From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 728
Date: Thursday, October 04, 2001 2:37 AM

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There are 18 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Re: JZD's cadillac dealership
From: kkoncelik_at_dml_aol.com

2. Rims/Tires Options?
From: "Matthew P. Olans" <mpolans_at_dml_creeper.com>

3. The DeLorean experience
From: petleech_at_dml_aol.com

4. Re: FINALY this is my airbox!
From: "Flash66" <flash66_at_dml_stealthport.com>

5. Re: BTTF Pinball and Fall Tour and Radios
From: jaimie weinberg <jmacberg_at_dml_yahoo.com>

6. Re: New Owner Questions
From: deloreanss_at_dml_aol.com

7. RE: door openers
From: Darryl Tinnerstet <darryl_at_dml_techline.com>

8. Re: door openers
From: kayoong_at_dml_aol.com

9. instrument cluster lights - help!
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com

10. Re: Fw: my attitude about DeLorean (long)
From: DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com

11. RE: New Owner Questions
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

12. no start problem
From: "Palatinus, Joe" <jopalatinus_at_dml_davidson.edu>

13. Stripes for sale
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

14. steering rack question
From: johndmc57_at_dml_yahoo.com

15. Re: no start problem
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

16. New car Smell
From: "Chris Parnham" <chrisparnham_at_dml_cwcom.net>

17. Re: The DeLorean experience
From: DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com

18. hi
From: Jim Strickland <ihaveanaccount_at_dml_juno.com>





Message: 1
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 20:01:51 EDT
From: kkoncelik_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Re: JZD's cadillac dealership

The Caddilac Dealership in Cleveland was given by GM to Charles DeLorean 
(John's brother) and he is the person who I bought my car from. He is retired 
now and his son Mark who was at the Cleveland show (Johns Nephew) is now in 
charge of it.  John never owned this dealership.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 16:10:14 -0700
From: "Matthew P. Olans" <mpolans_at_dml_creeper.com>
Subject: Rims/Tires Options?

Dan,
        Right now I am running 16" front rims with 205/45 16's.  The rear's
are 17" rims wearing 245/45 17's.  Working with Dan Deutsch and Luke at Tire
Rack we found that this combination closely matches the stock wheel/tire
combination diameters, thus no need for recalibration of the
speedometer/odometer.

Hope this helps,
Matthew
VIN #10365
VIN #16816



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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 21:03:26 EDT
From: petleech_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: The DeLorean experience

Well, I've been forced to part with my 1983 DMC, it goes on Saturday and I'm 
just dreading the day it comes. On a whole, the DeLorean experience was the 
best car I've ever owned, its quirky nature became predictable, its stellar 
handling became a joy to drive, its crampt cockpit became cozy, and its 
tollbooth windows became something unique. Sure I put a ton of hours 
restoring it, and mainly I'm getting rid of it because It doesn't give any 
problems and because I'm 16 with a paranoid mother (I need a car to work on, 
I just hate it when things work pefrectly). I know I'll get another DeLorean 
some day.. the lingering question is what next? What compares to a DeLorean?



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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 21:11:48 -0400
From: "Flash66" <flash66_at_dml_stealthport.com>
Subject: Re: FINALY this is my airbox!

Yea, I'll take one too.... Nice job!

-Paul
#16811


----- Original Message -----
From: "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: [DML] FINALY this is my airbox!


> When you are in production, I think I want one.  :)
>
> Walt    Tampa, FL



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Message: 5
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 19:29:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: jaimie weinberg <jmacberg_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: BTTF Pinball and Fall Tour and Radios

as i am now fixing up my delorean i  have very little
to spend but what is the best price for the btf
pinball if i picked it up?

 
--- jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net wrote:
> I will be bringing a Back To The Future pinball
> machine to the Fall 
> Tour this year.



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Message: 6
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2001 23:22:59 EDT
From: deloreanss_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: New Owner Questions

Scott, 

Let me try to answer some of your Questions.

1) The dome light removes simply by grasping it under the driver side edge, 
pushing towards the passenger side slightly, and pulling down.
2)Information about Zilla products:  http://www.pjgrady.com/lgspec.asp?id=23
3)Actually I don't know too much about the oil pressure needle, but mine 
fluctuates with RPMs.
4)No, the engine cover is not supposed to work in this manner. Most cars when 
new had the ability to pop up on their own. I don't know how many people have 
this problem, but it is common. I have seen cars with springs attached to the 
receiving end of the cover latch, this pops it up.
5)Your dash illumination is working as planned.
6)As far as this goes, it could be a number of things, have you ever had a 
tune up? It seems like it could be a fuel mixture problem. I don't know where 
youare located, but here in Knoxville, we have a group that meets on weekends 
and fixes each others' cars. It is great to have a friend that works at a 
dealership with service bays, thanks Aaron. 

Congratulations on joining the club,
John Weaver
ETDOC
RED DMC# 10527


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 7
Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2001 21:57:39 -0700
From: Darryl Tinnerstet <darryl_at_dml_techline.com>
Subject: RE: door openers

Kayo - thank you for your response.  I would have just sent this directly to
you, but since this thread is running on the list others may be interested.
For the record, I have not sold any of my door opener kits to Rob.  I did
provide him information on how my kit works, but no pieces.  So if you saw
something there, chances are it wasn't from me.  It doesn't really matter -
as I said earlier there is no big mystery to these things.  It is just an
off-the-shelf keyless entry unit, some high quality motorized actuators,
linkage, and instructions.  Anyone with a little ingenuity could come up
with the same.  Just don't use solenoids - there is no reason to, and you're
asking for trouble if you do.

Now, as if I haven't stirred up things enough, did you know that you can
replace your expensive, troublesome door lock solenoids with inexpensive
gear driven actuators?  My car has used them for years, using the original
relay, with no problems at all.  The wiring is a little involved (4
additional common relays) but its not that difficult.

-- 
Darryl Tinnerstet
Specialty Automotive
McCleary, WA




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Message: 8
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 03:02:55 EDT
From: kayoong_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: door openers

Subj:   Re: door openers    
Date:   10/3/01 3:01:07 AM Eastern Daylight Time    
From:   Kayo Ong    
To: darryl_at_dml_techline.com 
    


Mr. Tinnerstet:

You are right ... this thread doesn't need any further entertaining as to 
which units are better.  

What I would like to bring out is that some DeLorean cars has different 
wiring.  The differences in the wiring is either by the factory or a previous 
owner's modification.

The point I am going to bring forth on this posting is that because of this 
different wiring situation, many electrical unit are not as easy as to 
install as in the "plug and play" mode, therefore many people who are not as 
handy, or has not been prepared to go beyond this "normal" installation 
procedures may find themselves in a bind or "wired for fire."

Here is a very good example. My very good friend who also has a DeLorean 
found himself in a JAM with Rob's product, the Fanzilla.  He purchased it two 
weeks ago and he tried to install it according to instructions, only to find 
that it doesn't work, no way, no how.  So, last week on Friday, my friend 
took his DeLorean to Rob to see if he can get it to work.... Rob spent a lot 
of time on his DeLorean to get it to work, as well as taken several other 
units off the shelf, thinking the unit was defective or a bad batch.  Upon 
installing these same units on other DeLoreans he had in the shop, they ALL 
worked fine. On my friends car?  The results was the same....ZERO.  

You see, Mr. Thinnerstet, this is a good point to show that if a person 
expect "plug and play" with a product, they may be in for disappointment and 
especially if they have to do more work to get the unit to work and then it 
still doesn't work. Now imagine if my friend lives in your area of Washington 
and he had to ship these units back and forth.  Forget about it!  Because of 
such unpredictable situations and to avoid getting stuck during the 
installation process, "I" would have the "proper people" to install the unit 
at their facility so if they were problem ... it could be service in "house."

BTW... Rob couldn't get the Fanzilla to work and so he replaced it with the 
original unit and refunded my friend his money, since he doesn't have the 
time.  They were there in Rob's shop from 12 noon to 6:30 PM that night and 
Rob closes at 5:30 or 6 PM.  So, you see money is not an object here with my 
friend. He like I, we just need the product to perform as designed.  Maybe, 
my friend should check with John Hervey about his fan relays units???  Unless 
you have a unit that will do the same, then I will refer him to you. 

Sorry Rob ... hope this posting doesn't dampen your sales.....

Kayo
#5508
Lic  9D NY


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 9
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 03:41:33 EDT
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: instrument cluster lights - help!

Hey guys,

i've had my dash apart recently to replace my broken temp gauge and now i 
just realized that neither of my turn signal indicators blink or light up 
(yet the lights outside work) and the light that indicates when your 
headlights are on will not illuminate either, but the high-beam indicator 
DOES light up.

all the bulbs appear ok, and they worked before i took the dash out.  i tried 
taking each one out and reinserting it but no luck... also all the other 
lights in the dash work correctly.  is there any place that these three are 
joined that might be wrong?  any clues???

thanks
Andy

Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
1982 DeLorean DMC-12 VIN#11596
Fargo, ND 58102


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 10
Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 07:58:28 -0000
From: DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com
Subject: Re: Fw: my attitude about DeLorean (long)

I agree. Even after you read all the books and articles you can find 
about the 3 DeLoreans (the man, the car, and the company), you still 
won't be able to know everything that has happened. It will always be 
an interesting read, and will always leave questions behind. There's 
no murder, no death, no kidnappings, and no violence. But it will 
always remain, in the business sense, one of the greatest mysteries 
ever.

To be perfectly honest, I feel that the British Govt. is more 
responsible for the birth of DMC, rather than it's demise. Yes they 
should have provided the export financing, yes the Thatcher/General 
Motors connection is all too convienent, and yes they could have 
carried on with the company. But still, DMC as a whole (not just JZD) 
could have pulled it off had they planed things better. Hind sight is 
20/20 is so true in this case. In most cases, they could not have 
known about what pitfalls the company would have encountered. And in 
other cases, other options just were not there for them to see.

The best example is the DEA's entrapment of JZD. What if it never 
happend? Chances are the company could have continued on. JZD just 
needed $20 down to secure future grants & loans from the British. A 
company in Washington DC had $10 to invest, and recently an article 
was auctioned off on eBay that states yet another company had $20 to 
invest! (an article from a Houston paper I believe) And if it wern't 
for Christina, he could have gotten $5 million for the apartment in 
NYC. But John snubbed these offers. Not because the drug deal was the 
easy way out, but because he honestly believed at the time that if he 
didn't coperate, his children and wife would be killed.

But, JZD and crew should have kept up more contact with the 
companies' opertaions to have better guided it. JZD got a lot of 
talent involved. Some were GM people who had been shelved or passed 
over. Good strategy, but let's face it. Most still had that "Clear 
Day" mentality when it came to their specific duties/operations. John 
DeLorean should have put his foot down when it came to some things, 
and on others someone else should have done the same for him. No one 
wanted to upset a system that helped them, even though they knew it 
was wrong. Sound familier?

In a word, DeLorean Motor Company was this big cookie jar that just 
about everyone involved has their hands in. And when it failed, and 
people wanted answers, JZD just happened to be the kid still chewing, 
with crumbs on his shirt. But, that doesn't mean he ate the most 
cookies! :)

The Bedminster Estate, and Logan MFG purchases were not the best 
ideas. Either economicly, or PR wise. But they were not as big 
contributing factors as one might expect. The company made some 
mistakes, but it is my firm belief that on Oct. 20, 1982, it was 
still self sufficent enough to have continued.

Here's an interesting insight on a rare subject about how JZD treated 
the dealer network:

"We had planned a dealer get-together at LAX. It was supposed to be a 
chance for the dealers to meet John DeLorean. The dealers were inside 
waiting for him. "He arrived and was about to go inside when a guy 
happened to pull up in a turbo-charged DeLorean. DeLorean went over 
to get a closer look. He started talking to the guy. He ended up 
spending the whole morning talking to him. Meanwhile, the DeLorean 
dealers waited and waited. It was terrible."

Now this seems like a litle thing I know. But, you have to remember 
that it those little things that add up. But on the flip-side, lets 
not forget that C.R. "Dick" Brown was out in California claiming that 
the DMC-12 should have his name on it. And that he was really the one 
who was in charge of the company. This and the fact that JZD states 
the price _at_dml_ the QAC dropped by $2,000 per car in repairs after Brown 
was fired. Not enough attention, and too many personal agendas added 
up fast.

All in all, the company had a bright future ahead that no one could 
have predicted. Lying ahead was Back to the Future, and a little know 
DeLorean venture into "High-tech wellness systems". I can only 
imagine this could have coupled the DeLorean to the fitness craze of 
the 80's.

But aside from the British Govt, DeLorean also found hurdles to jump 
right here in the good 'ol USA. After DMC collapsed, it seems that he 
had a new plan. Buy back the cars and parts from Consolidated, and 
start things over. He had reportedly 4 major investors to help him. 
One got divorced, so he did have to back out. But around this time is 
when he suddenly had to fight fraud and racketeering charges. 
Fighting these court battles diverted his attention away from new car 
plans, and drained his finacial resources.

So in the end, I guess it was a recepie that had a little bit of 
everything, from everybody that contirbuted to the demise of the 
company.

Today, I "Live the Dream" everyday. I purchased my DeLorean, and 
never looked back. While things overall may not have turned out for 
the company the way everyone wanted them to, I'm thankful that they 
turned out at all. If I was able to choose one thing for my car to 
have, just one thing. I know what it would be: That new car smell. 
That's the only thing my car doesn't have, that I wish it did. To 
open the door for the first time, pull the plastic off, and turn over 
the engine on a car with "0" miles. But it's never too late. Perhaps 
one day I'll have a D2 sitting in my garage. But then I guess the 
problem would be choosing which one to drive! ;p

-Robert
vin 6585



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Chris Parnham" <chrisparnham_at_dml_c...> wrote:
> 
>  Andy / List,
> 
>  There are lots of books, myths, rumour and legends about the whole 
DeLorean
>  story.
>  I am sure all of them have "truth" in there some where, they are 
often
>  contriductory and always give a different "spin" on events.
<SNIP>




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Message: 11
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 08:28:19 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: RE: New Owner Questions



-----Original Message-----
From: scott-c-arnold_at_dml_home.com [mailto:scott-c-arnold_at_dml_home.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2001 10:12 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] New Owner Questions


I just recently purchased my first DeLorean, #6683.  I have done 
plenty of automotive work in the past, but I still have alot to learn 
about DeLoreans.  As a new owner, I have a few hopefully simple 
questions to ask:

1)  How do you remove the dome light?


Just gently pry it out.  It is held in with spring clips.


2)  What is the best way to find out information on the Zilla products 
I keep reading about?


http://www.pjgrady.com/



3)  What should my oil pressure read?  Right now mine is reading just 
over 80, which I am betting is not normal.


Yes, or you can get a new oil pressure sender that is more accurate

http://www.midstatedmc.com/ (This link seems broken right now)



4)  In order to open the lower engine cover, you have to pull and hold 
the release lever in the car while someone else (or though creative 
use of a long stick) lifts the cover.  If you just pull and release 
the lever, the cover relatches.  Is this a stock irritation, or is it 
not working correctly?


There is a spring in the latch that can be lubricated, or replaced.


5)  How is the dash illumination supposed to work?  Here is what mine 
does:  With the ignition on, the temp and fan controls are always 
illuminated.  When I turn on the parking lights, the temp and fan 
controls dim, and the headlight and hazard light buttons illuminate, 
as does the instrument cluster.  Only the instrument cluster lighting 
is affected by the illumination brightness knob.  Is some of this not 
working correctly?  How should it work?



That sounds about right.. Most of us have removed the relay that
controls all of this and replaced it with a wire that simply lights the
lights only with when the headlights are on with a dimming resistor.
This eliminated heat damage to the panel.



6)  My car runs well enought, but it has an acceleration hesitation 
that is severe when the engine is cold, and mild when the engine is 
warm.  By hesitation, I mean opening the throttle tends to choke and 
kill the engine, rather than accelerating it.  Perhaps it just needs 
some adjustment or a tune-up?  Do DeLorean owners, either with or 
without help from various DeLorean service centers, ever get together 
and have tune-up parties?



Was the car stored?  You may have some contaminates in the fuel
system... among a dozen or so other possibilities!
There are probably some others on the list who can give you more
information on this. Your best bet is to search the list archives.

Most local clubs have "door adjustment" or technical days.  Check for a
club in your area

http://www.dmcnews.com/clubs.html





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Message: 12
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 13:26:33 -0400
From: "Palatinus, Joe" <jopalatinus_at_dml_davidson.edu>
Subject: no start problem

My 81 auto was stallling a little bit for a while, and it would take a
little while to turn over as well.  It tended to stall just sitting in the
driveway running, and somtimes it would stall even while driving, it would
be like all of the sudden the car becomes really jerky just as I am driving
at a constant speed.  I connected a jumper wire from the idle speed
microswitch to a ground, and the car seemed to run great, it did not stall
anymore.  I got a new microswitch, but the car still stalls, right now it
will not turnover. Is it possible I messed up my idle speed regulator when I
ran the car for a time with the speed microswitch jumped? any ideas or
thoughts on the subjct would be appreciated.
Thanks
Joe Palatinus
VIN 17167 6808



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Message: 13
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 13:29:03 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: Stripes for sale

The wide black stripes are now on EBAY..  

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=596118
529


-----Original Message-----
From: Marc A. Levy 
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2001 12:02 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [DML] 3 types of "pullstraps", and stuff for sale!

<SNIP>
There were also a bunch of people asking about the stripes, so I will be
putting them on EBAY sometime soon.   I had no idea there was such a
demand for them.

<SNIP>




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Message: 14
Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 18:26:36 -0000
From: johndmc57_at_dml_yahoo.com
Subject: steering rack question

I checked the past archives but I still need to know what is 
acceptable play on the left hand side tie rod that comes out of the 
steering rack. I flunked my inspection because of it.The rack arm 
allows some movement in all directions. Is this normal and if not is 
there a bushing that can be repaired to correct this. The car has 
22,000. miles on it.




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Message: 15
Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 21:56:16 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: no start problem

Sounds to me like you gave the switch a good ground - ie the switch wasn't the
problem, but the ground connection

???

Martin
#1458

"Palatinus, Joe" wrote:

>  I connected a jumper wire from the idle speed
> microswitch to a ground, and the car seemed to run great, it did not stall
> anymore.  I got a new microswitch, but the car still stalls, right now it
> will not turnover.




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Message: 16
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 23:01:59 +0100
From: "Chris Parnham" <chrisparnham_at_dml_cwcom.net>
Subject: New car Smell

It must be a lot more difficult for you guys in the states to keep the "new
car smell", because of the hotter climate, however, I find that the
particular leather treatment than many of us use over here, does make the
car smell real good..."like new".
Its called "Gliptone" leather conditioner.
Some of the Eurofest attendees bought some "specialy re-packaged"  DOC
leather care ( the back of the bottle still says Gliptone)  Does any one who
has tried it agree?

Chris P   DOC UK






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Message: 17
Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2001 22:28:21 -0000
From: DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com
Subject: Re: The DeLorean experience

While I don't want to get involved in personal matters in someone's 
life, I would really reccomend that you not sell your car if you love 
it that much. Taking my car out and about, I've run into alot of 
people who owned that one special car, and gave it up. Almost every 
one of them had some regrets about it. But all gave me the same 
advice: Never sell my car.

Unless you have a family crisis, or you genuinely are comfortable 
with parting with the car, I would advise the same. If you really 
want to keep the car, you can counter the argument. If you, or 
another is concerned with reliability or safty, pick up a beater 
Honda, or another car with a good reputation. Unless you absolutely 
have to, don't let go of your dream car unless you yourself choose to.

Are there cars that compare to a DeLorean? Not 100%. Some will have 
the feel, but not the satisfaction.

Let me put it another way. What car compares to your dream car. 
Answer: Nothing...

-Robert
vin 6585



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., petleech_at_dml_a... wrote:

> Well, I've been forced to part with my 1983 DMC, it goes on 
Saturday and I'm just dreading the day it comes.



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Message: 18
Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2001 17:22:22 -0400
From: Jim Strickland <ihaveanaccount_at_dml_juno.com>
Subject: hi

my D was previously yellow (sigh).  Where's your website?  Perhaps I can
identify it...

Jim



On Sun, 30 Sep 2001 21:11:01 -0000 "Jeff" <Gr8old1_at_dml_aol.com> writes:
> Hi everyone, i came across this photo of a yellow Delorean a couple 
> years ago and have used it as my desktop wallpaper numerous times. 

> 
> -Jeff
> Norwich, CT



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