From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1026
Date: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 1:39 PM

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

There are 14 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: heater
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com

2. Re: Exhaust manifolds removal? Are you stupid?
From: "dmcman82" <dmcman73_at_dml_hotmail.com>

3. Re: heater
From: jwit6_at_dml_cs.com

4. Re: Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com

5. Re: Exhaust manifolds removal?
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com

6. Travelling through Knoxville to Memphis
From: Aaron Posey <cadysrme_at_dml_yahoo.com>

7. fuel pump line leaks
From: billsfanmd_at_dml_aol.com

8. Final Assembly Questions
From: "georad1" <georad_at_dml_gehennatech.com>

9. Re: Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

10. Re: DMC wipers
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

11. Exhaust manifolds Studs
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

12. Re: foam gasket on blower
From: jwit6_at_dml_cs.com

13. Improved Fasteners
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

14. Re: Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>





Message: 1
Date: Mon, 13 May 2002 22:01:43 EDT
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: heater

Marvin, The mode switch and vacuum may be working but the heater resistance 
wires to the blower mortor may be bad. You can drop that down with two screws 
and check it. Also, the blower motor could be bad. There is also a circuit 
breaker in the circuit on speed 3 and 4.
John Hervey
www.specialtauto.com



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 2
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 02:05:54 -0000
From: "dmcman82" <dmcman73_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Exhaust manifolds removal? Are you stupid?

I've replaced my exhaust manifold stud/nuts with a kit that PJ Grady 
sells. I believe (someone correct me is I'm wrong) that the nuts 
that come with Rob's kit's are brass so that they do not sieze/rust 
to the the studs and will be easier to remove later on. Get the 
kit...save yourself time and a headache.

Steve

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "theshovel1224" <theshovel1224_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> Nooooo!!!!  Do NOT use stainless studs in an aluminum block!  These
> will corrode even faster than the original steel studs.  Always use
> plated fasteners when dealing with aluminum.
> 
> John Yeoman
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Mike Aninger" <mike_at_dml_n...> wrote:
> >Use stainless steel studs and nuts like
> > the other gentleman said as well as the anti-seize compound.




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 3
Date: Mon, 13 May 2002 22:20:17 EDT
From: jwit6_at_dml_cs.com
Subject: Re: heater

In a message dated 5/13/02 7:15:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com writes:

<< how do I get in there to find out if it's a broken cable to the heater or 
if that control is shot? >>

If you remove vac from the heater valve in the engine compartment, the heater 
core should receive hot coolant, and you can tell very easily once the car is 
warmed up since there should be radiant heat felt from the heater core area 
and from the lines feeding it. If the core gets hot,the doors open and close, 
and the blower motor operates and turns in the right direction, you might 
want to look for misplaced or missing foam seals on the back of the blower 
box where the air and heater cores are plumbed in. 
Jim 6147



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Mon, 13 May 2002 22:43:53 EDT
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail

Jim, 
Yes you do have to remove the fan fail module to plug in the fan fail fix 
which is now part of the Fan Fix Dual 2 x 2, but you don't have to remove the 
circuit breaker, I have wired around it so it isn't used. The light on the 
dash is now only an indication that power is going to the fans, not if there 
is a fan fail. The coolant fans failing seems to be rare. I have only sold 
two or three in three years. The car will also cool with only one fan, but it 
just takes a little longer. As far as the mention of the additional relay for 
the fail, Haven't thought of that. Good idea. I'll see if I can fit it in.
John
  

<< So you remove Fan Fail Module (191), remove the circuit breaker (193), 
double 
 up the cooling fan relays (112) one for each fan, then rely on two inline 15 
 amp fuses, one to each fan. Then you then power the fan fail light (192) 
when 
 ever the fans run. 
 
 What if only one of the fans blows the fuse, or isn't getting power? Will 
the 
 light still stay on letting you think everything is OK? 
 
 Also why not run one additional accessory relay so the light only indicates 
a 
 "fail" condition when there really is no voltage going to one of the fans?
  >>



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 5
Date: Mon, 13 May 2002 22:52:31 EDT
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Exhaust manifolds removal?

Marc, If SS bolts arn't good for the aluminum, then what would be the best. 
Just regular high grade bolts 10.9, higher than what's in the car and maby 
plate them. I have access to all the bolts and have parts plated by a shop 
close to me.  I can get 7mm bolts from full thread 12mm long to partial 
thread up to 70 mm long.
I just need to know the size needed.
John Hervey
www.specialTauto,com


<< Even if you could find 7mm Stainless studs, I don't think the aluminum 
against the SS will make for a good combo. >>



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Mon, 13 May 2002 20:27:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Aaron Posey <cadysrme_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Travelling through Knoxville to Memphis


Group-

Yet another reminder to everyone that will be, or could be, travelling through Knoxville, TN on the way to Memphis.  I have a hotel set up to accomodate us travelling to Memphis.  

Sleep Inn
865 531 5900

When calling, mention you are with the East Tennessee DeLorean owners group in order to get the group rate of $58.50.  The night I have set up is for Wednesday, June 12.  If you are returning home on the following Sunday and would like to use the same accomodations, just tell them and you can get the same group rate.  

Anyone needing directions may ask them, or email me.  The hotel is just of I-40 on the west side of Knoxville.  The more the better.  Once everyone gets settled in, perhaps we can grab some food and beverage. This will also make for a larger caravan headed across the state- how cool is that??

Regards-

Aaron Posey

A side note to Walt-  I was the winning bidder on the Dealer Sign!  



---------------------------------
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 7
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 00:15:29 EDT
From: billsfanmd_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: fuel pump line leaks

Okay, me and a fellow list member have just about totally redone my car 
cosmetically and replaced much of the fuel and ignition systems. Everything 
is now working great and just when i was ready to smash a bottle of Boones 
Farm over the front of the car i found a small problem (if there is such a 
thing as a small problem) 
I am now getting a leak where one of my fuel pump hoses (the main line not 
the return) where the fuel pump hose meets the metal fuel line of the car. I 
have the brass fitting from Grady and thought the connection was as tight as 
humanly possible but i am now getting a pretty good leak when i started the 
car. It really appears the leak is coming from the "olive" type nut on the 
car and not on the brass nut on the replacement hose.

Any thoughts? that metal fuel line with the olive or nipple end disappears 
into the frame of the car and is not accessible. Although I am now attempted 
to gently search for the end of that line with my sledge hammer....I am 
thinking of starting over aand backing the hose all the way off and 
inspecting the car fuel line fitting...and maybe using teflon tape on the 
threads of the hose???....If this is too confusing then email me privatelly 
at Billsfanmd_at_dml_aol.com. 

Whoever designed this fuel hose system &^%$# ....I would just like to weld 
the entire hose to the fuel line than worry each day that a leak has returned 
becasue a thread is a millionth of an inch loose....Anybody have this problem 
and how did you solve it?

Thanks

Mike in Baltimore
2109

  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 8
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 04:56:51 -0000
From: "georad1" <georad_at_dml_gehennatech.com>
Subject: Final Assembly Questions

Hello group,

Well finally, after damn near a year of work #2196 is almost done and ready to run. All I have left to do to get her running is to install my new braided fuel lines. My first question is, What should I torque the fuel line bolts to? My second question is, Where does the hose on the top of the warm up regulator go to? I can't remember it connecting to anything. After I get her running properly (the whole fuel system is now new) all I have left to do is to replace the rotors, pads and axle boots. The rest is pretty much cosmetic.

Thanks,

George




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 09:00:27 -0400
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail

You said :
        ".........Also why not run one additional accessory relay so the
light only indicates a "fail" condition when there really is no voltage
going to one of the fans?.."

There is a device that does all of the above and more; it's called
"Fanzilla"!

DMC Joe
Tech Information, DMC Joe Help Club, & Store
"Summer Parts Sale"
http://shopping.oraclesmallbusiness.com/dsvstore
DeLorean Website Directory www.dmc.tv

----- Original Message -----
From: <jwit6_at_dml_cs.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 1:46 PM
Subject: Re: [DML] Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail


> In a message dated 5/13/02 10:36:09 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
> writes:
>
> << it eliminates the Fan fail module, the pesky circuit breaker that is
> clicking on and off and runs each fan on it own 40 amp relay, we also give
> you dash indication when your getting power.  >>
>
> So you remove Fan Fail Module (191), remove the circuit breaker (193),
double
> up the cooling fan relays (112) one for each fan, then rely on two inline
15
> amp fuses, one to each fan. Then you then power the fan fail light (192)
when
> ever the fans run.
>
> What if only one of the fans blows the fuse, or isn't getting power? Will
the
> light still stay on letting you think everything is OK?
>
> Also why not run one additional accessory relay so the light only
indicates a
> "fail" condition when there really is no voltage going to one of the fans?
>
> Jim 6147





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 08:55:04 -0400
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: DMC wipers

The Bosh number is 40920. The Bosh blades are available from DeLorean
Services and PJ Grady as part# 100809G $12.45.

DMC Joe
Tech Information, DMC Joe Help Club, & Store
"Summer Parts Sale"
http://shopping.oraclesmallbusiness.com/dsvstore
DeLorean Website Directory www.dmc.tv

----- Original Message -----
From: "Christopher M. Hawes" <chris_at_dml_hawes74.freeserve.co.uk>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 6:13 PM
Subject: [DML] DMC wipers


> I am trying to find replace Bosch wipers, does anyone know the spec for
> them?
>
> Chris
> vin 5255
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 09:20:34 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: Exhaust manifolds Studs

You may want to talk to Toby about the studs/bolts. I am not sure what the optimum material and coating would be.

This is one project I did with little research, I just purchased the parts I needed from PJ Grady.   Like I said before, I think it was CAD plated steel.. Probably 8.8

I don't think 10.9 would be good, because if a stud did break it would make it more difficult to remove.  I could be wrong.

It would be nice to have some material that does not rust.  I think use of never-seize is an acceptable solution to make sure that in another 20 years when we have to do this job again it goes easier, but aesthetically I don't like to see rust!  So, the only problem here that may need solving (I don't know if or when the new studs will rust) is how it looks.  Maybe someone who did this job a few years back can see how their studs and nuts look now?


> -----Original Message-----
> From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com [mailto:dherv10_at_dml_aol.com]
> Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 10:53 PM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [DML] Exhaust manifolds removal?
> 
> 
> Marc, If SS bolts arn't good for the aluminum, then what 
> would be the best. 
> Just regular high grade bolts 10.9, higher than what's in the 
> car and maby 
> plate them. I have access to all the bolts and have parts 
> plated by a shop 
> close to me.  I can get 7mm bolts from full thread 12mm long 
> to partial 
> thread up to 70 mm long.
> I just need to know the size needed.
 



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 12
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 10:47:30 EDT
From: jwit6_at_dml_cs.com
Subject: Re: foam gasket on blower

In a message dated 5/13/02 10:38:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
dmc4687_at_dml_mindspring.com writes:

<< It works fine... maybe a little less air pressure. why?
  >>
Probably the foam seals on the back of the heater/air box housing under the 
pass side dash. Mine did the same thing. Look for them to be missing or not 
properly sealed. You can't see them but you can feel the escaping air from 
the blower and the out of place/loose gasket if you feel up there with your 
hand.

Run the blower and start looking for air escaping from anything other than 
one of the actual vents.
Jim 6147 



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 13
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 11:12:58 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: Improved Fasteners

If we want to talk about improved fasteners, I found a place that will make Stainless Steel rivnuts.

True, the aluminum does not rust- but to use a stainless steel bolt in the aluminum rivnut will cause problems.  (I am doing this anyway, with tons of never-seize).

The problem is they are about $3.00 each, with a minimum order of 500 (for each size).  Frankly, I don't have $4500 laying around to buy 1500 rivnuts when I only need a dozen or so..  And, I doubt the average person will pay $3.00 for a rivnut (for me to resell in order to recoup the money).

Maybe someone has a cheaper source?

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marc A. Levy 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 9:21 AM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [DML] Exhaust manifolds Studs
> 
> 
> You may want to talk to Toby about the studs/bolts. I am not 
> sure what the optimum material and coating would be.
<SNIP>
> 



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 14
Date: Tue, 14 May 2002 16:59:07 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Fan Fail Light Without Actual Fan Fail

Well, seeing as the subject came up :-)

The problem with all the systems described EXCEPT the Fanzilla (to my 
knowledge - I have never seen one much less taken it apart) is that the 
fain fail light can only tell you when the voltage is going to the fans, 
or when the fans should be on, or when there's an imbalance between the 
fans. None of these solutions actually "know" when a fan is or is not 
drawing current when it should. The only way to do this efficiently is 
with a hall effect sensor - the original fan fail module did it this 
way, but only comparing one fan to the other, and it was appallingly made.

I have been asked about the progress of my little project to make a fan 
sequencer and restore the fan-fail light functionality. I've been really 
busy the past month - 2 weeks filming a TV show in Glasgow (nothing to 
do with DeLoreans), and two joyful weeks of good weather with my 
DeLorean parked outside, so every evening was spent working on it, and 
not sweating over a hot soldering iron! However, as members of the 
dmc_electrics list know, I did produce a design. I found some truly 
fantastic IC's made by Philips which are BUK202-50X 20A high-side 
switches with status pin. They make it possible to build a completely 
solid-state fan sequencer from fewer than 20 components, which gives a 
genuine "fan fail" signal. Here's the design

http://www.delorean.co.uk/electronics/fandelay2.jpg

A drives the fan, B drives the fan-fail light. Two of these circuits 
need to be built, one per fan. R3 sets the delay. For those who are 
comfortable with data sheets, I've put it here

http://www.cix.co.uk/~mgutkowski/20A_switch.pdf

The BUK203 is exactly the same, but will only drive 4A and is cheaper, 
so ideal for the fan fail light. This device has open and short circuit 
detection, overheat protection (negating the need for a fuse) and under 
all these failure conditions, will light the fan-fail light.

NB I have NOT tested this yet, but as the subject came up.... :-)

Martin
#1458

DMC Joe wrote:

>You said :
>        ".........Also why not run one additional accessory relay so the
>light only indicates a "fail" condition when there really is no voltage
>going to one of the fans?.."
>
>There is a device that does all of the above and more; it's called
>"Fanzilla"!
>
>DMC Joe
>Tech Information, DMC Joe Help Club, & Store
>





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/