From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1042
Date: Saturday, May 25, 2002 8:04 AM

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There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: If of a nervous disposition move to your next message!!!
From: BondAtomic_at_dml_aol.com

2. Re: Overheating Fuel Tank. (Long!)
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

3. Re: Anyone Heard News on the New DeLorean?
From: "fivetwofive" <CBL302_at_dml_msn.com>

4. Re: Overheating Fuel Tank. (Long!)
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>

5. Re: Alignment problems?
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

6. Re: help! door jamming...
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>

7. Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN
From: "janvdwouw" <jvdwouw_at_dml_home.nl>

8. Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN
From: "Joseph Molino" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>

9. Many thanks-- was (nervous disposition)
From: "foxmul2001" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>

10. Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN
From: Steve Stankiewicz <protodelorean_at_dml_yahoo.com>

11. Re: Clunk (not TAB or axles)
From: "jangwin" <jeff_at_dml_coware.com>

12. odd question
From: "Marvin" <marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com>

13. Help.....Car Won't Start
From: "Bob Thomason" <rdt7_at_dml_carolina.rr.com>

14. 1981 DeLorean for sale
From: "Jonny's Account" <jxace_at_dml_adelphia.net>

15. Re: Help.....Car Won't Start
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

16. Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN
From: "janvdwouw" <jvdwouw_at_dml_home.nl>

17. idle speed switch
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com

18. Re: Help.....Car Won't Start
From: "rdthomason28209" <rdt7_at_dml_carolina.rr.com>

19. Re: idle speed switch
From: "shainbrannan" <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>

20. Re: Help.....Car Won't Start
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com

21. Engine Horsepower
From: "Randy Stribling" <estribl1_at_dml_tampabay.rr.com>

22. Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>

23. RE:Re: Help.....Car Won't Start
From: "Mike Substelny" <msubstel_at_dml_lorainccc.edu>

24. rear drive axle question
From: "john572905" <jrc2905_at_dml_aol.com>

25. Re: radio bezel/blower repair
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 00:03:43 EDT
From: BondAtomic_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: If of a nervous disposition move to your next message!!!

I cried at that site. Not just the DMC, but the M3, the Viper, and all of the 
other cars on that site. I am just glad to hear the DMC is back up.

John
VIN 4275


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 04:06:27 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Overheating Fuel Tank. (Long!)

Other sources of heat that are overlooked are the fuel pump and the 
fuel pressure regulater. Much of the fuel pushed to the motor is 
returned to the tank by the regulater but the process adds heat to  
the fuel besides it is also running past that hot motor so it is in 
effect cooling the mixture unit too by carrying heat away from it to 
the tank. If hot fuel is a real problem then the ultimate fix is going 
to be a heat exchanger on the fuel return line to keep the heat of the 
motor from getting into the tank.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_l...> wrote:
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> <SNIP>
> > The best cure, obviously, is to keep the fuel cool.  The easiest 
> place to
> > start is reducing the heat transfer from the coolant pipes.  As 
> you may
> > already know, aluminum is an excellent conductor of heat.  And 
> there isn't
> > much room for insulation between the pipes & the fuel tank.  I 
> suggested
> 




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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 05:54:51 -0000
From: "fivetwofive" <CBL302_at_dml_msn.com>
Subject: Re: Anyone Heard News on the New DeLorean?

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "spaceace3113" <spaceace3113_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> i havent heard anything past the watch deal and those quick time 
> videos JZD did last year...

On that note,Has anyone bought any of those watches,and if so what 
did you think of the watch in general,after recieving/using it for a 
while,was it junk,or treasure.Or are you Still waiting for it!!(Like 
the new "Delorean")

Claude
00570




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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 23 May 2002 23:28:45 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Overheating Fuel Tank. (Long!)

> I really don't want to replace the existing aluminium
> pipes with rubber hoses. This just worrys me in as it's two more
> items that I have to worry about rotting/replacing in the years to
> come.

You are underestimating the quality of modern silicone hoses.  I have read
accounts of police departments equipping all of their patrol cars with
silicone hoses and not ever having a failure in any of them.  Hey, I saw it
on the internet, so it must be true.  :-)

> I'm currently working on a way
> to not only remove the spring from the equasion, but the entire
> pickup hose as well.

That may be well and good, but unless you are installing a wert cooler (from
beer brewing fame) or a second fuel pump in series, it probably won't be any
better than the OEM suction hose & baffle.

> 2. The coolant pipes on both sides of the radiator are transferring
> heat thru the fuel. Gasoline is absorbing heat from the source
> pipe, it then travels thru, and is reabsorbed by the cooler return
> pipe.

I see your point, but I disagree.  Until the fuel temperature is equal to
the coolant temperature, the net effect is that both pipes are going to heat
the fuel.  And if the fuel temperature ever reached the coolant temperature
on a hot day, then fuel pump noises will be the least of your worries.

> Does heat directly transfer from the water pipe into the
> gastank? Or, is the heat absorbed thru the plate below
> protecting the gas tank?

This is an interesting thought, but again I disagree.  Look at the big
picture: surface area.  There is more tank surface area in proximity to the
pipes than there is pipes to cover plate.  And there is way more tank
surface area in proximity to the cover plate.  Hence, the plate probably
draws more heat from the tank than it puts into it.

[concerning heat sink compound]
> Don't laugh just yet, that may just be the thing we need. I don't
> know how we could attach fins to the bottom plate, but it should
> do the trick to rid the tank of excess heat. The only question I
> would have is how well does the compound adhere to things?

It doesn't.  It is typically a thick viscous (and messy) white paste.  When
I removed the fuel tank from my car, I discovered a triangle-shaped piece of
black cloth between it and the cover plate.  Since my TankZilla leaked fuel
all over, this cloth was rotten.  When I put it all back together, I stuck a
sheet of gasket paper in there to make up for leaving the original out.  I
can't say what the purpose is other than maybe to stop the tank from
chaffing against the plate.

> I don't think that a fuel radiator of any sort sould be nessiasry at
> all. <snip>
> Rather than trying to keep hot
> fuel cool, let's keep the fuel from getting hot at all, and use the
> heat sink on the bottom to rid the gas of any stray heat that may
> have entered.

I like your enthusiasm, but I think you are jumping to conclusions.  A heat
sink is a heat sink.  As long as it transfers heat away from the fuel, it
doesn't matter where in the system it is.  The fuel tank itself is not a
good conductor of heat, and anything next to it is not going to transfer
heat well (coolant pipes excepted because of the extreme temperature
gradient).  If you want to make it into a good heatsink then replace it with
a metal tank.  The extreme of this idea is to make the fuel tank into a Ford
Pinto's trunk turned upside down.  Make the cover plate the bottom of the
fuel tank.  Put ridges in it, and it will probably make an effective heat
sink.  But it would be a lot easier to plumb in a fuel radiator.

> Although if we insulate the water pipes, and
> remove the pickup hose to kill the noise, we may not even need
> to go to that far of an extreme with the bottom plate.

I am certain that the problem is not the pickup hose.  The noise comes from
fuel boiling in the pump similar to fuel boiling in the engine compartment
causing a hot start problem.

Hot & under pressure = stable.
Hot & at atmospheric pressure in engine compartment = vapor lock hot start
problem.
Hot & under vacuum inside fuel pump = cavitation / vapor lock boiling fuel.

Now for some late breaking news:
My thermostat was sticking closed (or mostly closed) which on hot days
caused the temperature indicator to normally hover just below the center
(220F) mark (too hot).  Now with the new thermostat from PJ Grady installed,
it hovers around 1/4 scale.  Lower coolant temperature means that heat
transfers to the fuel tank at a slower rate which means that I can do a lot
more driving before the fuel pump cavitates.  In fact, I have done a lot of
driving since with a near empty tank on hot days with no more cavitation
noises at all!  But time will tell.  The weather has cooled off a little
lately.  How hot does your engine normally run?

Again, my strategy is to some day install a fuel radiator.  If there is some
radiator air flowing over the top of the fuel tank, then perhaps this would
be good location for a fuel radiator.  It has air circulation and is a
relatively secure spot, albeit cramped.  If that don't cure it or if I feel
I need larger coolant pipes due to an engine swap (ala Bob Brandys) then
I'll make a stainless fuel tank with more room for the pipes & insulation.

Walt






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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 04:00:23 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Alignment problems?

Don't forget the ride height also affects these specs. If the height 
has been changed or the springs are weak it will throw these specs 
off. Another reason for checking alignment is to check for damaged, 
worn, bent parts. If the shop is any good at all they will check the 
suspension parts before attempting to align the car as is is 
impossible to properly set the alignment with worn, bent parts. If the 
shop couldn't set the rear then get in your car and RUN as any good 
shop with a 4 wheel machine should have no problem as long as they 
have the specs. Even if the machine doesn't have the specs in it's 
database most alignment machines have a way for the operater to enter 
"Custom" specs so it can be done manually (if they know what they are 
doing!).. It is possible to set "unadjustable" settings with shims and 
washers but that assumes the tech knows what he is doing! BTW if it is 
neseccary to start shimming then something is bent! A properly set up 
car will not only have tires that will wear evenly but the ride is 
MUCH more enjoyable, the car won't tend to wander, the steering wheel 
will return nicely, the steering wheel will be straight ahead when 
going straight. A Delorean properly set up tends to go where you point 
it and won't wander. When you accelerate it should go straight without 
any hint of torque steer. Find a shop that does the local police cars 
and ambulances, they usually have techs that know what they are doing 
as the police like to have cars that go straight!
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "tmpintnl" <tobyp_at_dml_k...> wrote:
> This is great information for everybody's benefit.  The neutral 
> position of the front wheels (no toe in) will make the car somewhat 
> "twitchy" and directionally unstable.  The condition can also cause 
> resonant wheel shimmy at certain speeds.  The positive toe-in is 
> important for these purposes, among many.  (As an aside, all modern 
> jet aircraft have the engines toed in approximately two degrees for 
> the same reasons).  The front caster *can* be adjusted by 
appropriate 
> placement of shims in the joint between the front sway bar and the 
> lower control arm, although this is not mentioned in the manuals.  A 
> caster difference between the two front wheels will have a negative 
> effect on steering stability as well.  As noted, camber is not 
> adjustable unless you have custom suspension links that are made to 
be 





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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 01:23:40 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: help! door jamming...

> The trouble is when the car is left locked on a hill (my
> driveway is uphill) for a period of time, or after driving around a
> few bends, and you try to unlock it again, it will be stuck!
> Sometimes taking another fast bend either to the left or the right
> will free it up again, other times the passenger has to bang on the
> top of the inside of the windowsill, and it will free back up again
> after a minute.

John,

Read post I did recently subject, "Unsticking a stuck door".  If the
exterior door handle cable is adjusted such that it leaves tension on either
door latch, then that latch will not unlock, period.  This sounds like it
could be your problem.  Otherwise check to make sure that none of the
lock/unlock rods or bell cranks are dragging on anything.  In my drivers
door, for example, the bell crank coming off of the lock solenoid was
dragging on the inner door stainless causing an intermittent unlock fail;
though, it would always lock easily.  A few smart blows with a chisel &
hammer pushed the metal out of the way.

Walt




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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 08:06:37 -0000
From: "janvdwouw" <jvdwouw_at_dml_home.nl>
Subject: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN

Well, it's happened to me AGAIN; this is the 4th time 
in 12 months (with 3 months storage due to an accident) 
that my speedo drive gave up on me.
It only just happened, so I haven't determined yet WHAT 
it broke down, but I suspect it's the Angle yet again...

Anyway, I'm planning on building a sort of backup myself now, 
since the rumoured digital solution by DMC Texas doesn't
seem to come out any time soon (or will it? James?).

What I need to know for my idea is if the RIGHT-hand Spindle 
has the hole drilled through it too, just like the LH-side.
If I take a look at the DMC website, there's only a picture
of the RH spindle, WITH a hole in it.

If anyone can advise me of this before sunday, 
I'd appreciate it very much.
I guess I'm going to have to spend time I don't have 
on fixing this again anyway, since I DO NEED to have 
a working speedo for the annual inspection. 
On top of that my otterstat got stuck in the closed position,
causing my fans to run all the time, which in turn caused
several of my control-panel lights to burn out :-((

Jan van de Wouw
Thinking Different...   Using a Mac...
Living the Dream...   Driving a DeLorean...

#05141 "Dagger" since Sept. 2000

--------------------------------




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Message: 8
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 07:18:08 -0400
From: "Joseph Molino" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN

Once you buy a PJ Grady High-end angle-drive that is rebuilt using heavier
parts, doesn't  he guarantee his parts for life?  I don't know.  I had my
angle drive rebuilt by him and it has been 2 years now.


Joseph Molino
vin 2850
----- Original Message -----
From: "janvdwouw" <jvdwouw_at_dml_home.nl>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, May 24, 2002 4:06 AM
Subject: [DML] Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN


> Well, it's happened to me AGAIN; this is the 4th time
> in 12 months (with 3 months storage due to an accident)
> that my speedo drive gave up on me.
> It only just happened, so I haven't determined yet WHAT
> it broke down, but I suspect it's the Angle yet again...
> Jan van de Wouw
> Thinking Different...   Using a Mac...
> Living the Dream...   Driving a DeLorean...
>
> #05141 "Dagger" since Sept. 2000



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Message: 9
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 11:28:54 -0000
From: "foxmul2001" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Many thanks-- was (nervous disposition)

Hey all I didn't plug anybody but I should have.
It's 100 % true.  Bob Miller came up all the way from North Carolina 
and sold me an excellent passenger side door and he gave me the 
fiberglass donor part (the one with the latch part on the front side 
that was wrecked).  He helped me install  the door and has been there 
offering great advice and parts whenever I needed it.  For anyone 
that is near him, feel free to give him a call.  He was the one 
who "treated" my car (just like an ambulance EMT treats an accident 
victim) and got my car running so I could have her transported to and 
from PJ Grady and Specialized Auto Repair in Chatham, NJ.  He has 
many hard to find parts but be prepared to pay Fair market value for 
them as Bob needs to pay his mortgage like the rest of us.  He is 
definitely my #1 Delorean guy.  His prices are better than most 
vendors and he sold me an upgraded alternator with excellent 
instructions too.  Thanks BOB.
 
Remember Bob Miller & Sons Automotive in North Carolina.

Thanks to anyone else I may have forgotten.
Joseph Molino
vin 2850




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Message: 10
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 06:10:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steve Stankiewicz <protodelorean_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN


Jan, I'm pretty sure there's no hole in the passenger
side spindle.  (I just checked my website, but none of
the shots were close enough)  However, since the shaft
is a separate part, it MAY be possible to switch sides
with the shafts.  (Anyone had their spindles apart
want to comment?)

Steve

=====
Steve

VIN 2650 ("Project Delorean")
www.angelfire.com/md2/projectdelorean

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
http://launch.yahoo.com



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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 16:57:58 -0000
From: "jangwin" <jeff_at_dml_coware.com>
Subject: Re: Clunk (not TAB or axles)



I remember that there was a discussion about this late last year.
DMCVegas at that time had kindly listed the location of all of the
body bolts. Check out post number 20574. It's all there!
 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/message/20574


That said, I took the opportunity last night to tighten the 4 easy
ones. It seems I need to do that every 6 months or so. To get to the
two in front, simply open the trunk, and remove the carpet. You will
see two 17mm bolts resessed on either side of the spare tire. In the
rear, one is directly underneath the coil cover. You will need to
remove the cover to gain access. The fourth bolt is on the far left
(drivers side) towards the rear of the engine compartment (front of
the car) It doubles duty by holding down a stabalizing bar. It should
be just about the only 17 mm bolt in the vicinity.

Jeff Angwin
VIN 3034



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_f...> wrote:
> Joe,
> 
> How many of these bolts are there? Where are they located? What needs to
> be moved (or removed) to get to them?
> 
> -Christian
> 





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Message: 12
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 17:23:34 -0400
From: "Marvin" <marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com>
Subject: odd question

I was delighted to see someone else asking a question that I thought was too
strange to ask - how to move the steering wheel forward and back. I also
have had DeLoreans for over 15 years and had no idea the wheel moved in
those directions. When I get home, I'm going to try it out!
Marv.
# 17707

Marvin Stein
Printed Drinkware Company
924 Dundas Street
London, Ontario, Canada N5W 3A1
website: printeddrinkware.com
email: marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com
tel:  519-434-1666
fax: 519-434-7071




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Message: 13
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 17:52:04 -0400
From: "Bob Thomason" <rdt7_at_dml_carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Help.....Car Won't Start

I'm still new to my car and it seems to have some sort of electrical bug that has now prevented it from starting. I drive this car daily but sometimes the battery goes dead undetermined reasons. Not often, just occasionally. 

Got in it this afternoon and battery was dead. Tried a jump which has worked in the past but engine would not budge. Got a normal voltage reading on the dash meter and radio, etc. worked. Engine just wouldn't turn over.  Let jumper cables stay attached while other car kept running for a while to charge battery----no luck. What could be keeping the engine from turning over??

Only other clue is that the car was having a very slight difficultly starting in recent days. Like it didn't want to fire. Previously it would just start right up.

I also have a Code Alert alarm system. I don't know if it's connected to the ignition in any way. Normally what happens is when I connect jumper cables, the alarm goes off. I hit the disarm button on the remote and start the car. Only this time it wouldn't turn over. 

All suggestions appreciated. 

Bob Thomason
#5252






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 14
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 18:29:39 -0400
From: "Jonny's Account" <jxace_at_dml_adelphia.net>
Subject: 1981 DeLorean for sale

For reasons beyond my control I am forced to sell my beloved DeLorean.  I
have tried to figure multiple ways for me to keep it, but to no avail.  It
is a 1981, grooves/no gas flap, 5 speed, gray leather, with 33,3XX miles on
it.  It is always garaged.  It runs perfectly and all updates have been
performed.  I am asking $14,900.  Please go to:

http://home.adelphia.net/~jxace/

for a more detailed description with lots of pictures.

Jonathan Lazar
jxace_at_dml_adelphia.net
(678) 852 4954





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Message: 15
Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 00:10:25 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Help.....Car Won't Start

Hi Bob

First off from your VIN number, you should have had the starter relay fix - but it's worth checking. This supplies power to the solenoid. Details on the DMCnews tech section.

From your description it sounds like it's to do with your alarm. I've recently fitted a remote started to my car and helped Paul Salsbury with fitting the same system to his car - and he had an immobiliser fitted when he bought the car. Many aftermarket alarm systems are triggered by changes in system voltage - hence the jump-leads causing the alarm to go off. This can include
locks being triggered, interior lights coming on etc etc.

I am unsure how to proceed with this post because what I've learnt fitting my system taught me how to start and run a DeLorean without the use of a key (except the steering lock of course). When you turn your key to the 1st and 2nd positions, do you hear a "click" from the relay compartment associated with each one? These are the accessory and ignition relays. Since you say the
radio is fine, we can rule the accessory relay out, but it's worth getting voltmeter on the ignition relay to check it's getting power (this was one of the things Pauls system immobilised). NB even if it clicks doesn't mean it's switching any power.

The starter relay is the second from the left, top row. At this point, I dont know the extent of your technical ability, so I'll just say "check that". Mail me if you need more help.

All the best

Martin
#1458



Bob Thomason wrote:

> I'm still new to my car and it seems to have some sort of electrical bug that has now prevented it from starting. I drive this car daily but sometimes the battery goes dead undetermined reasons. Not often, just occasionally.
>
> Got in it this afternoon and battery was dead. Tried a jump which has worked in the past but engine would not budge. Got a normal voltage reading on the dash meter and radio, etc. worked. Engine just wouldn't turn over.  Let jumper cables stay attached while other car kept running for a while to charge battery----no luck. What could be keeping the engine from turning over??
>
> Only other clue is that the car was having a very slight difficultly starting in recent days. Like it didn't want to fire. Previously it would just start right up.
>
> I also have a Code Alert alarm system. I don't know if it's connected to the ignition in any way. Normally what happens is when I connect jumper cables, the alarm goes off. I hit the disarm button on the remote and start the car. Only this time it wouldn't turn over.
>
> All suggestions appreciated.
>
> Bob Thomason
> #5252




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Message: 16
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 23:19:31 -0000
From: "janvdwouw" <jvdwouw_at_dml_home.nl>
Subject: Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN

--- In dmcnews, Steve Stankiewicz wrote:
 
> I'm pretty sure there's no hole
> in the passenger side spindle.  

I'll check myself this weekend, even now I don't need 
to know anymore, since I've had a better idea brought 
on by someone else...

> However, since the shaft is a separate part,
> it MAY be possible to switch sides with the shafts.

That doesn't make sense, since there are separate 
partnumbers for the LH and RH spindle.
For my original idea I needed a hole in BOTH spindles;
LH for the original speedo drive and RH for my backup.
The new idea is to make a pickup at the LH driveshaft
near the transmission...

Thanks anyway,

JAN van de Wouw
Thinking Different...   Using a Mac...
Living the Dream...   Driving a DeLorean...

#05141 "Dagger" since Sept. 2000

------------------------------





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Message: 17
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 19:53:44 EDT
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: idle speed switch

Hey all,

i'm having a problem having my idle speed switch engage every time i take my 
foot off the gas.  it seems like it won't kick down on it's own, i have to 
hit the gas pedal hard and let it come down hard in order for the switch to 
kick down to idle mode.

first i tightened the cable from my pedal to the throttle, it was a little 
bit loose, so now it is tight but not influencing throttle position.  then i 
unscrewed both idle stop screws on the idle hammer, and used a screw driver 
to push in the idle speed switch as i set the car idle to about 900RPM (which 
sounds good to my ears). then i screwed down the idle switch screw until it 
was hitting the switch but allowing no more movement from the switch, but 
being careful not to let it influence the idle speed screw below it.  it's 
still doing the same thing.

how can i make my setup kick down all of the time? do i have a defective idle 
speed switch?  it won't kick down with you touch it with a screwdriver, it 
only kick down if you HOLD the screwdriver down on it. as you let the 
screwdriver up, the idle goes back up. doesn't seem right.

any help?
Andy

Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
1982 DeLorean DMC-12 VIN#11596
Fargo, ND 58102


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 18
Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 01:52:17 -0000
From: "rdthomason28209" <rdt7_at_dml_carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Help.....Car Won't Start

I believe it's definitely associated with the alarm system. I can't 
turn the alarm on now and the car won't start. Something else may be 
going on however, because this has never happened before when the 
battery went dead. 

I don't have my voltmeter handy so I haven't checked the starter 
relay. 

Bob

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> Hi Bob
> 
> First off from your VIN number, you should have had the starter 
relay fix - but it's worth checking. This supplies power to the 
solenoid. Details on the DMCnews tech section.
> 
> From your description it sounds like it's to do with your alarm. 
I've recently fitted a remote started to my car and helped Paul 
Salsbury with fitting the same system to his car - and he had an 
immobiliser fitted when he bought the car. Many aftermarket alarm 
systems are triggered by changes in system voltage - hence the jump-
leads causing the alarm to go off. This can include
> locks being triggered, interior lights coming on etc etc. .> 
> I am unsure how to proceed with this post because what I've learnt 
fitting my system taught me how to start and run a DeLorean without 
the use of a key (except the steering lock of course). When you turn 
your key to the 1st and 2nd positions, do you hear a "click" from the 
relay compartment associated with each one? These are the accessory 
and ignition relays. Since you say the
> radio is fine, we can rule the accessory relay out, but it's worth 
getting voltmeter on the ignition relay to check it's getting power 
(this was one of the things Pauls system immobilised). NB even if it 
clicks doesn't mean it's switching any power.
> 
> The starter relay is the second from the left, top row. At this 
point, I dont know the extent of your technical ability, so I'll just 
say "check that". Mail me if you need more help.
> 
> All the best
> 
> Martin
> #1458
> 
> 
> 
> Bob Thomason wrote:
> 
> > I'm still new to my car and it seems to have some sort of 
electrical bug that has now prevented it from starting. I drive this 
car daily but sometimes the battery goes dead undetermined reasons. 
Not often, just occasionally.
> >
> > Got in it this afternoon and battery was dead. Tried a jump which 
has worked in the past but engine would not budge. Got a normal 
voltage reading on the dash meter and radio, etc. worked. Engine just 
wouldn't turn over.  Let jumper cables stay attached while other car 
kept running for a while to charge battery----no luck. What could be 
keeping the engine from turning over??
> >
> > Only other clue is that the car was having a very slight 
difficultly starting in recent days. Like it didn't want to fire. 
Previously it would just start right up.
> >
> > I also have a Code Alert alarm system. I don't know if it's 
connected to the ignition in any way. Normally what happens is when I 
connect jumper cables, the alarm goes off. I hit the disarm button on 
the remote and start the car. Only this time it wouldn't turn over.
> >
> > All suggestions appreciated.
> >
> > Bob Thomason
> > #5252




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Message: 19
Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 02:22:44 -0000
From: "shainbrannan" <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>
Subject: Re: idle speed switch

Hi Andy,

It does not seem that your idle speed motor switch is defective.  
What happens is the arm is should have enough tension to keep the 
screw pressed down on the switch to engage it.  One thing to speck 
is the spring tension on the throttle spool.  I believe Rob Grady 
said there was a recall that you had to move the end of the spool 
spring (when you look at it you'll understand) one more notch to 
make it tighter,  it could that it does not have enough tension to 
keep some preasure on the switch.  If this is not the case or it 
seems to tight,  then what you will have to do is remove the arm 
under the throttle spool that connects it to the air intake.  Using 
caution to remove the clip first that holds it from popping off.  
Loosen the 8mm nut on it and screw the socket in one revolution.  
Clean the socket and ball end out, and lube it with the grease, then 
put it on the socket for a test fit.  This should make it just a 
little bit tighter so it depresses the switch,  if not try it one 
more revolution.  When your finished tighen up the nut and re -
insert the clip.  To adjust you idle,  loose the nuts on the 2 screw 
(that hit the switch),  adjust the idle first (bottom screw) whil 
the switch is depressed,  once that is done adjsut the top so it 
hits the switch and it engage, then one more turn for good luck ;)  
Should be set.

- Shain
#10140


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Soma576_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Hey all,
> 
> i'm having a problem having my idle speed switch engage every time 
i take my 
> foot off the gas.  it seems like it won't kick down on it's own, i 
have to 
> hit the gas pedal hard and let it come down hard in order for the 
switch to 
> kick down to idle mode.
> 
> first i tightened the cable from my pedal to the throttle, it was 
a little 
> bit loose, so now it is tight but not influencing throttle 
position.  then i 
> unscrewed both idle stop screws on the idle hammer, and used a 
screw driver 
> to push in the idle speed switch as i set the car idle to about 
900RPM (which 
> sounds good to my ears). then i screwed down the idle switch screw 
until it 
> was hitting the switch but allowing no more movement from the 
switch, but 
> being careful not to let it influence the idle speed screw below 
it.  it's 
> still doing the same thing.
> 
> how can i make my setup kick down all of the time? do i have a 
defective idle 
> speed switch?  it won't kick down with you touch it with a 
screwdriver, it 
> only kick down if you HOLD the screwdriver down on it. as you let 
the 
> screwdriver up, the idle goes back up. doesn't seem right.
> 
> any help?
> Andy
> 
> Soma576_at_dml_a...
> 1982 DeLorean DMC-12 VIN#11596
> Fargo, ND 58102
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 20
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 22:25:49 EDT
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Help.....Car Won't Start

Bob, My first impression is the solenoid /starter has reached it's life. Are 
you getting rapid clicks when trying to start or do you get one solid click 
and it just barely turnes over. If the later is what's happening. The more 
than likley the starter solenoid is going out. Unless you have a large gauge 
jumper cable, and another good hot battery, you may not be able to transfer 
enough current to turn the starter over good enough to start the car.
John hervey
http://www.specialtauto.com/
 
<< I'm still new to my car and it seems to have some sort of electrical bug 
that has now prevented it from starting. I drive this car daily but sometimes 
the battery goes dead undetermined reasons. Not often, just occasionally. 
 
 Got in it this afternoon and battery was dead. Tried a jump which has worked 
in the past but engine would not budge. Got a normal voltage reading on the 
dash meter and radio, etc. worked. Engine just wouldn't turn over.  Let 
jumper cables stay attached while other car kept running for a while to 
charge battery----no luck. What could be keeping the engine from turning 
over??
 
 Only other clue is that the car was having a very slight difficultly 
starting in recent days. Like it didn't want to fire. Previously it would 
just start right up.
 
 I also have a Code Alert alarm system. I don't know if it's connected to the 
ignition in any way. Normally what happens is when I connect jumper cables, 
the alarm goes off. I hit the disarm button on the remote and start the car. 
Only this time it wouldn't turn over. 
 
 A >>



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Message: 21
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 23:43:40 -0400
From: "Randy Stribling" <estribl1_at_dml_tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: Engine Horsepower

It seems that most everywhere I look, in car magazines and ads for high performance cars, these days the engine horsepower is always listed in bhp.  Brake horse power.  The June 2002 Road and Track magazine compares at least a dozen cars mostly listing BHP.  Now from my limited knowledge of this measurement system it is taken on an engine without any encumbrances like alternators, fans, extraneous belts, etc. right?

The DeLorean literature I have seen shows 130 SAE net hp. which, I have heard, is measured at the rear wheels where it counts.

Has anyone ever published or measured the DeLorean engine for BHP?
It would be nice for once to have some data about our cars in the same format (language?) that most other auto makers use for advertising purposes.   (It should be a higher number too).

Curious in Tampa,  Randy Stribling
vin 3228  Aug '81


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Message: 22
Date: Fri, 24 May 2002 23:05:06 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Spindles front suspension / Speedo Drive Blues AGAIN

I am positive that there is no hole in the right spindle since I have one
apart in my yard.  Both spindles appear to be the same except for the hole,
so it appears you can put another left spindle on the right side and use it
as an angle drive location.  But the cable will be spinning in the wrong
direction.  You will need to come up with a 1:1 gear ratio that reverses the
direction.  This all seems like a lot of trouble for what it's worth.  Have
you ever tried one of PJ Grady's hard core angle drives?

Walt




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Message: 23
Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 00:04:49 -0400
From: "Mike Substelny" <msubstel_at_dml_lorainccc.edu>
Subject: RE:Re: Help.....Car Won't Start

>Bob Thomason wrote:
>
>> I'm still new to my car and it seems to have some >> sort of electrical
bug that has now prevented it
>> from starting. I drive this car daily but
>> sometimes the battery goes dead undetermined
>> reasons. Not often, just occasionally.

Check to be sure your passenger door light go out when the door is closed.
This drained my battery on a number of occasions when I first got my
DeLorean.

>> Got in it this afternoon and battery was dead.
>> Tried a jump which has worked in the past but
>> engine would not budge. Got a normal voltage
>> reading on the dash meter and radio, etc. worked.

It sounds to me like your starter or solenoid are just wearing out.  This
happened to me a few years ago, and a new starter and solenoid fixed me
right up.  Remember, if a previous owner was starting your car with
insufficient voltage, the starter and solenoid could have experienced
excessive wear.

Martin said your car should have the relay update already.  You ought to
double check this, though, just to be sure.

- Mike Substelny
VIN 01280




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Message: 24
Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 04:13:25 -0000
From: "john572905" <jrc2905_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: rear drive axle question

I have finally put my D back together. There is something not right, 
I can feel it acting rough and some noise from the rear axle when I 
drive it. I took the entire rear suspension off the car and cleaned 
and regreased all componants, replaced the transmission seals and 
sandblasted and rust proofed all the parts including frame, plus all 
rebuild on the brakes,
 My questions is;
1. The rear drive axles, is there a correct way to install them. the 
manual talks about a inside and outside axle connection, how do u 
tell this.
2.the manual calls for 270 pounds of torque on the axle nut, my 
torque wrench only goes to 160. I torqued it to that and then some, 
could I have over tightened the axle bolt? I did take the axle 
bearings out and regreased them.
3. what car is the brake master cylinder from. I need one small part 
and do not want to by the whole master cylinder right now.
Any help is appreciated, I just want to drive.
John Cabral




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Message: 25
Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 00:37:37 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: radio bezel/blower repair

> Water collects at the blower bottom through
> the cooling tube, suggest drilling small drainage holes when you have
> it out or replacing it. Better still is to increase tube penetration
> into the duct by cementing a smaller ID tube into the larger one.

Increasing tube penetration probably isn't going to help much because there
is already a small lip where the tube goes in.  Any water that could puddle
there is far more likely to settle on top of the blower motor before it
makes it up hill into the tube.  Any water on top of the motor housing is
going to easily find its way in there.  I mentioned on the DML before that I
used silicone caulk to fill in all the seams to keep the water out.  Someone
objected saying that these holes are important to air circulation through
the motor, but I disagree.  There are large holes specifically for
circulation under the raised area of the squirrel cage, and those I left
alone.  Adding drainage holes in the bottom of the motor housing is an
interesting idea, but I doubt it will be effective.  Any one hole will need
to be large enough such that the weight of the water will exceed the
strength of the surface tension.  How about someone making a blower motor
that is water proof & rust proof?

> I recall reading that DMC had issued an old
> service note to reduce the R12 charge down from 2.8 pounds
> to 2.2 pounds, anyone familiar with that note?

Yes, I've seen 3 sources, and each gives a different specification.  The 3rd
source being the '81 owners manual.

> I'm machining tig welding up a new SS pickup assembly for the fuel
> pump. It'll replace the hose and be a straight drop down (or slight
> offset) to a custom SS baffle assembly. Anyone tried this kind of
> thing before? Have to keep the return line away from the baffle or
> may have problems when the fuel level is low (proper baffle design
> will prevent this.) This could explain why some of you are having
> suction problems even with the spring installed.

I don't see much of a point in a custom baffle since the OEM isn't too bad
in my opinion (unless you don't like the thought of paying $92 for a rubber
hose that may need to be replaced in another 20 years).  Many D's were made
with the lower part of the fuel baffle missing, and I think I heard that
this part was unavailable(?).  But a friend just bought a new one from PJ
Grady which I installed for him today.  Are these reproductions or NOS?

Can you explain the problem you see with the OEM fuel return line in the
baffle?

I had thoughts about making a custom baffle out of the bottom of a #2 PETE
plastic bleach bottle, but that was just a fleeting thought.  Since fuel
cans are made of that kind of plastic, I figure it would work if it could
take the heat.

I had thoughts about making a SS fuel baffle (in addition to an entire tank
as well), so I'm curious to see what you are up to.  Unlike the OEM,
whatever you come up with is going to have to be small enough to fit through
the fuel pump opening.  I'm visualizing something either the size of the
fuel pump hole (round) or oval-shaped.  What I like so much about the OEM
setup is that the suction screen sits very low without conducting too much
vibration from the pump.  Eliminating the long flexible suction hose means
proper height of the fuel suction screen is going to be touchy -- too low
and it will conduct vibration; too high and it will suck air when the tank
is low.  I would try to design it so that the baffle fills faster than it
empties, but still have the suction low enough so that it won't suck air
when you first start the car from an almost empty tank, i.e., the level in
the baffle will be as low as the rest of the tank.

> Changing most of the coolant hoses under the car to PTFE under
> stainless flex used in aircraft, and SS coolant bellows for supply
> and return at the engine. Anyone done this, or anything else, to
> improve MTBF of the cooling system?

Excuse my stupidy, but what does MTBF mean?  I think that the kind of hose
you are talking about is the same or similar kind of material as the SS
braided clutch line upgrade & Marty's brake lines.  I doubt that you will be
able to fit/stretch these the same way as regular coolant hoses.  It seems
to me that you would need to attach special fittings.  I see a lot of
mock-up versions at car shows, but to me it looks really silly seeing hose
clamps that are made to look like compression fittings.  Someday I want to
replace my refrigerant lines and am thinking that I want to use PTFE? under
stainless flex.  If this is what I think it is, it is commonly used in
commercial refrigeration systems.

> Going to change the wiring also. Studying the schematic shows an
> appalling lack of design expertise.

I think your opinion is too kind.  :-)  I'm happy doing the basic "vendor
approved" modifications; although, I would be happier with an entirely new
wiring system.  The problem is that the car will probably outlast me.  And I
love my car enough that I don't want the next owner to have a hard time
figuring out what I did differently.  How about designing an "open source"
replacement wiring diagram and go into the wiring business.  Make & sell a
standardized drop-in replacement electrical system that is standardized
(without making every other wire brown!)

Gary, welcome to the DML.  It's a pleasure exchanging ideas with technically
minded people like you.

Walt    Tampa, FL




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