From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 798
Date: Saturday, November 24, 2001 2:22 AM

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

There are 16 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Firing Order
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net

2. Re: Two-tone interiors.
From: "Rustproof" <Rustproof_at_dml_prodigy.net>

3. Re: Two-tone interiors answer?
From: RFLRKV_at_dml_cs.com

4. Re: Spirit of America
From: tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com

5. Re: Spirit of America
From: "Jan van de Wouw" <Jan_at_dml_vdWouw.Demon.nl>

6. Engine Running Problems
From: shain_at_dml_elecmods.com

7. Re: Two-tone interiors.
From: "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>

8. Re: Firing Order
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

9. Re: Bent
From: "Chris Parnham" <chrisparnham_at_dml_cwcom.net>

10. Re: Two-tone interiors.
From: "ACK, k." <particleman01_at_dml_yahoo.com>

11. Re: Two-tone interiors.
From: "Joseph Molino" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>

12. Sun Star Recalls?
From: "dan g." <copper_trace_at_dml_yahoo.com>

13. Re: Engine Running Problems
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com

14. Re: Engine Running Problems
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_sybercom.net>

15. RE: Re: logos & copyrights
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

16. Re: Engine Running Problems
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 04:54:33 -0000
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net
Subject: Re: Firing Order

Refer to A:01:01 and C:01:01 in the Workshop Manual for the firing 
order, cylinder numbering and ignition specifications. If the idling 
is rough but the car runs better at higher RPM's it could be an 
indication of vacuum leaks, bad ignition wires, worn spark plugs, 
dirty fuel injectors among many other things. If the firing order is 
off generally the car won't idle and runs very badly at speed and has 
no power if it will run at all. The timming could also be way off so 
that should also be checked.Before messing with the ignition system 
rule out any trouble in the fuel system. The fuel injectors should be 
removed, cleaned, and tested. For the engine to idle smoothly all of 
the injectors must be CLEAN and very close to each other re: opening 
pressure. This can only be done with an injector pressure tester which 
can clean and test the injectors. You could send them to a Delorean 
vender or find a Volvo dealer that could do it or just replace them 
(expensive). As in the other posts LIGHTLY seat the 3 brass screws 
closed, they aren't used, the idle motor controls the air not the 
screws.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757 


-- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., shain_at_dml_e... wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> After cleaning my fuel system about and replacing all the boots and 
> hoses my DeLorean runs.  But is idleing very rough.  I belive that 
the 
> firing order is off.  Can someone give me the diagram on the firing 
> order?  ALso what are the three brass screws on the maifold right 
> after the idle control.  I would liek to thank you all for helping 
me 
> with my car, and hope you guys have a nice thanksgiving.
> 
> - Shain
> #10140




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 2
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 00:18:13 -0500
From: "Rustproof" <Rustproof_at_dml_prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Two-tone interiors.

I have an 81 vin # 1559 with the two tone interior so they were doing it
before 83. I don't think it was because they were running low on interior
part selection as has been speculated. It does brighten up the interior
quite a bit as opposed to the all black look.




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 3
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 01:10:33 EST
From: RFLRKV_at_dml_cs.com
Subject: Re: Two-tone interiors answer?

   I was at Delorean Motors Center in Garden Grove last week. In the office 
was a newly apholstered seat; two tone. Perhaps this is the origin of those 
'rare' seats.
               Richard in California



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 06:22:07 -0000
From: tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com
Subject: Re: Spirit of America

Walt - I told you not to panic!  In truth, the flag on my car was 
constructed in place using self-adhesive contact paper (made from 
light weight vinyl).  I started with a shopping bag full of rolls of 
contact paper of the appropriate colors, and an idea based upon a 
painted Vector automobile from the late eighties / early nineties.  
It was painted with a stylized flag to promote the idea that it was 
an American-made super-car.  Does anybody remember those?  Scissor 
style doors, 240 mph, Keith Black aluminum V-8 engines rated at 
nearly 1000 bhp.  Sorry - I digress.  The concept was confirmed after 
the Sept. 11th tragedy ... I just had to make it happen!  The blue 
field was applied first, and then the car was covered with white.  
The red stripes were added over the white background.  The lettering 
was done professionally by Fastsigns in gold vinyl.  The stars were 
hand-cut using white contact paper, and then applied to the blue.  It 
will all come off in the next couple of weeks, due to concerns about 
the long-term effects on the 304 CRES.  It needs access to oxygen to 
promote the protective oxide layer that makes it stainless.  This is 
one of the unique features of a CRES body - you can create all kinds 
of decorations like this that can be removed easily without damaging 
the car at all.  Cool, huh?  You should see what the D looks like 
with all of the necessary markings to be a Canadian Mounted Police 
vehicle, complete with functional blue light bar.  The real Mounties 
really enjoyed it during a trip to Canada for a club rally.  Here in 
the PNDC, we know how to have fun!

Toby Peterson  VIN 2248
Winged1



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> Darn it Toby!  You have the writing style of Paul Harvey.  Always 
leave them
> wanting more; never explain everything until a commercial break.  
Okay,
> so... what is that red, white & blue stuff on your car?  




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 5
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 15:48:51 -0000
From: "Jan van de Wouw" <Jan_at_dml_vdWouw.Demon.nl>
Subject: Re: Spirit of America

--- In dmcnews, toby wrote:
> Cool, huh?  You should see what the D looks like 
> with all of the necessary markings to be a Canadian Mounted
> Police vehicle, complete with functional blue light bar.
> The real Mounties  really enjoyed it during a trip to Canada
> for a club rally.

Pictures PLEASE! Now you've got me really interested!
What did you do with the rubstrips all around?

I think this is a GREAT idea; I might try this myself too some 
time since I have access to a lettering plotter anyway...

Cheers,

Jan van de Wouw
Thinking Different...   Using a Mac...
Living the Dream...   Driving a DeLorean...

#05141 "Dagger" since Sept. 2000

--------------------------------





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 16:14:24 -0000
From: shain_at_dml_elecmods.com
Subject: Engine Running Problems

Hello,

Well my stored DeLorean is now running again after many hours of 
cleaning the fuel system.  Right now i can get the car to idle between 
1000 and 2000rpm ok.  I have been trying to run alot of fuel injection 
cleaner through it to clean all the injectors out.  The problem that i 
am having is that the car starts fine, idles ok,  but every time i go 
to rev it or increase the throttle it gets to about 4000 rpm then 
starts sputtering. But after about 10-15 mins of running it eventualy 
shuts down on it's own and can't be restarted until it sits for a 
little while.  I checked the frequency valve and it seems to be 
working ok (buzzing).  I'm having the exhaust fixed today, after the 
previous bonehead owner cut the catalytic converter off. Hopefuly that 
will keep the smell and exhaust leaks down.  Thank you for your help.

- Shain
#10140




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 7
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 11:30:40 -0500
From: "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Two-tone interiors.

> I have an 81 vin # 1559 with the two tone interior so they were doing it
> before 83.

I think the confusion here is what people mean by 'two-tone'.  I understand
that the black interior cars still had gray carpet & head liners, but they
were supposed to be a darker gray color than the gray interior cars.

The mix & match two-tone interiors of the later '83 cars had variations of
having the glove box lid not match the dash, seats not match the door
panels, etc.

I put a black headliner in my black interior car.  Yeah, it isn't original,
but the black color helps the prism in the rear view mirror work better.
Eventually I will install an electrochromatic mirror.

Walt    Tampa, FL




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 8
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 15:02:43 -0500
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Firing Order

Click on the following link for the spark plug routing diagram.
http://www.geocities.com/dmcjoe/sparkplugdiag.html

Happy Thanksgiving
DMC Joe
DeLorean Help dmchelp_at_dml_att.net
www.dmc.tv
----- Original Message -----
From: <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2001 8:42 AM
Subject: [DML] Firing Order


> Hello,
>
> After cleaning my fuel system about and replacing all the boots and
> hoses my DeLorean runs.  But is idleing very rough.  I belive that the
> firing order is off.  Can someone give me the diagram on the firing
> order?  ALso what are the three brass screws on the maifold right
> after the idle control.  I would liek to thank you all for helping me
> with my car, and hope you guys have a nice thanksgiving.
>
> - Shain
> #10140





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2001 21:36:53 -0000
From: "Chris Parnham" <chrisparnham_at_dml_cwcom.net>
Subject: Re: Bent

Willie,

My advice would be to nothing in a hurry....find the right man to sort it
out, it would be very easy to permanently make the damage worse by a less
experienced person "having a go " at it.   Find the right person, who is
good at working with stainless steel and you should be OK.

Chris P DOC UK

----- Original Message -----
From: "wmack" <wmack_at_dml_vt.edu>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2001 2:34 AM
Subject: [DML] Bent


> I have a big question.  My friend was leaving my house tonight, and he
> accidentally hit my Delorean.  He put a dent in it in the rear drivers
side
> panel, just underneath the signal marker.  My first question is what are
the
> chanses of my pulling out the dent?  And second is how do i go about
taking
> that panel off?
>
> Thanks
>   Willie
>    Vin 5043
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 13:38:47 -0800 (PST)
From: "ACK, k." <particleman01_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Two-tone interiors.

Are there any pictures of these "two-tone" interiors
on the internet? I'de like to see one.

Alec


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month.
http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 16:38:54 -0500
From: "Joseph Molino" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Re: Two-tone interiors.

I recently did my headliners in black as well.  I liked it.  What do you
mean by "prism of the rearview mirror"?

Joseph
vin 2850
----- Original Message -----
From: "Walter" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 23, 2001 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: [DML] Two-tone interiors.


> > I have an 81 vin # 1559 with the two tone interior so they were doing it
> > before 83.
>
> I think the confusion here is what people mean by 'two-tone'.  I
understand
> that the black interior cars still had gray carpet & head liners, but they
> were supposed to be a darker gray color than the gray interior cars.
>
> The mix & match two-tone interiors of the later '83 cars had variations of
> having the glove box lid not match the dash, seats not match the door
> panels, etc.
>
> I put a black headliner in my black interior car.  Yeah, it isn't
original,
> but the black color helps the prism in the rear view mirror work better.
> Eventually I will install an electrochromatic mirror.
>
> Walt    Tampa, FL
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 12
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 16:14:29 -0800 (PST)
From: "dan g." <copper_trace_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Sun Star Recalls?

Has anyone contact Sun Star to let them know that
their model has more recall worthy defective design
and parts than that of the real car? ;)

I'm just a bit dissapointed and I don't even own a
DMC-12 yet.

As soon as I got my model, the paint on the upper
front fascia flaked off (bought it from Exoticar). I
didn't even bother to do anything else. I sent it back
for an exchange.

I did notice the warper front fascia. What DMC were
these guys looking at anyway?

I have the BTTF version on order and after reading
some info and seeing pics on it, I'm wondering what
they have messed up on that one?

Geezz, and you'd think it wouldn't be too hard to make
an accurate model of a real car.

Guess I was wrong.

=====
Dan G.
87 Turbo Regal
http://entremedia.iwarp.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month.
http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 13
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 19:31:20 EST
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Engine Running Problems

Shain, You may be experiencing a hot start problem and the fuel accumulator 
isn't holding pressure on the system. Your high Idle could also be caused by 
a couple of things, the air flow meter is being closed all the way or the 
butterflies in the throttle body also may not be closing. Also make sure the 
adjustments screws for the idle speed motor isn't screwed to far in or the 
one below it.
John hervey
 http://www.specialtauto.com/



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 14
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 19:37:25 -0500
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_sybercom.net>
Subject: Re: Engine Running Problems

What is your system pressure at the fuel distributor? It sounds like a fuel
starvation problem. Did you replace the fuel filter which is located at the
left rear of the car on the inside of the frame? (You need to remove the
left rear tire to get to it.) Do yourself a favor and buy a Bosch Fuel
Injection manual. Two of them were just referenced on this list 2 or 3 days
ago.

Dave Sontos
vin 02573

----- Original Message -----
From: <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, November 23, 2001 11:14 AM
Subject: [DML] Engine Running Problems


> Hello,
>
> Well my stored DeLorean is now running again after many hours of
> cleaning the fuel system.  Right now i can get the car to idle between
> 1000 and 2000rpm ok.  I have been trying to run alot of fuel injection
> cleaner through it to clean all the injectors out.  The problem that i
> am having is that the car starts fine, idles ok,  but every time i go
> to rev it or increase the throttle it gets to about 4000 rpm then
> starts sputtering. But after about 10-15 mins of running it eventualy
> shuts down on it's own and can't be restarted until it sits for a
> little while.  I checked the frequency valve and it seems to be
> working ok (buzzing).  I'm having the exhaust fixed today, after the
> previous bonehead owner cut the catalytic converter off. Hopefuly that
> will keep the smell and exhaust leaks down.  Thank you for your help.
>
> - Shain
> #10140
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 15
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2001 22:11:50 -0500
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: RE: Re: logos & copyrights

I don't know of a "DMC-12" logo.  DMC-12 did have had a trademark
because it was a model designator, but have never seen a logo that is
"DMC-12"  The trademark on DMC-12 ran out in 1985, and has not been
re-registered.

The only 2 logos I know of related to the DeLorean are the "DMC", like
on the front grille and the "DeLorean" in the DeLorean style fonts as
seen on the rear bumper and 82/83 hoods (the stick on emblem on the left
side).


The DMC logo was officially registered THIS YEAR 9/25/2001 by Houston.
This also ran out in 1985, so was unregistered from 1985 until this
year.  Odd thing is, the actual logos are NOT exactly the same.  Not
sure what a lawyer would say about it, but the DMC logo from the early
80's may not be covered by Houston's registration. I don't know if the
laws actually cover the letters "DMC", or just the logo design.

The "DeLorean" logo has been applied for, but is still pending.  It
would seem JZD is trying to register it with his new company.  He also
tried (and failed) to register "BUSHEIDO" (recently).  Maybe this was a
possible model name for his new car, but it was denied. 


Of other interest:

"CONCOURS DELOREAN" is also now available.  DeLorean One started to
register this in 1988, but did not complete the registration.

The DeLorean Owners Association is registered.. No big surprise here,
but the attorney of record happens to be the same one who did the
registration for DeLorean One.  :)




-----Original Message-----
From: CBL302_at_dml_msn.com [mailto:CBL302_at_dml_msn.com]
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2001 1:31 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Re: logos & copyrights


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_p...> wrote:
> Houston does not own the "DeLorean" logo, they only own "DMC" logo.

Soo...What about the more important "DMC-12" Logo who owns that? Is 
that one up for grabs?



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 16
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2001 04:14:16 -0000
From: jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net
Subject: Re: Engine Running Problems

The engine will not run smoothly with a lot of fuel injector cleaner 
in the system. You really can't tell if if is running correctly until 
you use up all of the cleaner and refill the tank with 91 or higher 
octane unleaded. In the meantime it sounds like you should replace the 
fuel filter and the fuel acumulater to solve the sputtering at high 
speed and the hard hot start problems. Fuel system cleaner will 
probably not help much if the fuel injectors need to be cleaned. The 
only way I know of is to remove them and stick them in a fuel injector 
tester to clean and test them properly. Also make sure the throttle is 
returning all the way to idle and activates the idle motor micro. Make 
sure the 3 brass screws are LIGHTLY seated closed (they are top center 
rear on the air intake of the motor). A possible cause for the engine 
shutting down when heated up is a bad pick-up coil in the distributer 
(it may also be causing the sputtering).
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., shain_at_dml_e... wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Well my stored DeLorean is now running again after many hours of 
> cleaning the fuel system.  Right now i can get the car to idle 
between 
> 1000 and 2000rpm ok.  I have been trying to run alot of fuel 
injection 
> cleaner through it to clean all the injectors out.  The problem that 
i 
> am having is that the car starts fine, idles ok,  but every time i 
go 
> to rev it or increase the throttle it gets to about 4000 rpm then 
> starts sputtering. But after about 10-15 mins of running it 
eventualy 
> shuts down on it's own and can't be restarted until it sits for a 
> little while.  I checked the frequency valve and it seems to be 
> working ok (buzzing).  I'm having the exhaust fixed today, after the 
> previous bonehead owner cut the catalytic converter off. Hopefuly 
that 
> will keep the smell and exhaust leaks down.  Thank you for your 
help.
> 
> - Shain
> #10140




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/