From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1218
Date: Saturday, September 28, 2002 8:26 AM

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

There are 22 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Re: Problem with Lockzilla
From: Joe Bachmann <joe.bachmann_at_dml_newmail.net>

2. RE: Problem with Lockzilla
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

3. Re: Battery load test at home
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com

4. RE: Re: Downfall of the DMC?
From: "Chris Parnham" <cp_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

5. Re: Downfall of the DMC?
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

6. Re: Re: Parking my Delorean on a Hill
From: "The Atkinson Family" <mikeatk_at_dml_cox.net>

7. Re: DeLorean Commercial?
From: Jim Strickland <ihaveanaccount_at_dml_juno.com>

8. Re: DOA Northwest Passage Event
From: wingd2_at_dml_aol.com

9. Italdesign D with saddle interior
From: Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_framezero.com>

10. PRV engine control system from LOTUS Cars U.K.
From: Senatorpack_at_dml_cs.com

11. RE: Fw: #1209, Travis, and things
From: Travis Goodwin <tgoodwin_at_dml_vantagep.com>

12. Re: Re: Problem with Lockzilla
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

13. Re: Problem with Lockzilla
From: "ksgrimsr" <knut.s.grimsrud_at_dml_intel.com>

14. NJ Fall tour Unique "perspective"
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>

15. Re: Italdesign D with saddle interior
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>

16. Re: Battery load test at home
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

17. Re: Italdesign D with saddle interior
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>

18. Re: PRV engine control system from LOTUS Cars U.K.
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

19. Delorean Fall Foliage Tour III
From: "turbodmc3113" <turbodmc_at_dml_hotmail.com>

20. Fall tour Correction
From: "turbodmc3113" <turbodmc_at_dml_hotmail.com>

21. DeLorean Mid-Atlantic Fall Tour Info
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

22. Mirror switch wanted
From: RJRavalli_at_dml_AOL.com





Message: 1
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 22:48:46 -0500
From: Joe Bachmann <joe.bachmann_at_dml_newmail.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Problem with Lockzilla

How much is drawn with a stock unit? I imagine it is a very small amount, if any.

JB

jtrealtywebspannet wrote:

> I would have the battery load tested. It is true 30 ma. is a
> significant drain but if your battery is old it doesn't have the full
> capacity of a new one. If it is more than 4 years old it is probably
> at about 1/2 capacity. Sears will load test for free and since you
> have a Sears there might be some trade-in. Another problem with a lot
> of Deloreans is that they just aren't used a whole lot so the battery
> never really gets fully charged up. Being in a constant state of
> discharge causes the battery to go bad faster. Especially storing for
> the winter and letting it go dead. Lead-acid batteries don't live long
> with these kind of cycles.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757
>
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> > Hank, your battery might be duff
> >
> > the batt I have in mine is a 55Ah. with a drain of 30mA, it will be
> completely flat in 76
> > days.... - that's more than two months!
> >
> > I have an alarm/remote locking/remote starter on my car and it stays
> armed for weeks and
> > the car still starts fine
> >
> > Best Wishes
> >
> > Martin
> > #1458 & #4426
> >
> > Hank Eskin wrote:
> >
> > > With the prodding of Rick G, I've been able to locate the current
> drain in
> > > my car (Don't worry, I'm still going to install the battery
> isolator).  It
> > > turns out to be Lockzilla pulling about 30Ma with the "remote"
> unit plugged
> > > in, and 20ma without.  The total current draw from the battery
> when the car
> > > is off was 30Ma until I totally disconnected Lockzilla - then I
> get a zero
> > > Ma reading on my meter.
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 08:24:31 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: RE: Problem with Lockzilla

Two months??  Wow..  I must have a tilly device in my car, because is has sat at some points for four months and started right up.  Yes, I have a lockzilla.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Martin Gutkowski [mailto:webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk]
> Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 5:43 PM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [DML] Problem with Lockzilla
> 
> 
> Hank, your battery might be duff
> 
> the batt I have in mine is a 55Ah. with a drain of 30mA, it 
> will be completely flat in 76
> days.... - that's more than two months!
> 
> I have an alarm/remote locking/remote starter on my car and 
> it stays armed for weeks and
> the car still starts fine



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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 01:06:03 EDT
From: dherv10_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Battery load test at home

Group, The easiest way to load test the battery is in the vehicle.By using 
the starter in the car as the load. Connect a digital volt meter across the 
battery terminals and set the meter on the 20 volt DC scale, disconnect the 
coil ignition wire so the car won't start and have someone turn on the 
ignition like trying to start the car. The voltage with a good hot battery 
should drop to about 10.25 volts. The longer you keep cranking just for 15 
seconds or so, you can see the voltage hold or begin to drop. In 70 degree F 
weather it shouldn't drop less than 9.6 volts. If it does, then you either 
have a bad battery or one going bad or you have a starter dragging and need 
to be replaced.
John Hervey
www.specialTauto.com
   

<<  the batt I have in mine is a 55Ah. with a drain of 30mA, it will be
 completely flat in 76
 > days.... - that's more than two months!
 
 Ok folks, I'm only going to repeat this one more time! The problem isn't the
 battery DRAINING until it is DEAD - the Sears "Security" Diehard battery has
 INTERNAL an auto-shut off that triggers when the voltage drops a couple of
 volts - saving enough energy to start the car when I return.  Therefore, the
 current drain can be enough to trigger the shut off (I think it's 10.5
 volts).
  >>



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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 10:11:01 +0100
From: "Chris Parnham" <cp_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Re: Downfall of the DMC?

Its very refreshing for me to read such considered and thoughtful replies to
this often referred to subject. Living in the UK I get very sensitive to all
the " conspiracy theories" often put about on this subject.

Yes, the British Government did eventually say "enough is enough" and
stopped bailing the factory out.   I honestly think they would have
preferred that it had succeeded. No government wants to see 3000 odd workers
out of such good jobs, particularly in an area like Belfast.

 All the senior employee's  I've spoken to, were in absolutely no doubt that
JZD's attempt at producing his own car was very serious and intended to
succeed. He surrounded himself with some of the best brains in the industry,
he nearly succeeded.  "Politics" doubtless did  became involved.
But JZD new things were very tight, but gambled that increasing production
and employing  yet more workers would make it impossible for the British
Government to refuse more money. Unfortunately he had underestimated  "The
Iron Lady" , Mrs. Thatcher, she went on to make loads more decisions of a
similar nature, which with the benefit of hindsight, were probably correct.

The problem is that "Hindsight" is easy....later!   All any-one can do is
what seems best at that time. Hindsight makes it easy for us all to point
fingers and say if only they had done this instead......

I am still very proud to drive and be involved with the DeLorean Motor Car.

Chris Parnham DOC UK


-----Original Message-----
From: Brian McCool [mailto:bjmccool_at_dml_attbi.com]
Sent: 26 September 2002 23:56
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Downfall of the DMC?


If I had to narrow it down to one specific event that brought the company
down, I would say it was the decision in November of 1981 to double
production of cars from 40 a day to 80 a day. The country went into a
recession and had a very bad winter about a month after this, which affected
every car manufacturer negatively, especially DMC. JZD did this partly to
make the company look more impressive right before a planned public offering
of the company's stock that ended up being canceled. By doubling production
right before a market downturn, working capital was effectively used up, and
the market was flooded with Deloreans that were just sitting at the Quality
Assurance Centers in the US. This started a downward spiral that the company
wasn't able to recover from. A major gamble in the auto industry is to build
cars without adhering to dealer orders. Chrysler got itself into trouble in
the late seventies by doing this. In retrospect, if JZD would have cut
production in half, DMC may have lasted much longer than it did. It's likely
that DMC would have merged with or been bought by another auto company, by
this point. Global mergers have drastically reduced the amount of
independent auto companies. Smaller auto companies face a major problem in
that it takes very large sums of cash to function in the automotive
manufacturing industry, and the little guys don't have very deep pockets.
This was especially true for DMC. Whereas every penny they spent had to be
asked for, the big boys were functioning off of their own cash flow.
-----Original Message-----
From: therealdmcvegas [mailto:DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com]
Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 2:27 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Re: Downfall of the DMC?


I will have to agree with Andy on this one. The best thing to do is to read
the
books available. Specificly, I would stick with "De Lorean", "Hard driving",
"Dream Maker", and "Stainless Steel Illusion"..  These are the best books,
and
to get the full effect, I would reccomend reading them in that order. Once
you're done, read "De Lorean" over again, and alot of bits and pieces from
all
of the books will click together.

Was there any one thing that took DMC down? No. It was unfortunetly a
combination of a number of things that caused the demise. When you start
reading up on the subject, you begin to wonder just how it could have ended.
While there were a some mistakes made here and there in the form of things
that either should, or should not have been done, there wasn't a single
action
that caused any sort of a domino effect.

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Vin 5386 <delorean_stainless_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> Does anyone know the actuall reasons that DMC ended up
> in bankrupcy? When all is said it seems to me that the
> company did quite well in its short time. Was it just
> that the DeLorean as an automoblibe didn't "fit the
> nitch" at that time in history? sorta to much to soon?
> or was it more related to competeing with the larger
> companys? Would be amazing to suspend reality for one
> instance and imagine where the DeLorean would be today
> given it had continuted production.
>
> Todd
> Vin5386
>
> =====





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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 14:06:59 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Downfall of the DMC?

IMHO although there were mistakes made by the management of DMC and 
market forces were against them the single biggest misstep was the 
change in political parties and control of the British Government. 
They were no longer sympathetic to DMC and not only did they not help 
when DMC got into trouble they "helped it along faster downward" by 
insisting DMC hire all of the people it had promised it would (which 
caused production to increase) and then withheld loan payments which 
DMC would have used for operating capital. The proof of how badly the 
Government turned against DMC is that they forced the company into 
bankrupcy, sold it for a pittance (they could have made some deal with 
someone to keep the most modern auto plant in the world active) and 
then scrapped the dies that could have been worth something to 
someone. The government was more interested in burying a relic of the 
previous administration and blaming them for all of the losses. DMC 
was caught in the middle of a fierce poitical battle and was a 
casualty along with the hopes of peace in Northern Ireland for 15 
years.  
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Brian McCool" <bjmccool_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> If I had to narrow it down to one specific event that brought the 
company
> down, I would say it was the decision in November of 1981 to double
> production of cars from 40 a day to 80 a day. The country went into 
a
> recession and had a very bad winter about a month after this, which 
affected
> every car manufacturer negatively, especially DMC. JZD did this 
partly to
> make the company look more impressive right before a planned public 
offering
> of the company's stock that ended up being canceled. By doubling 
production






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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 01:07:09 -0700
From: "The Atkinson Family" <mikeatk_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Parking my Delorean on a Hill

Claude,  Having grown up in a town with hills we were always taught to turn
the wheels into the curb when parking on a hill.  I didn't bother getting
into the direction or whether the car was heading up or down because it was
always into the curb that kept it from going anywhere.  I know what your
saying however a curb did matter.  As you mention yourself if you didn't
have one you might end up with your car inside for the night.  Of course
that would only happen during the winter.

Mike Atkinson
16232






Subject: [DML] Re: Parking my Delorean on a Hill


In dmcnews_at_dml_y, "The Atkinson Family" <mikeatk_at_dml_c wrote: Just a thought, but
what about turning your wheels into the curb so the car can't roll downhill.
That is, if you have a curb.

Mike Atkinson
16232





Mike, It doesn't matter if there is a curb or not if the wheels are
turned,it will hopelly prevent the car from rolling down into on coming
traffic or into your neighbors property,across the street,or if the incline
is going into your living area into your house. Also remember when you park
your Delorean on a incline overnight,(or anytime)that MOST of your oil in
the oil pan is AWAY from your pickup tube/screen in your oil pan,so that
when you start your car you MAY possibly NOT HAVE any oil or low oil
pressure/lube depending on the incline of your driveway.My suggestion is to
either put the car in netural and roll it down to a level area and then
start it,or if you have the side area(s) by your driveway to park your
Delorean sideways,with the nose of the car towards the driveway.The nice
thing about parking it sideways is that people driving by get a nice view of
your Delorean as they drive by.(depending on your driveway)

Claude
000570









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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 02:42:16 -0400
From: Jim Strickland <ihaveanaccount_at_dml_juno.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean Commercial?

I think the Delorean commercial is a great idea!  

So much so that I made one for my car!  

Unfortunately, it is not a typical Delorean :P

I guess some of you have already seen the video, but here's a link if
anyone else is interested.  

www.eliseusa.com/rotary.shtml


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Message: 8
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 00:26:35 EDT
From: wingd2_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: DOA Northwest Passage Event

  Last weekend was the DOA's annual national EXPO type event, this year 
called the DeLorean Northwest Passage, which was run thru Northern Oregon. I 
have a young nephew who is really into Deloreans and just happens to live in 
Hood River Oregon, which was on the tour route for this years event. After 
anxiously waiting all summer for this event to take place, he e-mail me today 
to tell me of his disappointment. He said he spent all day waiting for the 
large parade of Deloreans to come thru town, but in the end only ended up 
seeing 11 cars go thru. Did he miss something ? Was there a different or 
alternate route they decided to take ? What happened ? 
   Was anybody on the list there and can they tell me what happened so I can 
let my nephew know ? How many cars actually attended the event, and what 
happened to the drive/parade thru Hood River to Mt Hood ? His Mom was going 
to drive him up to the lodge at Mt Hood to see all the cars, but after the 
"parade" he decided not to go. I'd like to be able to explain things to him 
if I can. Any info would be appreciated.

   Thanks,  Marty  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 9
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 21:23:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_framezero.com>
Subject: Italdesign D with saddle interior

Hi guys,

I was just looking around online and came across this picture:

http://www.concorso.com/IMAGES/carguydelorean.jpeg

This car is at the Italdesign Museum, somewhere in Italy. I imagine that
this is a prototype car. The seats don't appear to have the production
stitching, but the seats aren't the weird seats that are in the fairly
well circulated prototype pic - the one with the ledge instead of the
passenger kneepad. I can't tell if this has the sliding windows or
tollbooth windows. The picture cuts off RIGHT were you'd be able to tell.

Anyway, I just thought I'd share.

-Christian




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Message: 10
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:06:51 -0400
From: Senatorpack_at_dml_cs.com
Subject: PRV engine control system from LOTUS Cars U.K.

Hello Everyone,

I received this email from an Engineer at Lotus in England. I'm sure that all of our technical knowledge about the DeLorean engine can assist this gentleman about the K-Jetronic management system.

Best Wishes,
Michael R. Pack
RE/MAX COLUMBIA
800-899-7629

Subject:    PRV control system. 
  Date:    Wed, 25 Sep 2002 6:09 EST 
  From:    "Grewcock. Charlie" <CGrewcock_at_dml_lotuscars.co.uk> 
  To:    "'Senatorpack_at_dml_cs.com'" 

Dear all,
   I have recently transplanted a PRV 2.7  from a R25 auto into my 1967
VW camper van,it is coupled it to a Renault GTA gearbox just incase you were
worry about 5 fast reverse gears.
I'm a little concerned that the engine is not running correctly as I have
removed a lot of the what I believe to be controlling systems for the engine
to car loom (Idle control for the auto). The engine does run fine at present
but it seems to be running rich. Does any one know what controls the cold
start injector/system as I think I may have removed it from the engine loom.
Also , what can be done to check if the cold start injector is operating
correctly,where does it take its signal from.

I have Digi pictures of the conversion and will send them soon, Its quiet a
site.
Charlie Grewcock
Product Support Engineer
Lotus Engineering
Hethel
Norwich
Tel. (01953)-608-908
Fax.  (01953)-857-006
Mob (07768)-404-672 
 




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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 11:05:11 -0400
From: Travis Goodwin <tgoodwin_at_dml_vantagep.com>
Subject: RE: Fw: #1209, Travis, and things

Thanks for the kind words.

As most of you have noticed, the pages are gone. We had to reclaim the
space/bandwidth on the server and the files were taken down. A lot of the
changes were lost due to the fact that the editing was done on the server,
which is a big no-no!

I have some of the old files and I am attempting to reconstruct what I had
done before. I moved what I've recovered over to a different server and you
can see it here:

http://tg2.vantagep.com/tm/index.php?page=rearend&&link=1

I also want to detail the creation of my Doc Brown costume for Halloween. My
prototype was finished last year so the new version should be even better!


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marvin [mailto:marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com]
> Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 11:42 AM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [DML] Fw: #1209, Travis, and things
> 
> 
>  Subject: #1209, Travis, and things
> 
>  Travis has enhanced the mystery of imagination by showing us step by
>  step, the construction of the "power plant" used in his version of the
>  futuristic BTTF DeLorean. As with all of us who are owners of this car,
> what we do
>  with it , be it restore or customize, or a touch of each, shows the
> labour
> of
>  love we share. He has the unique capability to explain and show in
>  detail, things that some of us cannot imagine. I was amazed to watch the
> start
>  and final presentation. I hope the next phase will be as interesting.




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Message: 12
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 16:11:21 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Re: Problem with Lockzilla

In theory, zero, in practice it'd be a tiny amount because no components 
are perfect. Mainly because of the capacitors used to fire the relays - 
no capacitor has a perfectly infinite DC resistance, and after 20 years 
can be less than desirable. This is why I replace the capacitors on all 
modules I rebuild.

http://www.dmcnews.com/Techsection/doorlocks.htm

Martin
#1458 & #4426

Joe Bachmann wrote:

>How much is drawn with a stock unit? I imagine it is a very small amount, if any.
>
>JB
>  
>





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Message: 13
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:24:13 -0000
From: "ksgrimsr" <knut.s.grimsrud_at_dml_intel.com>
Subject: Re: Problem with Lockzilla

Dave Swingle has the stock door lock circuit diagram at the link 
Martin points out. The stock circuit has several current leackage 
paths, so I don't think the stock module has a zero draw potential.

A couple examples of leackage paths in the circuit include:
- Path from +12 through R12 through D5 through "lock doors" lamp
- Path from +12 through R2 through D through door switch

Just these two paths should draw about 10mA or so each.

    Knut




--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> In theory, zero, in practice it'd be a tiny amount because no 
components 
> are perfect. Mainly because of the capacitors used to fire the 
relays - 
> no capacitor has a perfectly infinite DC resistance, and after 20 
years 
> can be less than desirable. This is why I replace the capacitors on 
all 
> modules I rebuild.
> 
> http://www.dmcnews.com/Techsection/doorlocks.htm
> 
> Martin
> #1458 & #4426
> 





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Message: 14
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 12:34:25 -0400
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>
Subject: NJ Fall tour Unique "perspective"

Upon talking with some of the other members of the Delorean Mid-Atlantic
club, we thought it would be VERY cool to take some photos from the air
of all our cars lined up in front of John Delorean's old estate!  What a
unique opportunity this would be before the estate is finally sold off
and turned into a golf course!
 
I called a local airport (3 miles from the estate), and the cost for a
quick 1/2 hour flight over the area will be $100.  The plane sits a max
of 4 people (including the pilot).
 
I am looking for two other people (existing club members, or people who
are planning on attending) to share the cost.  If I can get two other
people who will chip in $33 a piece, it makes it worth while.
 
Video taping is also recommended!  So if you have a good video camera
and are interested...let me know!
 
e-mail me on the side, and let me know.  I have to make a reservation
soon.
 
Kevin Abato VIN# 16680
delorean_at_dml_abato.net


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 15
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 16:42:28 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>
Subject: Re: Italdesign D with saddle interior

If this is a prototype car, then it's a pretty late one. Otherwise, it just appears to 
be a modified/customised production car. Albeit a early one, probably.

If you look closely, you can see that the car does indeed have tollboth 
windows.  Also, the clearance light on the front is not pulled flush with the 
facia, there is the normal gap there.

I don't know if it was the camera flash or not, but the interior doesn't appear to 
be a DeLorean color. It's a bit too light for saddle, and a bit too dark from what 
I've seen are in Esprits. If I were to speculate, I'd say it's a custom color. As for 
the seats, who knows where they're from.

The car has seen some use though. You can tell from the hard water stains in 
the SS panels, to the road grime in the wheel wells.

I wonder if someone sent them an e-mail, if they would be kind enough to 
reply with the vin #?

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_f...> wrote:
> Hi guys,
> 
> I was just looking around online and came across this picture:
> 
> http://www.concorso.com/IMAGES/carguydelorean.jpeg
> 
> This car is at the Italdesign Museum, somewhere in Italy. I imagine that
> this is a prototype car. The seats don't appear to have the production
> stitching, but the seats aren't the weird seats that are in the fairly
> well circulated prototype pic - the one with the ledge instead of the
> passenger kneepad. I can't tell if this has the sliding windows or
> tollbooth windows. The picture cuts off RIGHT were you'd be able to tell.
> 
> Anyway, I just thought I'd share.
> 
> -Christian




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Message: 16
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 17:19:31 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Battery load test at home

Although it is tempting to think testing the battery could be this 
simple I don't believe it would be very accurate. Even you admit that 
this test also indicates a possible defective starter. There are just 
too many variables that will interfere with determining the health of 
the battery. The draw of the starter could be higher or lower then 
expected. The connections between the battery and the starter may be 
loose or dirty. The battery may not be fully charged. The engine may 
crank harder or looser then it should. The only way to REALLY test the 
battery is to isolate it from the circuit and test it right at the 
terminals of the battery. What you are really testing here is cranking 
current draw. Many of the electrical problems in the car start with 
the battery just as many of the fuel problems start with the fuel 
tank. The main reason is that these cars just aren't used a lot so the 
storage devices suffer. The batteries don't hold a full charge forever 
and the fuel goes bad in storage. A battery in normal use has a 
lifetime of 4-5 years. Fuel shouldn't be stored for more than 6 
months. Don't follow these guidelines and you can expect problems.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757  



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., dherv10_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Group, The easiest way to load test the battery is in the vehicle.By 
using 
> the starter in the car as the load. Connect a digital volt meter 
across the 
> battery terminals and set the meter on the 20 volt DC scale, 
disconnect the 





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Message: 17
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 19:30:19 -0000
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Italdesign D with saddle interior

On a side note, the car in the back ground looks like the sketch 
drawing of the future 4 door delorean.
On the "prototype" delorean, the wheels are not the early dark color, 
and the fascia has clearly been repainted black, or maybe it came 
that way??  There's not way of knowing anything for sure until 
someone can get the vin number, or some history on it.  Everything is 
speculation until then.

erik


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_l...> wrote:
> If this is a prototype car, then it's a pretty late one. Otherwise, 
it just appears to 
> be a modified/customised production car. Albeit a early one, 
probably.
> 
> If you look closely, you can see that the car does indeed have 
tollboth 
> windows.  Also, the clearance light on the front is not pulled 
flush with the 
> facia, there is the normal gap there.
> 
> I don't know if it was the camera flash or not, but the interior 
doesn't appear to 
> be a DeLorean color. It's a bit too light for saddle, and a bit too 
dark from what 
> I've seen are in Esprits. If I were to speculate, I'd say it's a 
custom color. As for 
> the seats, who knows where they're from.
> 
> The car has seen some use though. You can tell from the hard water 
stains in 
> the SS panels, to the road grime in the wheel wells.
> 
> I wonder if someone sent them an e-mail, if they would be kind 
enough to 
> reply with the vin #?
> 
> -Robert
> vin 6585 "X"
> 
> 
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_f...> wrote:
> > Hi guys,
> > 
> > I was just looking around online and came across this picture:
> > 
> > http://www.concorso.com/IMAGES/carguydelorean.jpeg
> > 
> > This car is at the Italdesign Museum, somewhere in Italy. I 
imagine that
> > this is a prototype car. The seats don't appear to have the 
production
> > stitching, but the seats aren't the weird seats that are in the 
fairly
> > well circulated prototype pic - the one with the ledge instead of 
the
> > passenger kneepad. I can't tell if this has the sliding windows or
> > tollbooth windows. The picture cuts off RIGHT were you'd be able 
to tell.
> > 
> > Anyway, I just thought I'd share.
> > 
> > -Christian




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Message: 18
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 20:12:11 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: PRV engine control system from LOTUS Cars U.K.

I may be qualified to answer this one too...

As many are aware, my D is re-engined with a Volvo PRV. Is certainly
recognizable as PRV, but differs in several respects from DMC's
application. Am missing frequency valve (port on fuel distributor was
never tapped & fitted). Do have a warm up regulator, but it doesn't
look anything like anyone else's. Have experimented running the car
without the idle speed motor. Am no expert, but do have a working
knowledge of the systems that could be used by any DeLorean owner
looking to simplify their vehicle.

Cold start valve: only receives a signal when the starting circuit is
engaged. Needs a ground to actually inject fuel (for some reason
Europeans love to switch the ground, not the hot). Thermal switch does
not close when engine is warm. Switch has it's own heating element to
open during extended cranking even on a cold engine. This bad boy
doesn't fool around -- throws raw gas into the intake. Can flood the
engine very quickly. People who use warm up regulator circuit to
overcome hot start problems often need to crank engine twice: once to
shoot too much gas, swap plugs back, then again to clear everything
out and start the car. If you wire to your VW's starting circuit, make
sure you've included thermal switch to avoid flooding. You could also
trigger manually from a switch on the dash.

Warm up regulator: serves same function as old fashioned choke plate.
Limits air into engine when cold by increasing counter pressure on
piston attached to air sensor. Is a fantasically complicated piece of
hardware (bimetal plates, diaphragms, and heating coils, oh my). Am
surprised mine has survived this long, if it has in fact survived.
Won't really know until weather turns cold. Engine runs fine now
whether regulator is plugged in or not. If your environment is 
moderate, this guy may be optional. But you may need to retain fuel
lines with 22+ psi counter pressure (is that what closes air sensor
plate?). Ask a K Jetronic expert on this one.

Frequency valve: EMISSIONS. Adjusts fuel mixture on the fly by
regulating pressure below diaphrams that feed each cylinder in fuel
distributor. Responds to signal from onboard computer, itself
responding to O2 sensor. I believe a microswitch on the throttle cable
spool shuts it down completely at full pedal. Can guarantee your
engine will run just fine without it because this isn't even an option
on mine.

Idle speed motor: serves same function as cracking throttle plates.
Has  advantage of being variable. As engine loads increase (A/C
compressor, headlights, etc), will increase amount of air let into
engine. Mine works excellent. Experimented running car without it
(that's what  brass screws are for by the throttle plates), but
without variable capacity had to set idle way too high (A/C compressor
kills about 500 rpm). Stock DMC PRV has a microswitch triggered by
closed throttle plate bracket to start motor. Mine is hard wired on
all the time. Wonder what the onbard computer thinks about that! (uses
RPM counter to adjust). Unless you've transplanted the computer in
your VW, you'll have to set idle manually. Could always have two idle
settings for summer and winter.

"CO2 adjusting screw": another fuel mixture adjustment located between
the air sensor and the fuel distributor. Apparently stock DMC PRV has
tamper proof plug in access hole. Mine has a threaded screw. This guy
controls how much piston movement you get inside fuel distributor from
corresponding air sensor movement. Turn in micro movements -- a very
little bit goes a long way.

Of course don't forget the basics: fresh ignition components (don't
overlook resistors, coil and all contacts), ignition timing, A CLEAN
AIR FILTER (for every gallon of gas burned your car sucks down tens of
thousands of gallons of air), no vacuum leaks, etc.

Bottom line: a PRV will probably run fine without cold start valve,
warm up regulator (again, ask expert about minimum counter pressure),
frequency valve, or idle speed motor. But you may sacrifice some
driveability until engine warms up. And without a frequency valve the
thing could fail emissions test unless timing is retarded and/or
mixture is leaned. As you adjust your engine remember you're walking a
fine line between burning too lean (bad idea in an aluminum block) and
burning to rich (dirty engine). 

FWIW: PRV seems to be a hearty little engine. Don't want to burst any
bubbles, but it IS low compression (87 octane isn't high compression
folks). Moving my idle speed motor to the driver's firewall was the
best thing I've ever done for access. Compared to the rocket science
on today's car lots, is mercifully simple. Don't really see why anyone
with moderate mechanic skills couldn't have his engine purring like a
contented kitten.

Good luck with your VeeWee...

Bill Robertson
#5939


>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Senatorpack_at_dml_c... wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I received this email from an Engineer at Lotus in England. I'm sure
that all of our technical knowledge about the DeLorean engine can
assist this gentleman about the K-Jetronic management system.
> 
> Best Wishes,
> Michael R. Pack
> RE/MAX COLUMBIA
> 800-899-7629
> 
> Subject:    PRV control system. 
>   Date:    Wed, 25 Sep 2002 6:09 EST 
>   From:    "Grewcock. Charlie" <CGrewcock_at_dml_l...> 
>   To:    "'Senatorpack_at_dml_c...'" 
> 
> Dear all,
>    I have recently transplanted a PRV 2.7  from a R25 auto into my 1967
> VW camper van,it is coupled it to a Renault GTA gearbox just incase
you were
> worry about 5 fast reverse gears.
> I'm a little concerned that the engine is not running correctly as I
have
> removed a lot of the what I believe to be controlling systems for
the engine
> to car loom (Idle control for the auto). The engine does run fine at
present
> but it seems to be running rich. Does any one know what controls the
cold
> start injector/system as I think I may have removed it from the
engine loom.
> Also , what can be done to check if the cold start injector is operating
> correctly,where does it take its signal from.
> 
> I have Digi pictures of the conversion and will send them soon, Its
quiet a
> site.
> Charlie Grewcock
> Product Support Engineer
> Lotus Engineering
> Hethel
> Norwich
> Tel. (01953)-608-908
> Fax.  (01953)-857-006
> Mob (07768)-404-672




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Message: 19
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 18:52:44 -0000
From: "turbodmc3113" <turbodmc_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Delorean Fall Foliage Tour III

Important news about the DeLorean Fall Foliage Tour.

If you have not made your hotel reservations yet you must do so now! 
There are only a few rooms left and our special rate will expire 
today or tomorrow ($105 + tax includes breakfast for 2 people).
You must tell them you are part of the DeLorean group to get this 
rate.

Note: If you have made a reservation you need to reconfirm it with 
      the hotel (609) 452-7900 

The Princeton Marriott Forestal Village that we are staying at Oct 
19th will be changing management and become a Westin Hotel. This is 
why you should reconfirm your reservations!

If you don't know about the 3rd annual DeLorean Fall Foliage Tour 
here are some of the details.

Date Oct 19th & 20th

We will meet at John DeLoreans former mansion in NJ off route 80 
11:00 AM
Note: I believe this property will be sold soon. This will probably
      be the last time for you to see the original
      DeLorean estate and get a picture of you and your DeLorean at 
      this Historic (at least historic to DeLorean  owners) Property!

I have several events planed at the former the JZD Estate. 

In the late afternoon we will head out to a nearby restaurant for 
Dinner and then to the hotel in Princeton NJ. There is a Polyesters 
Nightclub at the Hotel.

After Breakfast on Sunday we will Caravan to the NJ/ PA Boarder and 
visit New Hope PA.
We will be parking at Lambertville Station on the NJ side of the 
Bridge (Approximate cost $5 for parking).

I look forward to seeing many of you there.

I will be away from my computer this weekend heading down to the 
Bricklin event in Wildwood NJ this weekend. It is at the Ivenhoe 
Motel in north Wildwood NJ 609 522-5874. To get the discount group 
rate tell them you are with the Bricklin group.

I will probably be the only DeLorean at this Bricklin meet so I 
should be easy to find if you want to talk to me.

Regards,

Michael DeLuca
Vin 3113
NY Lic. DLORIANN





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Message: 20
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 19:03:26 -0000
From: "turbodmc3113" <turbodmc_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Fall tour Correction

The JZD Estate is off I-78 not I-80. Sorry about that.

Mike D.




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Message: 21
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:12:56 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: DeLorean Mid-Atlantic Fall Tour Info

All who plan on attending the DeLorean Mid-Atlantic Fall Foliage Tour on October 19/20, please read this ENTIRE message..  (The rest of you can hit DELETE now)


I have spoken to the Westin people to clear up some of the confusion about the hotel.

1.  If you booked a reservation for the Marriott at 201 Village Blvd in Princeton at the special rate of $105 including breakfast, you are all set.  They have 12 reservations that were moved from the Marriott system to the Westin system.  You can call Westin and confirm if you like, but it is not required.

2.  If you booked a reservation for the "Princeton Marriott" at $79 a night, you are currently booked at the Courtyard hotel about 5 miles from where the rest of the group will be staying.  If you want to change your reservation, cancel with Marriott and book your room with Westin (888-627-7036).  Tell them you are with the DeLorean group, and you will be fine.  Because of the confusion, they have extended our deadline to October 4 and have given us an additional 5 rooms.  (We have 20 set aside for us now, there are only 8 left so CALL NOW!)

3.  Some may choose not to stay at the Westin.  The Marriott Courtyard is about 5 miles away.  There are a number of other hotels in the immediate area you can also use that are closer.  I suggest doing a Yahoo yellow pages search for hotels with 201 Village Blvd in Princeton as your starting point to get distances.  

If you are staying at another hotel (or home, for the locals) MAKE SURE MIKE KNOWS, because we have been basing our group size on the number of sold rooms.



SATURDAY EVENT:

For those who have never been to Lamington Farms, it is located near Route 206 and Route 286 on Lamington Road (567 Lamington Road) in Bedminster (07921). Please show up as close to 11AM as possible, dont come too early out of respect for the current residents.  The driveway is easy to miss, so we will hopefully have some kind of marker there that makes it obvious.  Be warned, the driveway is all dirt, and over a mile long so your car WILL GET DIRTY.  (Then Dave can show you how to clean it during his detailing talk!).

We will have access to the home in the earlier part of the day, but later in the afternoon it is likely the building will be locked up.  We have gotten permission to use the property for the afternoon.  (Lets just hope it does not rain).  Rob Grady will give a tech talk, Dave will go over detailing tips, and Mike has planned some kind of blind racing thing.... I dunno either, I am going to wait and see!

For the brave, Kevin would like to fly over the house to take some photos.  He is looking for daredevil partners, so if you have a strong stomach contact him.  I'll just look at the photos. :)


CHANGE OF DINNER PLANS:

The Back In Time cafe was unable to handle our group, so thanks to Kevin Abato, we have reserved space at 6:30PM for 30 people at "Good Time Charlie's" which is about a mile from the hotel.  It will be a pay your own way dinner, with burgers and sandwiches for under $10 and full entries for $16-$20.

Making the drive from Bedminster to Princeton earlier will give us an better opportunity to enjoy the "Fall Foliage" (yea, thats what this tour is for!) on the drive.  Kevin is also planning the scenic route we will take.

It is important that we have an accurate count of people for dinner, to give the final number a week in advance.  If you have not already, please send mail to Mike Deluca (turbodmc"at"hotmail.com) and let him know you will be joining us.  A accurate count will also help finalize the plans for the tour and afternoon events at Lamington Farms.





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Message: 22
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:56:58 -0400
From: RJRavalli_at_dml_AOL.com
Subject: Mirror switch wanted

Does anyone have a gently used mirror switch sitting around that they would part with for around $20?

If so please contact me at RJRavalli_at_dml_aol.com.  Thank you.

Richard



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