DeLorean's)!

Dave S ==> taking over for Mike S - he had to leave early for the weekend.




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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 18:52:45 -0000
From: srubano_at_dml_optonline.com
Subject: Re: Fuse Box Cover

It is recomended that the cover to the fuse box is left off of the 
fuse box to prevent the fuses from overheating. That's why there was 
never a need to reproduce them.

Steve

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Stian Birkeland" <dmc_norway_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I'm looking into the re-manufacture of the long-lost fusebox cover. 
> Depending on how many people that sign up for it (the more, the 
better / 
> read:cheaper) expect the price to be around 200 dollars per cover. 
Yes, I 
> know its expensive 



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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:34:37 -0600
From: Travis Graham <thgraham_at_dml_home.com>
Subject: Re: removing fuel pump

Hi Andy,

The electrical connections that you see connect to the fuel pump.  That
thing beneath the water is the pump.  I saw the same thing about a year ago
when I replaced my fuel pump.

It's easy to take out - just remove the large boot that has the fuel pump
sitting in it - it just slides off of the fuel tank (after you loosen a few
clamps of course).  Just be sure your tank is low on petrol when you do the
job, else you'll have more difficulty/frustration when you're putting the
pump back in.  Also, take care when removing the pump and note how the
baffle and pickup line inside the tank are situated - this will help when
you put it all back together.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask and I'll see if I can remember
the answer.

Good luck!
Travis

-- 



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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:12:41 -0500
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: liability contract for shows

Ryan,

There are several websits where you can download legal forms pertaining to
this subject; look for "Damage Waver".

DMC Joe

"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <dmchelp_at_dml_att.net>
Web Site: <www.deloreanservices.com>

----- Original Message -----
From: Ryan McCaffrey <ryanjm_at_dml_home.com>
To: DeLorean Mailing List <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 10:47 PM
Subject: [DML] liability contract for shows


Dear List,

Does anyone have a copy (preferably electronic) of a contract for a
show/event they've done stating that the group putting on the event is
liable for damage/theft/etc..?  I need a copy for something coming up in
May.



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Message: 8
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:12:23 -0500
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Gold DeLorean - Plus Torsion Bars

Jim,

The door torsion bars are made of stainless steel. The brown spiral lines
are a result of the Cryogenic manufacturing processing. These lines are
easily removed using a multipurpose cleaner such as Westley's Bleche-White.
Keep in mind that scratching the torsion bar with a sharp instrument could
cause the bar
to fracture.

DMC Joe

"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <dmchelp_at_dml_att.net>
Web Site: <www.deloreanservices.com>

----- Original Message -----
From: Jim Reeve <ultra_at_dml_isd.net>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 6:29 PM
Subject: [DML] Re: Gold DeLorean - Plus Torsion Bars


> Good eye seeing those sliding windows, but I dont know whats up with
> them either.
>
> Whats up with this stainless still bit?  There was a short
> discussion I brought up a few months ago about this, and I thought it
> was settled that the torsion bars were regular steel



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Message: 9
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:09:41 -0500
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Door Solenoids

Robert,

From our experience lock solenoids that are rewound using a non factory
process have an extremely high failure rate.

DMC Joe

"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <dmchelp_at_dml_att.net>
Web Site: <www.deloreanservices.com>

----- Original Message -----
From: <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 5:13 PM
Subject: [DML] Door Solenoids


> Can anyone here tell me if it is a difficult job to rewind the dooor
> solenoids? According to the Technical Library, each solenoid takes
> 70' of #20 enameled motor wire. Since chances are that I'll need to
> replace the passenger side solenoid, I was looking at this fix as a
> possible alternative.
>
> -Robert
> vin 6585





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Message: 10
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 15:15:02 -0500
From: Cory Whitehead <carman_at_dml_yesic.com>
Subject: Re: Vanity Plate Ideas

Hey all!

I got my plates in 1996 (for a car I don't even have yet!) and went through a
few different ideas with my
friendly license bureau clerk..  I finally wound up with "STNLSS".  I liked
the idea of a plate that focused
on the car, rather than the driver, and it was one of the two significant
things I could get for the car
(the other being GULWNG, of course, but already taken by a 300SL)

Now Ontario, Canada has 7 and even 8 digit plates available for the first
time.
So many possibilities.......so few cars *l*

Just wanted to put in my two cents.   Happy motoring everybody!

--Cory
'82 Toyota Supra
'89 Chevrolet Cavalier
'91 Chevrolet Cavalier
Still DeLorean Dreaming




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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 14:23:31 -0500
From: "Patrick Cowan" <LilRedCivic_at_dml_cox.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Vanity Plate Ideas

How about:

ILUSION (Illusion)
TINFOIL (remember, A '46 ford will rip through it as if it were tin foil....
BTTF)
STNLESS (stainless)
112255 (well i think i have the date right...when the clock was struck-bttf)
BLTOLTG (Bolt of Lightning)

I have a good one for a jeep.... THSSDUP (this side up!)

Patrick Cowan
LilRedCivic_at_dml_cox.rr.com



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Message: 12
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 22:40:37 -0000
From: "David Swingle" <dswingle_at_dml_enteract.com>
Subject: Re: Door Solenoids

Any idea why? Magnet wire is magnet wire. They get destroyed when the 
lock box fails.

Dave S <==happily thunking away on the second year of a home-made 
rewind job - should I be paranoid? ;-)

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> Robert,
> 
> From our experience lock solenoids that are rewound using a non 
factory
> process have an extremely high failure rate.
> 
> DMC Joe





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Message: 13
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 23:39:43 -0000
From: "murrayempire" <murrayempire_at_dml_ntlworld.com>
Subject: Fw: Gold DeLorean

I was there when the Gold DeLoreans were build at the plant in Dunmurry .
They hand picked a team of workers from the shopfloor.
A special crib was built just off the shopfloor .
A firm of security guards was employed to protect the project .
All in all it took 2 weeks to build the Gold cars.I can only remember 2 Gold
cars being make there may be have been 3 but I don't think so.
These cars were built 2 years before the plant closed down.So I don't think
they would have left Gold panels
laying around the plant for 2 years.
I was not one of the workers involved in the assembly of the Gold cars.
My wife Eileen was the person who made the Tan seats
for the Gold car.Eileen worked for a firm in Belfast called Trimtec not far
from the DeLorean plant .
They were an English firm with a base in Belfast
Eileen said there were only 5 Tan seats made for the Gold car so there was
one spare seat just in case
Anyone coming to Belfast  for Eurofest can go and see were the seats were
made but it is closed down now .
They now make windows on the site
Joe Murray Clock No.1065
The 65th. worker to be employed at the plant.
I have loads more stories like this.So see you _at_dml_the Eurofest 2001Belfast


----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_hscis.net>
To: "DeLorean" <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2001 3:20 PM
Subject: [DML] Gold DeLorean


> Re the Gold Deloreans,  about all I really know is what I READ (like
everyone else) and I have most of the books and magazines that ever referred
to the car.   From what I have gleaned from these sources, plus a couple
phone calls, it appears that the two gold versions were built and ended up
in museums.....at the time one of the articles said that it was "required"
that parts be available for all cars.  



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Message: 14
Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 00:11:27 -0000
From: theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com
Subject: Aftermarket radio wiring

I am planning to put a cd player in my D, and I was wondering if any
modifications to the radio wiring harness need to be done.  I am
planning on getting a 9 pin connector from the mid state club so I
won't have to cut anything, but I was also wondering do any
aftermarket units come with the black ground wire on
them, or will I have to cut this wire to hook up my cd player?

John Yeoman





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Message: 15
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:18:40 -0800
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_hscis.net>
Subject: First Problem!!

My first problem in four years of ownership!   Brake light stays on.  It did the same thing a couple months after I purchased the car. Fluid was down a little and I topped it off.  Light went out.  The light came on again recently.   It had 3K miles when I got it and 8k now.  Checked fluid and it was down a little.  Topped it off again...no change.  Light is on permanently now, except a few times it has flickered off for a few seconds.  No obvious leaks at wheels or master cylinder.  Peddle is still up normal height.  I have never used emergency brake.   I have been driving it (carefully) since this happened a couple months ago).  Wondering if the emergency brake lite switch could be sticking.   If so, how to get to it to check.   

Anyone, any ideas?

Murray Fisher
Vin: 05962 Lic: DMC-XII
Washington State  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 16
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 17:34:22 -0800
From: Les Huckins <jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net>
Subject: Re: Aftermarket radio wiring

Trying to visualize.  You must intend installing a radio with a CD player, is
that it?  If so, the new harness is just to keep you from cutting the D's
stock harness assembly and if that's so you're probably going to cut the new
harness in half, as they suggest, and connect to your new unit, cutting all
those wires and connecting as indicated.  Am I close?

Les

theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com wrote:

> I am planning to put a cd player in my D, and I was wondering if any
> modifications to the radio wiring harness need to be done.  I am
> planning on getting a 9 pin connector from the mid state club so I
> won't have to cut anything, but I was also wondering do any
> aftermarket units come with the black ground wire on
> them, or will I have to cut this wire to hook up my cd player?



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Message: 17
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 20:55:18 EST
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: my car runs!!!! (sort of)

hello all,

my fuel leak and fuel pump valves have been repaired, and my car starts and 
stays going now.  it idles well, and it surges up and down when cold just 
like it should.  it is still at an Amoco service station though because it's 
not running quite right.

the problem is, when you hit the accelerator about 1/2 way down, the car 
shudders and skips around, then it kind of evens itself out and runs to beat 
hell.  that's what the guys told me it does now, anyway.  it kind of acts 
like it has a turbo - it takes a bit for the engine to do what you tell it to 
do.

anyone have any thoughts on what's up?  this isn't a vacuum leak, is it?  one 
of the guys thought it could be that, but he couldn't feel any leaks.  if 
anyone has ANY ideas, they would be most appreciated.  they have been working 
with DMC Joe on it, and they're getting closer, but things aren't quite right 
yet.  if anyone can think of a possible cause, no matter how far fetched, let 
me know.  i'd like to keep the troubleshooting labor bills low!!  

thanks as always!
Andy


Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
1982 DeLorean DMC-12 VIN#11596
Fargo, ND 58102


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 18
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 21:24:52 -0500
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_sybercom.net>
Subject: Re: First Problem!!

The emergency brake light switch is attached to the handle. Remove the small
carpet piece over the handle and you should see a wire at the back end of
the handle where it attaches to the switch.

Dave Sontos
vin 02573
----- Original Message -----
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_hscis.net>
To: "DeLorean" <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2001 7:18 PM
Subject: [DML] First Problem!!


> My first problem in four years of ownership!   Brake light stays on.  



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Message: 19
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 22:41:16 -0500
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>
Subject: RE: Aftermarket radio wiring

are you just adding an after market RF modulated unit?  If so, let me know
how u make out.  I am looking to possibly do the same.  I would like to know
any details on your exp.

-----Original Message-----
From: theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com [mailto:theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2001 7:11 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Aftermarket radio wiring


I am planning to put a cd player in my D, and I was wondering if any
modifications to the radio wiring harness need to be done.  I am
planning on getting a 9 pin connector from the mid state club so I
won't have to cut anything, but I was also wondering do any
aftermarket units come with the black ground wire on
them, or will I have to cut this wire to hook up my cd player?



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Message: 20
Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 03:42:10 -0000
From: CBL302_at_dml_msn.com
Subject: Re: my car runs!!!! (sort of)

Andy,

Check your coil wire and coil(ohms check them)check the connections 
to the coil/clean them,if that does not do it,check the 
injectors,check the timing/distrubtor cap/rotor/connections,if that 
does not do it,check the fuel pressure,acculamtor,last resort it 
could be bad gas(water in the gas ect)hope this helps.

Claude
000570

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Soma576_at_dml_a... wrote:
> hello all,
> 
> my fuel leak and fuel pump valves have been repaired, and my car 
starts and 
> stays going now.  it idles well, and it surges up and down when 
cold just 
> like it should.  it is still at an Amoco service station though 
because it's 
> not running quite right.
> 



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Message: 21
Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 04:25:10 -0000
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net
Subject: Re: First Problem!!

I assume you are refering to the brake indicater light in the dash. 
There are only two reasons not counting a short to ground that it will 
light.Either low brake fluid (or a malfuntioning level switch) or the 
emergency, parking brake is on or the switch is out of adjustment 
(make sure the carpeting isn't interfering with putting the lever all 
of the way down). There is no safety switch in the hydraulic brake 
circuit to indicate a problem with the brake system. Disconnect one 
switch and see if the light goes out. If it does you found the problem 
and if it doesn't you still found it it's just the other switch.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757




--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> My first problem in four years of ownership!   Brake light stays on. 
 



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Message: 22
Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 04:30:49 -0000
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net
Subject: Re: my car runs!!!! (sort of)

Is the frequency valve buzzing like an angry hornet? It is on the 
right side valve cover and the noise it makes is very noticeable. If 
it is not buzzing then check the lambda relay. Moderate failure rate. 
The symptoms you describe seem to indicate failure of the Lambda 
system.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757




-- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Soma576_at_dml_a... wrote:
> hello all,
> 
> my fuel leak and fuel pump valves have been repaired, and my car 
starts and 
> stays going now.  it idles well, and it surges up and down when cold 
just 
> like it should.  it is still at an Amoco service station though 
because it's 
> not running quite right.
> 
> the problem is, when you hit the accelerator about 1/2 way down, the 
car 
> shudders and skips around, then it kind of evens itself out and runs 
to beat 
> hell.  that's what the guys told me it does now, anyway.  



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Message: 23
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 20:43:26 -0800
From: "IN2TIME" <Gary_at_dml_IN2TIME.com>
Subject: Renting out a DeLorean

I've just received a couple of requests for DeLorean "Rentals".  One person
is in Pittsburgh, PA and would like an automatic to drive.  The other is in
Miami Florida and just wants to thrill their son on his birthday, so they
might settle for having the owner do the driving.

Anyone near Pittsburgh or Miami that is interested can contact me for more
details/contact info. I don't want to be involved in any profits or
liability regarding these prospects - just passing on the info.

Meanwhile, I would be interested in hearing about other DML members
"DeLorean for Hire" experiences.

I've never "rented" my car out for others to drive, but Arnie Brandon, other
PNDC members and I have had our cars on display at locations like the
Washington Athletic club, the King Dome, church fund-raisers, advertising
campaigns, and at various malls. At the Seattle King Dome (now demolished) I
drove James Doohan (Scotty from Star Trek) onto the field to throw out the
first pitch for a Seattle Mariners game.

Gary(at)IN2TIME.com

Gary
#5614
www.IN2TIME.com



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Message: 24
Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 04:51:28 -0000
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net
Subject: Removing Doors-NOT

The only reason you should touch the bolts holding the doors to the 
hinges or the hinges to the body is if there was damage to a door. The 
adjustments nessesary to PROPERLY reinstall the doors is way beyond 
most people's abilities. The doors are also heavy and it is very easy 
to damage them in removing or reinstalling. To remove them just to 
work inside them is not worth the effort or the risk of damage. Unless 
someone has disturbed the door hinge adjustments they are usually 
better left alone. IMHO it is UNSAFE to remove the doors without 
releasing the torque on the torsion bars. Refer to Workshop manual 
P:02:06 Door,Left or Right Removal. You will see that it instructs you 
to remove the torsion bar in preparation to removal of the door. If 
you are not comfortable working on the torsion bars you have no 
business removing the door! Although you can remove the doors without 
touching the torsion bar sometimes there is a RIGHT way to do things 
and a wrong way, you be the judge.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757




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