From: <>
To: <>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 518
Date: Wednesday, April 25, 2001 5:14 PM

Before posting messages or replies, see the posting policy rules at:

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There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. RE: Insurance for DeLorean in NJ
From: "Kevin Abato" <>

2. Re: Tires (again, sorry)
From: "K Creason" <>

3. Re: clutch

4. Replacement tranny?

5. Re: oil filters
From: "Dan" <>

6. Re: Welding my rusted frame

7. Rough idle and hard starting.
From: "Payne" <>

8. Re: Tires (again, sorry)
From: Henry Breer <>

9. door latches
From: "Aaron King" <>

10. Re: Tires (again, sorry)

11. Re: Tires (again, sorry)

12. Re: Fuse box wire colors
From: "Walter" <>

13. Fuel System..Still
From: "Jerry Harry" <>

14. RE: door dings caused by window regulator
From: "Doc" <>

15. my first real drive (not without its problems)

16. RE: Dash Removal
From: "Fernando Dillard" <>

17. Englishtown NJ Car Show

18. Re: Tach and voltmeter needle jump
From: "DMC Joe" <>

19. Re: clutch
From: "DMC Joe" <>

20. Re:Insurance for DeLorean in NJ

21. DMC Needed for Corporate Event in NYC
From: "Dave Swingle" <>

22. oil plug
From: "Ryan Foster" <>

23. DeLorean insurance in NJ (Thanks)
From: "FARIS ASMAR" <>

24. Tire balancing

25. Re: fuel problem update

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 18:43:50 -0400
From: "Kevin Abato" <>
Subject: RE: Insurance for DeLorean in NJ

check out

Only stipulation is that you have to have a garage, and you must be 25 or
older to drive.
Car can not be used as a daily driver.

I got mine insured there for $240

[Long quote snipped by moderator]


Message: 2
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 18:19:11 -0500
From: "K Creason" <>
Subject: Re: Tires (again, sorry)

I drive the BFG Radial/TA +. I went through the same thing with my sales
person at NTB; he was very knowledgeable, knew DeLoreans and another D owner
in the Clear Lake (Alvin) area, who I've yet to track down. I would like to
speak with her-- if you're here, email me privately. You too, NASMAN.

I think it is a great tire, but I can't compare it to a Yoko for you. I went
straight from the NCT's to the BFG's this December. The BFG's are sooo much
quieter; seem to brake better, and don't have much or any roll in a
tight/fast corner on the freeway cloverleaf (like the NCT's did-- but they
were 20 years old...).
What sold me was the longer wear (I'm a daily driver), and the better aqua

When he went to order my tires he found there is a RTA and an RTA+
(Enhanced). He gave me the enhanced at the same price; plus a SCCA discount
(though I'm not a member), and told his guys in the back how to take care of
the car, including no pneumatics.


Message: 3
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 00:06:19 -0000
Subject: Re: clutch

[Moderator Note: from daily personal experience, I assure you that a properly maintained DeLorean clutch is very easy to use.  Scotty and Tyler must have defective clutches.]

If you are relatively new to driving DeLoreans, welcome to the hard 
clutch club! Both the first D I drove and my current D have rather 
hard clutches. From reading other posts, I gather that this is a 
common thing. I think it is getting easier for me to use the clutch 
because my left leg is getting stronger every time I drive it! It is 
quite a workout, especially in Boston stop and go traffic. I 
recommend putting it into neutral when at stop lights. There is also 
a clutch adjustment attachment that you can buy, but I'm not sure if 
it helps with the amount of force needed. I think it just adjusts the 


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., scottymckenzie_at_dml_a... wrote:
> The clutch is very hard to push down on my dmc-12, anyone know
> of a way to fix it, my knee is killing me !!! :-)
> Thanks In Advance


Message: 4
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 19:42:39 -0500
Subject: Replacement tranny?

I'm looking for a tranny to replace the stock DeLorean tranny with.  I've
finished up the engine swap and the car is running fine EXCEPT for the
transmission.  Has anyone swapped out the DeLorean transmission for another
transmission?  I know the Fiero has a similar design to the DeLorean and so
does the Corvair (ie being a transaxle unit)  Also Porshe but I'm trying to
keep the cost down and I don't believe Porshe has many automatic trannys
available.  Has anyone done this?

Here's the prob I'm having with the auto tranny.   Its been beefed up to
handle the extra hp of the Vortec 4.3 so its not a strength issue.  The car
runs great and shifts normal except under heavy acceleration.  If I floor
it, as it gets into the upper RPM range, it starts to slip slightly like it
is going to neutral out.  I've changed out the computer governor and its
working fine.  Anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks in advance,



Message: 5
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 00:55:07 -0000
From: "Dan" <>
Subject: Re: oil filters

You don't want your oil filter to have a check valve in the DeLorean. 
It causes higher pressures that can ruin your oil pressure sender and 
actually shorten the life of your engine.


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Ryan Foster" <westiething_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> What about AC Delco brand PF13? Do the oil filters have to have a 
> valve? Ryan vin#-16301
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at


Message: 6
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 21:12:25 EDT
Subject: Re: Welding my rusted frame

In a message dated 4/24/01 9:37:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time, writes:

<< and I twisted one of the metal
 lines at the junction. It will need replacing. I hope when I get the tank
 out, the routing of the metal line will not be to hard to reroute and
 replace. >>
GULP....uh oh...looks like another frame off resto to add to the memphis order to replace that metal fuel line, you will have to raise the 
body off the frame.  Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

<A HREF="Http://">Http://</A>


Message: 7
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 18:22:58 -0700
From: "Payne" <>
Subject: Rough idle and hard starting.

I think I've figured out part of the cause of my rough idle.  One of the
Honda techs at work said it seemed like my car may be running too rich.  The
plugs are quite black, but still look fairly new.  Should I try a new oxygen
sensor?  After I start the car in the morning it seems like it's got an
excessive amount of idle fluctuation for a while.  I've heard this is
normal, but I'm not sure to what extent.  Can running too rich ever foul the

Thanks for your help guys!



Message: 8
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 18:40:04 -0700
From: Henry Breer <>
Subject: Re: Tires (again, sorry)


Not a direct answer to your question (sorry) but a counter-question.

Which Goodyear T/A's did the tire store recommend?  As I read BFGoodrich
site, and as you stated, they don't carry the same tire in both sizes in the
Comp T/A line.  Their Comp T/A HR4 comes in the 195/60HR14 needed for the
front, but you would have to go to a 235/60VR15 in their VR4 series for the
rear.  From the pictures, they don't appear to have the same tread pattern.
And from the chart, they have different tread wear indexes.

If you go to the Radial T/A line, you can find the correct sizes in the same
tread and rubber compound, but you drop to an "S" speed rating (up to 112
mph), whereas the original NCTs had an "H" speed rating (up to 130 mph).  112
mph doesn't give much of a safety margin. The Yokohama have a "V" speed
rating (up to 149 mph)

The attraction of the Yokohama's is that you will have the same tread and
rubber compound on all 4 corners.  True, they are V rated where you only need
H rated tires for a D, but most view that as an extra margin of safety. The
'conventional wisdom' is that if you ever have to take your car to the edge
in a panic maneuver, it would be safer to have the same rubber on all 4
corners.  The original Goodyear NCT's had this.

My personal (cynical) opinion is that the profit margin is greater on the
BFG's than the Yoko's.

Hank Breer
VIN 1141


Message: 9
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 01:52:09
From: "Aaron King" <>
Subject: door latches

Hello list members,

It's me again with another problem.  This time, my passenger side door is 
being dumb.  I don't think it's closing all the way.  I looked at it 
closely, and from what I can see, the front lock is latching, but the rear 
one is not.  The door is just getting wedged closed.  I have the door guides 
on my driver's side door, but not on the passenger one.  I got some off 
ebay, but they only fit the driver's side.  The passenger door looks like 
it's shaped a bit different.  The place where the door guide goes toward the 
rear of the car seems to be curved less than the driver's side.  I checked 
and the two doors don't seem to match.  Does anyone have any suggestions for 
what I can do, or perhaps a different set of guides to order?


Aaron King
Kirkland, WA
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Message: 10
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 02:22:59 -0000
Subject: Re: Tires (again, sorry)

I can't offer any Delorean tire comparisons to the brands you
mention, but previous experience on TA's was BAD.  Horrible wear, and 
a "loose" feel. Sidewall stiffness maybe?  Anyway for the D, two
weeks ago I picked up a set of AVS's from for $393.92 
total, shipped (fedex 2-day), installed and balanced at my own 
installer.  It is a night and day difference compared with the Rikens 
that I inherited.

Austin, TX


Message: 11
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 02:26:46 -0000
Subject: Re: Tires (again, sorry)

I honestly don't know a thing about BF Groodrich tires. I've never 
even rode on a car that had them. But I can tell you what I do know 
about the Yokos, and maybe that can help you out. The Yokohama AVS 
Intermediate's are considered excellent tires in polls for 
their handling ability, and their performance. Although they usually 
get points taken off by drivers because of their life span. But, it 
should be noted that they are usually only used in applications that 
are hard on the tires. I.e. drag racing, auto crossing, etc... For the 
DeLorean application, this shouldn't be a worry.

Performance wise, the Yoko's are excellent. The warmer they are, the 
more sticky they become. It takes alot for them to lose traction. I've 
found that in my car, I am able to control quick turns, and sliding 
realativly easy with the Yokos. Granted I only have the old NCT's to 
compare to. Re-gripping the road is much easier when sliding the rear 
end around a corner vs. losing the traction to cause the slide. Even 
in summer and winter rains, the Yoko's are amazing.

For any daily driver DeLorean, they are the only tires that I would 
reccomend. Which brings me back to the subject of this posting...

Since your car will not be a daily driver, nor will it probably never 
see road conditions any harsher then a Sunday drive, you may want to 
go with the B.F. Goodrich tires. By the same token as a comparison, my 
car is a daily driver with over 10K miles on my Yokohama's, and I have 
little tread wear on the tires. But in either case, I'd choose the 
best tires for the application: Amount of use, driving habits, and 

I beleive that has sections for user comments on all 
brands and models of tires on their web site. You may find some 
reviews on other sites as well. Others will post as well, but before 
you take the advise of the tire shop, and even the DML, your best bet 
is to research everything ahead of time.

Hope this helps!

vin 6585

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., srubano_at_dml_o... wrote:
> Ok,Ok...Yes I know that this has come up a few times already. I have 
> searched the archives and found a few posts regarding what I am 
> to ask but not much to go on. I am about to buy a set of new tires. 
> know that everyone here recommends the Yoko AVS tires but every time 
> I call a tire dealership their first response is "Are you dead set 
> getting Yoko's?" and then...


Message: 12
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 21:47:37 -0400
From: "Walter" <>
Subject: Re: Fuse box wire colors

I have made similar repairs to a friend's DeLorean.  For anyone who uses
this method, I strongly suggest labeling the wires you remove from the fuse
block with numbered pieces of tape that you can buy in the electrician's
section of Home Depot, Lowe's, etc.  Label each removed wire with the number
that corresponds to the fuse number on the block.  It will help the next guy
working on it considerably.  Three spaces in this block were melted beyond
repair.  The trick is to clean or replace old fuses, especially the yellow
20 amp ones BEFORE they become a problem.  My fuse block has never melted,
but some of the fuses were getting hot.  I tried cleaning the lugs, but they
were too corroded from age to clean up property.  I ended up replacing them.
All the 20 amp fuses ran cool after that.

For those of you worried about fuse block problems, I suggest replacing your
old fuses with new ones before you have a meltdown.  As a diagnostic, before
replacing my fuses I drove around a while with the relay compartment cover
off so that I could reach back occasionally and feel if any fuses were
getting hot.  And they were!

Is anyone considering making an original looking upgraded fuse block?  So
far the only options I know of is the bypass a la carte method or buying
what John Hervey has on his web site.

Walt    Tampa, FL

-----Original Message-----
From: Jim <>

>Fuse Box help.
>    The previous owner never replaced the melted fuse box but put in line
fuses in its place and never labeled them.


Message: 13
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 22:50:28 -0500
From: "Jerry Harry" <>
Subject: Fuel System..Still

Hello List,  
Well I'm still trying to get my fuel system repaired and working.
All three of the injectors on the rider side are free flowing, lots of gas. Each will fill a quart jar in just over one minute.
So,  three new injectors from DMC Houston! Look good but same problem on all three.  This can not be a bad injectors, one maybe, 2 would be a real push but all three bad, doing the same thing as the old ones, not likely.
What goes on inside the fuel distributor?  
 Why all three on one side and the ones on the other side seem to work correctly. The three on the driver side will inject but I have to depress the air intake to get them to mist very much at all.
Pressure on the system is book perfect, System is clean and mostly new from the tank back. In tank filter is new, line filter is new, car was running , not great but ok, then just started pushing gas out the tail pipe. Can't even try to start it with these injectors pushing gas like this.  I have replaced the oil and filter to get the gas out of the oil pan and I have the injectors in glass jars to keep them from filling the pan again.
I replaced the O2 sensor in fear that the gas would have eat it up to.  
Something is really strange on those three injector lines.
Anyone have any suggestions, short of a $900.00 replacement of the fuel distributor?
Vin # 4890<br clear=all><hr>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at <a href=""></a><br></p>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 14
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 00:01:13 -0400
From: "Doc" <>
Subject: RE: door dings caused by window regulator

I have not seen any dents like you are describing on any of the Deloreans
that I have looked at. I am still using the original regulators that have
been updated with my $5.00 fix. (2 years and still going strong) I have been
inside the doors of a few Deloreans and I have never come across one that
showed any signs that the regulator was making contacted with the door. And
just another thought, the new regulators mount the same as the originals. I
am really at a loss how you are getting that dent in that location. The
glass window, keeps the regulator secure at the top and the motor is bolted
to the bottom of the door. There is only the cable housing and the
cable,(that runs inside the housing)that is located at the center of the

Robert Starling


Message: 15
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 05:11:59 -0000
Subject: my first real drive (not without its problems)

This evening was my first opportunity to get the D out and drive it 

Never having driven a DeLorean before this one, I have no frame of 
reference.  Still, it's probably not normal for the car to feel like 
it's going to shake apart if you go over 40.  My girlfriend compared 
the overall feeling to being in one of those vibrating massage 
chairs, although they can't hold a candle to my DeLorean.  The 
vibration was *very* strong (my headlight beams were wiggling like 
crazy), its frequency increased with our speed, and it sounded 
remarkably like a helicopter.

Aside from this, the car made it about 10 miles from home without 
major incident.  It was after I turned around and started heading 
back home that the engine decided to die four times:

1) Drove 40MPH for several hundred feet, came to complete stop at 
stop sign, turned left and started to accelerate, car began to 
sputter and buck.  Letting up on the accelerator or pressing it 
further didn't seem to have an effect, eventually engine died.  Car 
started up again and ran fine.

2) Slowed from 40MPH to 25MPH or so to take a left-hand curve, upon 
leaving curve car did same thing as before (sputter, buck, die).  
Again, started up like normal and ran fine.

3) Slowed from 40MPH while approaching stop sign.  By the time the 
car had come to a complete stop, the engine was dead.  No sputtering 
this time...just a quick, silent death.  Started up again and ran 

4) Slowed from 25MPH and turned left onto the road I live on.  
Accelerating out of the turn caused the same old sputtering and 
bucking, and the engine died.  Had just enough momentum built up to 
coast into my driveway.

Some more info, in case it helps:
* car is an 81, automatic, few (if any) updates, 5K miles
* Never has a problem starting (even after stalling).
* No noticeable emissions from the tailpipes, although it does smell 
strongly of fuel.
* No problems at idle, and "hunts" normally when cold.
* Something's buzzing like a mad hornet (I'm presuming it's the 
frequency valve).
* All gauges work to the best of my knowledge, and none read anything 
unusual at any point tonight.

The last time I felt a car turn into a bucking bronco on me, it was a 
problem with the auto tranny not downshifting properly on 
deceleration.  The conditions are different with the D, but the end 
result sure feels the same.  I initially though I might have gunk in 
the fuel line and it's starving the engine...but wouldn't that cause 
it to simply stall and die instead of jerking around?

Any help you can give this newbie would be greatly appreciated!

Todd Masinelli
VIN 6681


Message: 16
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 22:38:21 -0700
From: "Fernando Dillard" <>
Subject: RE: Dash Removal



What you need to remove is the binnacle. It is the part of the dash 

encloses the instrument cluster.


There are about 8 or so small (I think 7mm) bolts that you need to 

near the steering column. The binnacle will then lift out and you can 
disconnect the

two wire connectors and the speedo cable.



VIN# 10811

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Michael 


Sent: 4/24/01 3:37:46 PM 

Subject: [DML] Dash Removal

I have to change my battery light bulb in my dash...

[moderator snip]


Message: 17
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 03:06:43 EDT
Subject: Englishtown NJ Car Show

Just a reminder to those who are planning to attend.  This weekend is the 
Spring Englishtown Show and Swap Meet at Raceway Park Drag Strip in 
Englishtown, N.J.
Sunday April 29th.  Usually there is a good turnout of DeLoreans.  Hope to 
see you there!

Gary Gore
Activities Director
DeLorean Mid Atlantic
VIN 3360

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 18
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 04:43:32 -0400
From: "DMC Joe" <>
Subject: Re: Tach and voltmeter needle jump

The problem you are describing is typical of an inconsistent ground connection. Most common location is the group ground connection located on the front frame extension.

DMC Joe 

"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <>
Web Site: <>
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Mark Noeltner 
  Sent: Monday, April 23, 2001 8:33 PM
  Subject: [DML] Tach and voltmeter needle jump

  I'm hoping for a few suggestions for something that happened over the weekend.

  My wife and I were on our way to a local event on Sunday morning when
  suddenly the tachometer needle started jumping, then settle in about 1200
  RPM too high. It continued to occasionally jump, then either go back to
  normal, or back up to the same 1200 high a number of times as we drove.

  Around the same time, but NOT at exactly the same time, the voltmeter
  needle jumped a little bit. Unlike the tach it stayed at the correct level
  most of the time, then would suddenly swing wildly over a 6 or 7 volt range
  for a moment.

[moderator snip]


Message: 19
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 04:44:17 -0400
From: "DMC Joe" <>
Subject: Re: clutch

The clutch is very hard to push down on my dmc-12, anyone know
of a way to fix it, my knee is killing me !!! :-)
Thanks In Advance

If your DeLorean is still equipped with the factory installed clutch slave cylinder, replacing it with the updated replacement should make your clutch operation less strenuous. 


"We're here to help you"

DMC Help / De Lorean Services / <>
Web Site: <>
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2001 12:56 AM
  Subject: [DML] clutch

  The clutch is very hard to push down on my dmc-12, anyone know
  of a way to fix it, my knee is killing me !!! :-)
  Thanks In Advance

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 20
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 06:52:58 EDT
Subject: Re:Insurance for DeLorean in NJ

In a message dated 4/24/01 9:05:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, writes:

<< Does anybody know of ANY insurance companies that insure DeLoreans in New 
 Jersey? The gentleman who made the post above did exactly what I wish to do. 
 I'd like to have show car status on my DeLorean as well. >>

I've got mine thru State Farm in NJ.  For classic or limited production cars. 
 I had to get a professional appraisal.  I'm "required" to be in car shows a 
couple of times of year, plus my miles are a bit limited, but I live 7 
minutes from work!  So neither is a burden to me. Price isn't bad, though I 
can't recall it off the top of my head.

Wayne A. Ernst
DMCTech Group
vin 11174 in Bridgeton, NJ 


Message: 21
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 14:35:38 -0500
From: "Dave Swingle" <>
Subject: DMC Needed for Corporate Event in NYC


I received the following to post to the list. Any in the NY area - here's a
way to make back of few of your expenses on keeping the car running. I know
very few if any DMC owners will ever rent for for private use, but these
corporate deals can be lucrative and often you can drive the car for them
yourself, it may only be for display purposes.

This is all I know - please contact Christine directly for details. Please
do not reply to the list, She is not on it.

From: "Sheedy, Christine" <>

We need to rent a DeLorean It's for a company-related event.  We're doing a
sales meeting for about 150 people and the theme of the event is Back to the
Future so we wanted to look into renting the DeLorean to maximize the theme.
Any help you can give would be great.  Thanks.

Christine Sheedy

The Food Emporium
1400 Food Center Drive
Bronx, NY  10474
Phone:  (718) 862-7028
Fax:  (718) 862-7050
mobile:  (917) 295-6040  sheedyc(AT)


Message: 22
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 12:43:53
From: "Ryan Foster" <>
Subject: oil plug

what size is the oil drain plug? is it 8mm square drive?

                         Ryan- vin.#16301

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Message: 23
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 09:25:40 -0400
From: "FARIS ASMAR" <>
Subject: DeLorean insurance in NJ (Thanks)

I'd like to thank each and every one of you who responded to my posting. Now 
I actually have a selection of Insurance companies to insure my D which can 
now allow me to "shop around" for a good price. Thanks Again!!!


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Message: 24
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 13:30:57 -0000
Subject: Tire balancing

What is the difference between "On car balacing" and "off car 
balancing" besides the obvious.  I know the D needs to be balanced on 
the car, but what happens if it is not?  Will the tires wear out 


Message: 25
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2001 13:48:30 -0000
Subject: Re: fuel problem update

I am going to take a wild guess here and say during a previous repair 
someone changed the return line circuit! There should be 3 lines to 
the accumulater but none should "loop back". One line should return to 
the tank with a tee picking up the return line from the fuel 
distributer. Please check out the routing of ALL of the hoses for 
correctness. The accumulater doesn't care about the return line unless 
it is ruptured but the fuel pressure regulater can't funtion correctly 
without a return to the tank. I would have thought by now you would 
have had your hands on this area way before this! In making the most 
recent repair the mechanic may have rerouted the fuel lines.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Soma576_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Hello All,
> today i jacked up my car to check out the fuel accumulator and the 
> around it.  this is the first time i have laid eyes on it, in fact. 
 i'm very 
> paranoid about getting under a car like that, but i did it just to 


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