From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1282
Date: Thursday, November 21, 2002 6:53 AM

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There are 17 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: New to the group
From: "John Gedeon" <johne_g_at_dml_yahoo.com>

2. Re: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.
From: <dmc4687_at_dml_mindspring.com>

3. Re: New to the group
From: boy1der18_at_dml_aol.com

4. Re: Blue Lite-Up Brakeshoes?? Maybe Rims...?!
From: Robert Greenhaw <deloreandude_at_dml_juno.com>

5. Refinishiung the Glove Box Lid
From: doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com

6. Front Speaker Grills
From: doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com

7. Re: New to the group
From: Steve Stankiewicz <protodelorean_at_dml_yahoo.com>

8. Re: New to the group
From: "mgutkowski_at_dml_cix.co.uk" <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

9. Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

10. Re: New to the group
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>

11. Re: New to the group
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

12. Re: Refinishiung the Glove Box Lid
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>

13. Re: Blue Lite-Up Brakeshoes?? Maybe Rims...?!
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>

14. Re: Blue Lite-Up Brakeshoes?? Maybe Rims...?!
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>

15. Re: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>

16. Re: Refinishiung the Glove Box Lid
From: "twinenginedmc12" <twinenginedmc12_at_dml_gendreaumicro.com>

17. Re: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.
From: William T Wilson <fluffy_at_dml_snurgle.org>





Message: 1
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 23:29:28 -0000
From: "John Gedeon" <johne_g_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: New to the group

Thanks for the info :), 
as far as learning to work on the car is that a complicated task or 
not, ie how big is the learning curve? I am a bright guy just never 
worked on cars much (didnt care enough). If I had a Delorean i would, 
and would like to learn so that I could do it my self.. 

Does any one know of any mechanics in San Diego CA, that have worked 
on deloreans? Where do you start looking for those? just calling car 
mechanics and asking doesn't seem like the best approach but the only 
one I can think of right now.

John
 
--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., RJRavalli_at_dml_A... wrote:
> John, how much time you will have to put into the car, or any older 
car, and whether or not you should feel comfortable driving it around 
often, will depend on a number of major things.  I think the first 
thing most DMLers will tell you is that it depends on how well the 
previous owner(s) have kept up on the car and have put time and money 
into it.  If you get a "project" DeLorean, then obviously you will 
have to put that in yourself, and the car may be sitting for long 
periods of time.  
> 
> But a decently kept DeLorean will run well for you and is amazingly 
not that difficult to take care of.  As you may be able to tell from 
the list and the vendors that are out there, most parts are easily 
available.  Labor costs can hit you hard if you don't do your own 
work, but otherwise people's perception of the car as needing 
*constant* attention and huge amounts of money is somewhat 
misguided.  After all, it's just A CAR, and just like any older car, 
they will need attention from time to time.



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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 22:15:23 -0500
From: <dmc4687_at_dml_mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.

So, with a kit like this on the PRV you don't have to replace any internals
with harder pieces? Forged pistons, lifters, etc.?
A mustang guy at work has been contemplating supercharging his pony but hates
the idea of totally tearing down his engine to do it right and won't do it
wrong. Which brings up another point; have there ever been any supercharging
kits for the PRV? I know they are still exhaust restricted.

On Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:38:03 -0000 d_rex_2002 <rich_at_dml_outernet-tech.net> wrote:

> John,
> 
> There's a new complete kit, in the box, on eBay
> right now.
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=18729688
> 60
> 
> Later,
> Rich W.
> 
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "John"  wrote:
> > Hi,
> > 
> >    Does anyone have any info on where to buy
> the BAE turbo kit



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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 00:04:57 -0500
From: boy1der18_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: New to the group

Hey John!

Welcome to the group!!  
     I'm always glad to see new people interested in the car.  I can answer a few of your questions...  The time a car will take for maintenance and care will vary greatly on what you end up buying.  If you find a car that's been stored and not driven too much, you'll spend quite a bit getting into good running condition (trust me I know!)  
     However, on the other hand, if you find a car with higher mileage that's been driven regularly, you'll spend a lot less (I have experience here too)  Either way, expect to spend around $22-25K to get a reliable daily driver, whether you spend it all at once, or fixin it up.
     If you have any other questions, just ask... we're all pretty helpful.  OH!  Where are you located?  I'll be in AZ in Jan 03.

Ryan Gould
vin 2930(BTTF) & 4547(daily driver)

check out www.d-a-r-t.com



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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 23:57:36 -0600
From: Robert Greenhaw <deloreandude_at_dml_juno.com>
Subject: Re: Blue Lite-Up Brakeshoes?? Maybe Rims...?!

Hey Guys,

Last night I saw a car at a stop sign that had a little blue
neon bulb either behind the rim, or right inside it.  It seemed
to flash or pulse, and responded to speed. (Looked like a 
circle, but as the car stopped I could see it was a little bulb.)

Anyway, I am curious to know  if one of you guys know what
the thing is....and could it be applied to a DeLorean.  It would
make for one awesome effect....especially if you had the car
retrofitted with a BTTF mockup at events!

Later Dayz,
Robert G. 

________________________________________________________________
Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today
Only $9.95 per month!
Visit www.juno.com



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Message: 5
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 08:25:52 EST
From: doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Refinishiung the Glove Box Lid

I just refinished my binnacle and dash board with a grey vinyl.  It was alot 
of work but many people I've taked to say it looks quite good.  The question 
I have is about the glove box lid whisch I am deciding just how to complete.  
Has anyone refinished this themselves?  Has anyone drilled out the pop 
rivets?  How would I be able to reassemble it?

Dave
6530


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 6
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 08:26:49 EST
From: doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Front Speaker Grills

I just refinished my dash and would like some suggestions on speaker grills 
for the front speakers.

Dave
6530


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 7
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 05:27:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve Stankiewicz <protodelorean_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: New to the group

--- John Gedeon <johne_g_at_dml_yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> VIN: Why do you guys list your vin's (I think its
> cool just wondering 
> why?)


Because it's diffucult to scan and attach the Delorean
tatoos we all have!  ; )

Welcome John!

Steve
VIN 02650 ("ProjectDelorean")
http://www.projectdelorean.com



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Message: 8
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:01:12 -0500
From: "mgutkowski_at_dml_cix.co.uk" <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: New to the group

I spent years on the DML before buying my first D, and personally I take
pride in being able to sign my VIN(s). I guess it gives credibility to
posts about the car by pointing out that you do actually own a DeLorean
(though in my case this can mean spouting even more creative nonsense :-D ) 

It's also a way of establishing what factory updates are due on the car -
Someone with a starting problem and a Vin below 2000 (?) may have not had
the starter curcuit update for example.

Martin
#1458
#4426

Original Message:
-----------------
> 
> VIN: Why do you guys list your vin's (I think its
> cool just wondering 
> why?)


--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .





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Message: 9
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:15:00 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.

The quick answer is you don't change any engine internals with this 
kit. The long answer is if you keep the boost low which keeps the 
combustion pressures low you can get get by. On most applications with 
increased pressures (turbos and blowers) the compression ratio is 
reduced so you have less danger of predetonation which will destroy 
the pistons and rings. The camshaft is also usually replaced to change 
the valve timming to further optimize the increased breathing that the 
blower can achieve. On the Delorean it is not recomended to go above 6 
lbs boost and if you can live with less it is safer. I also wouldn't 
recomend sticking a turbo on an automatic, it won't take kindly to the 
increased loads imposed on it and you will have to do something to 
handle the vacuum modulater which needs a vacuum signal, not 6 lbs of 
boost!
 The Island kit is a single turbo and most people with it notice 
"turbo lag". The Legend set-up which has 2 turbos supposedly has a lot 
less lag.
 Another point if you are interested in adding the turbo to your car. 
There will be some machine work to install it like drilling and 
tapping so if you where to remove it the car would not look origional 
anymore and if you kill the turbo they are expensive to have rebuilt. 
The venders get around $1000 to install a turbo kit (just labor) so 
use that as a measure of the amount of work that that is required.
 Mark Levy is our resident expert now on the Island and Legend turbos 
and he can better compare them for you and explain all of the things 
to consider if you are interested in installing a turbo.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., <dmc4687_at_dml_m...> wrote:
> So, with a kit like this on the PRV you don't have to replace any 
internals
> with harder pieces? Forged pistons, lifters, etc.?
> A mustang guy at work has been contemplating supercharging his pony 
but hates
> the idea of totally tearing down his engine to do it right and won't 
do it
> wrong. Which brings up another point; have there ever been any 
supercharging
> kits for the PRV? I know they are still exhaust restricted.



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Message: 10
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 08:23:48 -0700
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>
Subject: Re: New to the group

You're not all that far from Garden Grove up in the LA area. Don Steger and
the DeLorean Motor Center are located there. One of the top shops for
DeLoreans. He quite often has some cars for sale also.

Mark N
VIN 6820

At 11:29 PM 11/19/2002 -0000, you wrote:
<snip>
>Does any one know of any mechanics in San Diego CA, that have worked 
>on deloreans? Where do you start looking for those? just calling car 
>mechanics and asking doesn't seem like the best approach but the only 
>one I can think of right now.
>
>John




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Message: 11
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:21:22 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: New to the group

By looking at the vin you can tell what year the car is and if the 
person is an owner. Of course that wouldn't stop someone from making 
one up but if anyone is that desperate then they will soon get a 
Delorean anyway! It is also a way to keep it in your memory and since 
many of us are so proud of our cars we advertise every chance we get.
David Teitelbaum
Proud owner of vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., Steve Stankiewicz <protodelorean_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> --- John Gedeon <johne_g_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> > 
> > VIN: Why do you guys list your vin's (I think its
> > cool just wondering 
> > why?)
> 
> 
> Because it's diffucult to scan and attach the Delorean
> tatoos we all have!  ; )
> 
> Welcome John!
> 
> Steve
> VIN 02650 ("ProjectDelorean")
> http://www.projectdelorean.com




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Message: 12
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 08:03:07 -0800 (PST)
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Refinishiung the Glove Box Lid

Dave

I'm pleased to hear that you are taking such good care
of 6530.  I loved her for 15 years.

I was never satisfied with the sound out of the front
speakers, either in 6530 or in my current car, 16867. 
So, I installed the "kick panel" speaker boxes and
speakers available from DeLorean Motor Center.  These
include  much better and bigger front speakers, allow
the existing front speakers to act somewhat as
tweeters and look quite stock.  Available in both
black or grey.

I now have awesome sound.

Dick Ryan
Formet VIN 6530
Current VIN 16867

--- doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com wrote:
> I just refinished my binnacle and dash board with a
> grey vinyl.  It was alot 
> of work but many people I've taked to say it looks
> quite good.  The question 
> I have is about the glove box lid whisch I am
> deciding just how to complete.  
> Has anyone refinished this themselves?  Has anyone
> drilled out the pop 
> rivets?  How would I be able to reassemble it?
> 
> Dave
> 6530



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Message: 13
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 08:05:51 -0800 (PST)
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Blue Lite-Up Brakeshoes?? Maybe Rims...?!

{Moderator note - this is one of a bunch of similar responses, so to avoid a whole bunch of essentially identical posts I picked one. Info on the web at tireflys.com, JW Whitney, Walmart etc.....The "creator" is on the DML and will probably speak up at some point as well]


Robert

What you saw was either a "Tirefly" or a knock-off
from it.  This is a product of a DeLorean owner, Dan
Deutsch. And, you're right, on a BTTF car they would
look especially cool.

Dick Ryan

--- Robert Greenhaw <deloreandude_at_dml_juno.com> wrote:
> Hey Guys,
> 
> Last night I saw a car at a stop sign that had a
> little blue
> neon bulb either behind the rim, or right inside it.
>  It seemed
> to flash or pulse, and responded to speed. (Looked
> like a 
> circle, but as the car stopped I could see it was a
> little bulb.)
> 
> Anyway, I am curious to know  if one of you guys
> know what
> the thing is....and could it be applied to a
> DeLorean.  It would
> make for one awesome effect....especially if you had
> the car
> retrofitted with a BTTF mockup at events!
> 
> Later Dayz,
> Robert G. 



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Message: 14
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 08:21:30 -0700
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>
Subject: Re: Blue Lite-Up Brakeshoes?? Maybe Rims...?!

Tireflys. LED valvestem caps. They fit anything that can fit a standard
valvestem cap, so yes, they fit a DeLorean.

http://www.jcwhitney.com/product.jhtml?CATID=194270&BQ=mot

Mark N
VIN 6820



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Message: 15
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 12:42:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.

I don't ususally argue with David, but this time I
must correct some of what he had to say about turbo's.

First, the Island kit is  twin turbo kit.  Island has
never offered a single turbo kit.  Yes, there is some
turbo lag, but it is not significant.  Returning from
turbo to standard is extremely easy and, unless you
have a concours car, no one would ever know.

I have run over 7+ pounds of boost on two different
cars. Between the two cars I accumulated almost
100,000 miles with turbos.  NO cam changes, NO piston
changes, NO rings changes, etc.  Neither engine ever
had "internal engine problems".  There were no
transmission problems, either.  Yes, timing is
changed, but that is by "recurving" the distributor. 

On my first car, an '81 AUTOMATIC, the turbos were
never rebuilt (47,0000 miles).  On my current car, an
'83 
5 speed,  the turbos were rebuilt after 48,000 miles. 
Total rebuild cost(by a DeLorean vendor), parts and
labor, was quite resonable  (cheap, in fact, when you
consider the amount of fun provided by those turbos). 

I do use premium fuel.  I seldom have any
pre-ignition.

Bottom line:  Turbocharging, like any other means of
increasing horsepower, has advantages and
disadvantages.  However, in my opinion, it is a
viable, reliable and satisfactory way of getting to
185-200 hp without basic changes to the PRV engine and
without affecting reliability.

Dick Ryan

--- David Teitelbaum <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net> wrote:
> The quick answer is you don't change any engine
> internals with this 
> kit. The long answer is if you keep the boost low
> which keeps the 



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Message: 16
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:53:19 -0000
From: "twinenginedmc12" <twinenginedmc12_at_dml_gendreaumicro.com>
Subject: Re: Refinishiung the Glove Box Lid

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., doctorDHD_at_dml_a... wrote:
> I just refinished my binnacle and dash board with a grey vinyl.  It 
was alot 
> of work but many people I've taked to say it looks quite good.  The 
question 
> I have is about the glove box lid whisch I am deciding just how to 
complete.  
> Has anyone refinished this themselves?  Has anyone drilled out the 
pop 
> rivets?  How would I be able to reassemble it?
> 
> Dave
> 6530
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Dave.

congratulations on your new dash board finish.  I agree with you that 
it's a lot of work.  The glove box cover isn't nearly as bad.  I did 
mine, and it came out all right.  

Drilling out the rivets is the place to start.  Be very careful not 
to drill too hard.  It would be easy to accidentally pierce the front.
The rivets are 1/8 inch.

The little concave recess, which holds the latch mechanism ( which 
must be removed prior to recovering) is the hardest area to get good 
adhesion.  

After recovering, you can rerivet the back plate, and that'll be 
that.  I'm sure if you can manage the dash, you can manage the glove 
box.  

Rick Gendreau

11472






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Message: 17
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:52:44 -0500 (EST)
From: William T Wilson <fluffy_at_dml_snurgle.org>
Subject: Re: Re: BAE Turbo Charger for the Delorean.

On Wed, 20 Nov 2002, David Teitelbaum wrote:

> pressures low you can get get by. On most applications with increased
> pressures (turbos and blowers) the compression ratio is reduced so you
> have less danger of predetonation which will destroy the pistons and
> rings. The camshaft is also usually replaced to change the valve timming

This is all true but I do not think it is important on the DeLorean.  The
PRV already has a compression ratio of 8.8 (IIRC) which is lower than many
modern turbo cars.  The camshaft on a turbo car is also usually different
but this is mostly for purposes of drivability, not performance.  In fact
in the case of the Supra, for instance, the hot rod cam for the turbo
engine is actually the ordinary naturally aspirated cam for the same
engine!

That doesn't mean you can just increase the boost willy-nilly.  The two
big problems with increasing boost are intercooling and fuel delivery.  
When air is compressed by a turbo (or a supercharger) it heats up and if
it gets too hot it will ignite the fuel simply by being hot rather than
waiting for the spark.  This is very bad.  Without an intercooler, 6 psi
of boost is about the limit.  And the more air you blow into the engine,
the more fuel you need to add to burn.  Not having enough fuel is even
worse than not having enough intercooling.

The DeLorean fuel system is only designed to deliver so much fuel.  It's
plenty for the engine as-designed, but an engine running 10 psi of boost
needs twice as much fuel as a naturally aspirated engine.  A good turbo
kit will increase the fuel delivery (and the Island kit, at least, does
this; I don't know about the BAE but I assume it also does), but there's
only so much that can be done without major system changes.

If a new fuel injection system were adapted and intercoolers added, along
with bigger turbo(s) than found in the BAE or Island kits, there'd be no
reason that 10 psi or more boost couldn't be used.  It should be possible
to extract 250 or 300 HP from the PRV.  But neither the BAE nor Island kit
could do this.  Keep in mind both of these kits are 15 year old designs
and are designed for simplicity, not maximum performance.




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