From: <>
To: <>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1117
Date: Wednesday, July 17, 2002 5:35 PM

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There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. DeLorean-related rap song
From: Todd Masinelli <>

2. Re: locked up door
From: Martin Gutkowski <>

3. RE: DeLorean Story and For Sale
From: "Kevin Abato" <>

4. I'm selling my Delorean
From: "cpgny9" <>

5. My Delorean For Sale
From: "thinkstainless" <>

6. Re: worn out upper door panel
From: "Joseph Molino" <>

7. Minnesota 3rd Annual Apple Run
From: "Nick Kemp" <>

8. RE: driving with doors open?
From: "Kevin Abato" <>

9. Re: worn out upper door panel
From: Robert Brandys <>

10. Re: putting D in Museum - advice?
From: Robert Brandys <>

11. Door strut debacle
From: James Espey <>

12. Re: locked up door
From: "Walter Coe" <>

13. Re: HELP!! Need an evaporator!!!
From: "Walter Coe" <>

14. My first DeLorean, #4260 (new owner)
From: Scott Tester <>

15. RE: locked up door
From: "Scott Mueller" <>

16. Re-commissioning after long-term storage
From: "lucmieze" <>

17. Re: putting D in Museum - advice?
From: "basfe25" <>

18. Coolant
From: "vin4258" <>

19. Reminder: Eastern CT Classic and Custom car show!
From: "gr8old1" <>

20. Re: putting D in Museum - advice?
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <>

21. Grinding transmission
From: "dursman" <>

22. Re: Re: putting D in Museum - advice?
From: "Hank Eskin" <>

23. Re: driving with doors open?
From: Martin Gutkowski <>

24. RE: locked up door
From: Travis Goodwin <>

25. Open Invitational Door Strut Test
From: "twinenginedmc12" <>

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:04:58 -0500
From: Todd Masinelli <>
Subject: DeLorean-related rap song

(Moderators note - this posting is for information only - we're NOT going to start a thread on this subject - Marty, this weeks moderator)

For those who collect everything DeLorean-related (and/or really enjoy rap

Track 6 on El-P's latest album "Fantastic Damage" is called "Delorean."  The
song as a whole isn't really about the car, but he does make references to
it in the lyrics ("pedal to the floorboard, DeLorean be gone", etc).

Todd Masinelli
VIN 6681 (Nov 81)


Message: 2
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 00:15:40 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <>
Subject: Re: locked up door

One thing to check is if the locks have properly unlatched - you say "moving the rod on
the inside of the door won't help" - which one have you tried? The one that worked for me
is the one that runs directly beneath the door pull handle, and an adjustment of the rear
latch subsequently fixed the problem.



Message: 3
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 19:57:27 -0400
From: "Kevin Abato" <>
Subject: RE: DeLorean Story and For Sale

I would be interested in seeing some digital pictures of the hideous paint

-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Rowe []
Subject: [DML] DeLorean Story and For Sale

        About a month ago my dad called and said h saw a DeLorean sitting at
a repair shop in town ( Kokomo, In ). After work one morning I drove by to take a look at it. What I saw was pretty rough. The worse part to me was the color. Someone had painted it white from the front up to the rear quarters, then a
blue stripe went around the top of the car, and then the rear quartes and
fascia was red.


Message: 4
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 00:57:54 -0000
From: "cpgny9" <>
Subject: I'm selling my Delorean

I am buying my first home and will be selling my Delorean.  Its a 
1983 5-speed.  48K original miles. Gray interior.  Body is in 
excellent condition (8.5 out of 10). Headers and carpet are in near 
perfect condition. JVC CD player installed. Just passed NJ inspection 
(not an easy task for any car). The Angle drive just snapped and wil 
need to be replaced.  Seats are ini great condition, no cracks in 
leather, may want to re-dye.  The dash is in great shape, however the 
binnacle around the speedometer cluster has some cracking and can 
easily be replaced.  Right window has usual Delorean window problem.  
Just noticed some noise from the left manifold and have been told 
that it is a manifold exahust leak (cheap part, but labor can cost a 
bit).  Original glove box cover signed by John D. Himself. I have 
replaced it with a new cover, but buyer gets both.  All manuals and 
car cover comes with the car.  I am asking 19,500.  I have plenty of 
photos that I can e-mail upon request.  Please e-mail me at with any questions or for photos.  The car is 
located in Northern NJ (about 35 minutes outside New York City).  No 
accidents/clean title.  


Message: 5
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 01:11:39 -0000
From: "thinkstainless" <>
Subject: My Delorean For Sale

Hey guys,

Due to financial straights, im forced to sell my D. Its an 82 Manual 
with grey interior, exterior is in great shape except 2 minor dings 
on the left quarter panel, and the facias need to be resprayed. 
Interior is ok, dash and binacle have cracks but has dash cover, non 
stock cd player, leather on seats are bad, so i've put on seat 
covers, I have nice speakers with a nice amp in it so it cranks out 
some sound. 55k miles, no damage to the frame that I am aware of, 
alignment is good, new brakes, tires, new clutch, new master 
cylinder for brake and clutch, same thing? New water pump, have all 
work receipts, comes with Service Parts Manual, Craig Stereo 
warrenty, Advertisement brochure, Service Panphlet, etc.. Its in 
Arizona, have lots of pics so I can either email them to you or I 
can post em, if any of you wanna stop by to check it out, or if you 
want someone from the az d club to come check it out for you, thats 
fine. I paid 15k for this car, and will sell for much much less. 
I'll take any reasonable offer at this point.




Message: 6
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 21:15:51 -0400
From: "Joseph Molino" <>
Subject: Re: worn out upper door panel

What I don't understand is how I got my door panel insert to be made of
plastic.  My vin number is 2850 and my other D is 3085 and it is made of
cardboard with the same problem.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Christian Williams" <>
Subject: [DML] worn out upper door panel

> I'm sure a lot of us have this problem, so I'm wondering if anyone has any
> good solutions. I've had to take my upper door panels off quite a few times, and the stiff cardboard (?) with holes for the fir trees has become feeble and torn in some places. 


Message: 7
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:14:53 -0500
From: "Nick Kemp" <>
Subject: Minnesota 3rd Annual Apple Run

I just got a message from Charlie and Carol Ossell, proprietors of Deer Lake
Orchard, and we are invited back for the 3rd Annual DMC Apple Run at  the
orchard.  This annual event has caught on with the locals and it draws a bit
of a crowd checking out the cars.  The date is Sunday, Sept 15th.  As per
usual there will be:
- Great apples
- Lots of Deloreans
- Great weather
- Free entertainment
- Wagon rides
- Food
- Great company
- and a variety of other things

I propose that we get together at the orchard noon'ish and that we have
dinner at a place yet to be determined.  For those who will be coming from
the cities, a caravan is a nice touch.  As per usual, we'll notify the local
press (the first year they did front page, second section, full page

- So mark your calendars for Sunday, September 15th.
- Get the word out to the other DMCs in the area ... or not in the area but
are willing to visit.
- Polish up the SS
- Clean up the engine

Email if any questions,

Nick Kemp

The address is
Deer Lake Orchard (It is a big red old style barn)
1903 10th Street SW
Buffalo MN 55313
The orchard number is 763-682-6159 (tell them Nick sent you)

Directions to Deer Lake Orchard from Minneapolis South metro area:

Follow 494 to 394/12 intersection,

- Go West on 394/US12

- Follow US12 to Montrose

- At Montrose, turn North on county road 12(it is at the only stoplight in

- Go about 6 miles to co rd 108 and turn left (West)

- Deer Lake Orchard is 1.5 miles on the left.  You'll first see a red barn
and then the home.

From Highway 55 or 94(monticello exit)

- Take 25 South, into Buffalo, past lake to first stop sign. (three way

- Turn right onto Montrose/Co 12.

 - Go about 3 miles to 108/8th Street SW & turn west
   Watch for Deer Lake Orchard sign at intersection.

- Orchard is 1.5 miles on south side of road.

For those who use Internet web map sites, I've heard roumors that they are
not accurate and will direct you to some other distant location... you've
been warned :-)


Message: 8
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 22:09:15 -0400
From: "Kevin Abato" <>
Subject: RE: driving with doors open?

I was leary of this also, but ya know what....I saw some footage and photos
of people at the factory doing it during test drives, and when pulling the
cars out etc.. So i figured It is safe to do, but I never exceed 5-10mph
while doing it.

kevin Abato
Vin# 16680


Message: 9
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 21:13:06 -0500
From: Robert Brandys <>
Subject: Re: worn out upper door panel

I had a similar problem with custom fitting my headliner in the DeLorean 
time machine because I cut out the center for the overhead council.  I 
also have had similar problems on other cars I restore.

What I do is buy the two part clear urethan that is used to finish wood 
like 60 coats of varnish. This stuff takes a while to cure so it soaks 
into porous materials and when it hardens makes the very strong and 
PUt the headliner on wax paper of polyethylene plastic.  Apply thick 
coats to soak in and wait 24 hours.

This should solve your problem.



Message: 10
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 21:15:27 -0500
From: Robert Brandys <>
Subject: Re: putting D in Museum - advice?


Make sure they carry insurance.  Draw up a contract that say something 
about caring for the car similar to other collector cars in their 

Make clear dates of storage and pick up.

Check policies on removal or disconnection of batteries.  



Message: 11
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:48:17 -0500
From: James Espey <>
Subject: Door strut debacle

DeLorean Motor Company (Texas) was the vendor where the struts were
purchased from that Rick Gendreau had problems with the struts being 5mm too
long for his application. Stephen and I discussed this issue and these were
the points that we think merit noting:

In the past twelve months, we've sold more than 1500 of these struts, and
have had three or four instances where the additional length was a problem -
and ALL of those instances involved with very low (sub-1000) VIN's or cars
that had been in a crash or modified in some way. A look at these pages:

shows that Rick's car falls into that latter category. While we're not
trying to pick on Rick or his project (we think what he's done is pretty
ingenious), sometimes when extreme modifications like this are made,
sometimes things that would work before, might no longer be the case any
longer. While there's no clear link between the problems he's experienced
and the fact that the body hung by the wheelwells for a couple months and
large pieces were cut out of it (which by his own admission makes it very
flimsy) - we've never seen a later car like his (11472) have this problem
(some of the later VIN RHD cars - 12XXX series - used very early
underbodies, and they are the exception).

A 5mm increase in the length of the strut translates into a couple inches or
so with the door fully open, resulting in significantly more room for
ingress/egress from the DeLorean - something no one will complain about. For
the very small number of cars that this affects, shorter ends are available
for the struts.

Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.

James Espey
DeLorean Motor Company
15023 Eddie Drive
Humble, Texas 77396

281/441-2537 Voice
281/441-2813 Fax


Message: 12
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 23:29:28 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <>
Subject: Re: locked up door


Try unhooking the cable that comes from the exterior door handle.  If it is
holding any tension on the bell crank then the front latch may not unlock.


>      My problem is that just recently my driverside door is locked
> up in the front. It is not the selianoids, and adjusting or moving
> the rod on the inside of the door wont help. if any one has any
> advice on this problem, any help is apreciated.


Message: 13
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 23:41:42 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <>
Subject: Re: HELP!! Need an evaporator!!!

Yep, been there.  Didn't get one either.  I searched through Hemmings on the
net and found only one company listing antique a/c services and coincidently
they are local to me.  (Major cool!)  They can make evaporators from
scratch, so I asked the guy if he could make one for my DeLorean.  He said
that he would have to see it first.  Well, I haven't had time (and may not
have time anytime soon) to take mine out to show him.  If you already have
yours out, you can send it to him and see if he can copy it.  I think he
can.  If he can make it, it would be a good idea to see if we can get the
price down if he makes several since I'm sure all the vendors would probably
like to stock at least one.

Classic Auto Air Mfg Co
2020 W Kennedy Blvd, Tampa, FL 33606
PH: 813-251-2356, 813-251-4994.

I probably drive by this place 2 or 3 times per week.  If you decide to send
yours, let me know so that I can talk to the guy in person about having
several made.

There is a chance that yours can be repaired.  Steve Wynne told me that they
usually go bad at the orifice tube inlet and he uses a standard repair kit
to attach a new input tube.



Message: 14
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 00:46:30 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Tester <>
Subject: My first DeLorean, #4260 (new owner)

I'm now the proud owner of VIN#4260, in which I purchased from a dealership here in Vallejo, CA.

I saw the car about two weeks ago and decided to check it out. I took it to a local mechanic that had worked on many DeLoreans in the past, and he gave it a clean bill of health.

It's an 81, with grey leather, 22,000 miles, and almost entirely original. All it needs is a front facia, paint for the facias, and the dash replaced.

I've been reading this list since about 1994, so at age 24 I can finally "live the dream" and utilize this wonderful mailing list. Thanks in advance for any help you all can provide!

Scott Tester     scott(at)delorean(dot)com


Message: 15
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 06:59:11 -0500
From: "Scott Mueller" <>
Subject: RE: locked up door

Why don't you write up the stripping procedure and post it on DMCNEWS, with

My car has always been SS, but I am curious on how you did it.

Scott Mueller

-----Original Message-----
From: redscare5 []
Subject: [DML] locked up door

  ...... Also, If anyone is currently stripping a DeLorean I can give
some tips on how to do it with out destroying anything, having to
regrain the car, or  having to take the whole thing apart.



Message: 16
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 12:14:26 -0000
From: "lucmieze" <>
Subject: Re-commissioning after long-term storage

My VIN 4740 has 14'200 miles and has been stored under cover in a 
heated garage on wooden blocks for 15 years without any other 
storage precautions but looks as smart as ever after cleaning. 

What procedures should be followed to put it back on the road again 
correctly and what parts changed / replaced? The car is in Southern 


Message: 17
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 12:48:19 -0000
From: "basfe25" <>
Subject: Re: putting D in Museum - advice?

If you are going to put it in a museum then I know that the 
following will be done (if they follow OSHA standards). All of the 
fuel and the battery will be removed and maybe the oil. I don't know 
what effect removing all of the fuel from the tank and fuel system 
and having it sit for a year will do to the fuel system (IE: Rot out 
the rubber in the tank, form rust, etc.), you might want to look 
into that. I would recomend that you do draw up a contract stating 
that if anything is damaged or stolen (like someone climbing into 
the car and swiping the shift knob or something) that the Museum is 
to take full responsibility for it. Take LOADS of pictures of the 
car before releasing it but take it in the presence of them. Don't 
have them display the car with the doors open (put extra strain on 
the torsion bar and strut) or you could find yourself replacing the 
struts when you return if they do so. If they want to display it 
with the doors open then tell them to have someone open the doors of 
the car when the place opens and to close the doors when the place 
closes. I can't think of anything else but I'm sure others on the 
list will come up with other good ideas. 

IMHO, I would store it properly by filling the gas tank up and 
adding gas stabilizer, change the motor oil, spray Fogging oil into 
each of the cylinders (will prevent rust from formng inside the 
cylinders), storing it in a cliamate controlled place (if you don't 
have a place to store it in), put the battery on a battery minder 
(or remove it), put a box or two of baking soda inside the car (keep 
it moist free and smelling nice) and cover it. If it was going to be 
more then a year then I would suggest to remove the tires and 
install some cheap tires on aftermarket rims that would fit the 
Delorean (this will prevent the good tires from "egging", become out 
of round).


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "dmcjohn" <john.dore_at_dml_f...> wrote:
> Hi guys,
> Unfortunately I have to go back to Ireland in October for about 8 
> months or so,..... Anyway, instead of putting my DeLorean in storage, I've decided to put it in a museum for a year.


Message: 18
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:21:25 -0000
From: "vin4258" <>
Subject: Coolant

Does anyone know what color the factory antifreeze was?  I was going 
to change mine since I don't know if it ever has been, but it looked 
fresh, so I put it back in.  It is blue but I have never seen blue 
before (or heard of it.)  If it is original, do I still need to 
replace it even if it is clean or not?


Message: 19
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:21:33 -0000
From: "gr8old1" <>
Subject: Reminder: Eastern CT Classic and Custom car show!

July 19-21

The big day will be sunday July 21. Dodd Stadium, Norwich, CT. Last 
year there wer NO Deloreans at the show. and this year only 1 person 
has planned on coming. This show is located halfway between Boston 
and NYC so everyone is invited to come.. Let's show people that these 
are real cars!

For more info:

contact me for any questions.


Message: 20
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:30:38 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <>
Subject: Re: putting D in Museum - advice?

When making a deal with a museum generally you can get them to cover 
the car with their insurance. It is only for property damage not 
liability so they can't drive the car. I would also put that into the 
agreement, that it can't be driven and if they want to lend it out to 
any other museums, films, commercials, etc they must get your 
permission first. Include that the battery must be removed and all 
fuel. Get yourself named as additional insured on their policy and get 
an insurance certificate to that effect. You may have to agree to a 
minimum period of time (like 1 year) that it can stay in the museum.  
You get free storage and insurance, they get inventory to draw 
customers in to pay admission. When picking up the car after the tour 
is over they must restore all systems like put some gas in it and a 
charged-up battery and repair any missing or damaged parts, keys etc. 
When first bringing in the car document condition so they can't say 
you brought the car in damaged. You must get all of this in writing. 
Be careful as some museums masquarade as car dealers. They will tell 
you that the car can be sold for an outragous price but you find out 
in the fine print of your agreement the commission is equally 
outragous and they don't need your permission to sell the car!
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757 


Message: 21
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:05:24 -0000
From: "dursman" <>
Subject: Grinding transmission

Hi everybody... (my first post) When I shift from 1st to 2nd at above 
3k rpm I get a grind.  Also when I shift into 5th gear no matter what 
the revs are at I get a little grind.  If the shift is unreasonably 
slow sometimes it won't grind, but this is hard to do while actually 
driving.  Please let me know what possible problems could be.  I was 
thinking a bent shifter, an old clutch, or loss of clutch fluid.  Any 
suggestions would be appreciated.  Thanks.
VIN 10213


Message: 22
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 12:05:21 -0400
From: "Hank Eskin" <>
Subject: Re: Re: putting D in Museum - advice?

> Don't  have them display the car with the doors open (put extra strain on
> the torsion bar and strut)

I was told by Rob Grady that leaving the doors open actually minimizes the
strain on the torsion bar and struts. It is my understanding that when the
doors are closed, both the torsion bar and struts are "loaded". When open,
they both are in a non-stressed state.

-Hank #1619


Message: 23
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:20:37 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <>
Subject: Re: driving with doors open?

Seeing as the subject came round again :-)

First off, I can't see how driving on a smooth surfact and not 
accellerating or braking too quickly can be bad. I am careful not to 
drive over speed bumps or uneven ground with the doors open unless very 
slowly - the way the doors twist and wobble can be a bit alarming, 
though I'm sure this flexing actually protects the hinges more than 

My real reason for this post is to relate something that happenned on 
the way home from Supercar Sunday this last weekend. We had 25 DeLoreans 
present, including several missing from last year's 17, so a whole batch 
of first-timers (like me with #1458). Jan van der Wouw drove over from 
Holland to attend and we convoyed up from Kent to Birmingham (about 200 

On the way home on Sunday, with just myself and Jan in convoy, we hit 
traffic on the M25 (London Orbital Motorway - known throughout Britain 
as the world's biggest car-park). It was a hot day, and with my AC 
cycling too quickly, and Jan's not working at all, we just popped the 
doors. The road was smooth, as you'd expect, and we didn't go faster 
than 30mph for the best part of an hour. We got a lot of attention! I 
had a truck driver shout "Those look really fast!" and a couple of times 
brakes were slammed on as people were paying more attention to us than 
the car in front. It was a lot of fun, and something entirely practical 
you could only achieve in the DeLorean!

I often get asked "is that legal"? My answer is that I don't think 
anyone would have thought to have written a law about driving with the 
doors open.... (except maybe that you lose the use of your wing mirror).

(this was actually the first time my car's sat in traffic on a hot day - 
the cooling fans cycled perfectly, keeping me at around 200 deg or less 
the whole time. On the minus side my fuel pump was making a real racket 
by the time we stopped at the services, and I was on half a tank)



Kevin Abato wrote:

>I was leary of this also, but ya know what....I saw some footage and photos
>of people at the factory doing it during test drives, and when pulling the
>cars out etc.. So i figured It is safe to do, but I never exceed 5-10mph
>while doing it.
>kevin Abato
>Vin# 16680


Message: 24
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 12:13:53 -0400
From: Travis Goodwin <>
Subject: RE: locked up door

Oh boy! I had the same problem with my passenger side door. You're going to
stick your hand inside the door. What has likely happened is the latch
mechanism is stuck and the rods just flex in place, leaving the door locked.

Reach your hand all the way in and try working the latch with your finger.
You'll be doing it by Braille, so be patient. It took me an hour to get mine

Once you have it open, take it out and make it so that it cannot
lock again. I have both front locks disabled and it works fine. This way you
don't have to rely on the long Z-rod which tends to flex too much, causing a
lot of stuck doors.


     My problem is that just recently my driverside door is locked 
up in the front. It is not the selianoids, and adjusting or moving 
the rod on the inside of the door wont help. if any one has any 
advice on this problem, any help is apreciated.


Message: 25
Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:05:11 -0000
From: "twinenginedmc12" <>
Subject: Open Invitational Door Strut Test


I recently had trouble with a mechanically incompatible door strut 
that I purchased from a well known, and otherwise respected vendor.  
I've since ordered replacement struts from a different vendor, and 
will be comparing them in terms of geometry and function.

I'm considering expanding the scope into something more 
comprehensive, if enough non-vendor list members are interested.  If 
you would like such a strut comparison test done, email me directly. 
If eight or more people are interested, I'll run the test, and 
publish the results.  If less than eight people are interested, I 
probably won't bother.  I don't really have anything to prove.

I'm highly interested in getting hold of an NOS (New Old Stock) 
original equipement Stabilus Lift-o-mat strut to measure as a 
baseline.  Though I question the relevance of data from a twenty year 
old part, I'd like to gather the data for reference.  I realize a 
strut of this vintage has great Concours value, so I assure you that 
it will be treated with care, cycled only once, and returned in good 
condition.  If you are willing to lend me one, please email me 
directly.  I'm also interested in getting some samples of used struts 
of known origin, to compare the new state to the end-of-life state.

It also occured to me that there's no reason that the test couldn't 
be expanded to include struts from multiple vendors.  I invite any 
vendor who wishes to submit a sample strut for comparison.  Email me 
for shipping info.  I will accept, without prejudice, the first eight 
vendor entries for testing. The only term is that this is a "No 
Whining" event.  If you wish to participate, you waive any right to 
complain about the results.

Testing will include:
Extended length
Compressed length
Travel distance
Force at extended length
Force at compressed length

Testing might include:
Force at intermediate points between extended and compressed states
Force versus temperature, 20degreesF to 150degreesF (NOS Stabilus 
strut, if tested, would not be temperature cycled)

Testing will not include:
Dynamic testing
(I wish I could, as I think this is important, but a dynamic test 
setup will take more time and money than I wish to spend on the test)

I feel a test of this type can benefit the Delorean community.  
Either we'll find out that they're all pretty much the same, and we 
don't have to worry, or we'll find out that one strut is distinctly 
better than the other, which is also a nice thing to know. 

Non-vendors, email me if you want me to run this test.
Vendors, step on up to the plate.

Rick Gendreau


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