From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1298
Date: Saturday, December 07, 2002 6:59 AM

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
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There are 15 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Procedure for removing the Rear Fascia?
From: Twilightcall_at_dml_aol.com

2. Re: Calander
From: <cahamond_at_dml_bellsouth.net>

3. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: "James LaLonde" <deloreandmcxii_at_dml_excite.com>

4. soul of a DeLorean
From: "Marvin" <marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com>

5. Re: Snow/Winter tyres.
From: "robert parker" <roberthparker_at_dml_hotmail.com>

6. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: "Stragand, Dave" <dave.stragand_at_dml_ketchum.com>

7. DeLorean on Ebay, inspection
From: "James LaLonde" <deloreandmcxii_at_dml_excite.com>

8. Interior Re-Dye Pictures
From: "silverdelorean2002" <silvercrw646_at_dml_cs.com>

9. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: Farrar Hudkins <fhudkins_at_dml_uno.edu>

10. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: "robert parker" <roberthparker_at_dml_hotmail.com>

11. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: Noah <sitz_at_dml_onastick.net>

12. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: "Donald Ekhoff" <ekhoff_at_dml_seagullsolutions.net>

13. RE: Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: "Scott Mueller" <scott.a.mueller_at_dml_mchsi.com>

14. Re: Calendar
From: "gullwingmagazine" <gullwingmagazine_at_dml_juno.com>

15. Re: DeLorean's Soul
From: "treehouse2000us" <treehouse2000us_at_dml_yahoo.com>





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 08:27:16 EST
From: Twilightcall_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Procedure for removing the Rear Fascia?

I was wondering if someone could write up a procedure for removing the rear 
fascia?  How long does it normally take for removal?  Is there anything to 
watch out for?  Thanks for the help, GREG



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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 9:49:52 -0500
From: <cahamond_at_dml_bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Calander

Where do we send the photos?
> 
> From: "gullwingmagazine" <gullwingmagazine_at_dml_juno.com>
> Date: 2002/12/05 Thu PM 07:47:42 EST
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [DML] Calander
> 
> DML Members
> 
> We are putting together a 2003 Delorean Calander that should go out 
> with our first issue of Gullwing Magazine.
> 
> If you have that special shot that you think is calander material and 
> would like to send it in for consideration...now is the time!  If you 
> have a pic that helps depict the season... spring, summer, fall, 
> winter (D-Rex this is where you come in) that would be great.  Dont 
> be bashful.  We will look at everything from Concours to Custom and 
> the daily drivers to.  Please include a short bio of yourself and the 
> car.

[moderator snip]



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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 15:34:50 -0000
From: "James LaLonde" <deloreandmcxii_at_dml_excite.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

[Moderator Note: This very strange subject instantly turned a slow week into a busy week.  This can't go on for long.  Make your comments now, since I will close this thread before Monday.    -Mike Substelny, DML moderator team]

Who said I /havn't/ had too much to Drink?

Ok so I see there are being two possiblities; (again assume the DMC 
has a spirit.. which [i think we all realize] it doesn't)

1, there is some piece buried deep inside car - that IS the car. All 
other things can be replaced, but these piece is what defines who and 
what this particular car is. If replaced the car will no longer be 
4009. (be this physical or metaphysical... brain or soul)
2, all pieces can be replaced. Just not all at the same time. If you 
replace a fuel pump of 4009 with the one you got from 1697, has not 
the fuel pump now become a part of 4009? Now the fuel pump is infused 
with 4009's soul. All parts could be replaced in this manner, and 
still the car would be 4009

In reality, indeed it *US* that give the car it's soul. Each car's 
heart and soul live within the love and care of it's owner. Which 
really defines what we as DeLorean owners, and all car enthusiasts, 
feel toward our cars. It is rare that you will find a Toyota Camry 
owner pondering over his car's soul - even a Lamborghini owner tends 
not to be so devote (save perhaps with cars before the Countach).

As long as everyone in the world realize the WE (not them) drive the 
single more perfect and best automobile ever crafted - everything 
else will fall into place. ONE DAY SOON, FRIENDS, we shall rule with 
a stainless steel fist, and those who do not drive cars that resist 
(!?) corrosion and whose doors open at unconvestional angles will 
fall to thier knees at sheer wieght of the souls and power that live 
within our cars!!

James 4009

PS: Mwa ha ha ha ha ha ha

PPS: ha

PPPS: /hic/




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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 11:00:56 -0500
From: "Marvin" <marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com>
Subject: soul of a DeLorean

Some of you, out there, have too much time on your hands!



Marv
# 17707
marv_at_dml_printeddrinkware.com 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 17:01:04 +0000
From: "robert parker" <roberthparker_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Snow/Winter tyres.

Re: below.   "Horsefeathers"!   Several years back my "P.O.S." lost its fuel 
pump during one of the coldest, snowiest Februarys in Tulsa, Oklahoma 
history. For some reason I couldn't drive my DMC, so I had to rely on my 
1938 Buick Cpe. for several weeks. "Ol' Blue" performed quite well in cold, 
snow, & ice for an "old car".      When my DMC was new, I drove it ALL the 
time (rain,sun,ice,snow) on its NCT's with excellent results. It handled (& 
still does) like it was made for the road. (Well, it WAS!!)  So, enjoy your 
flight- anytime!    Drive Stainless     Robert  VIN 6924






From: "mantrobax" <ownerof_at_dml_delorean.com>
Reply-To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Snow/Winter tyres.
Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 15:06:35 -0000

> I'm sure I will be barked at for asking this...
> I know you shouldn't be driving the DMC during winter, its simply not
> good for a 20 year old car...
> I have my reasons and will have to move it a few times during winter,
> and frankly I don't think I would last without taking her for a drive
> during the next few months.

[moderator snip]



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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 12:04:24 -0500
From: "Stragand, Dave" <dave.stragand_at_dml_ketchum.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

BondAtomic_at_dml_aol.com wrote: 

> I guess the best way for me to describe it is in the movie
"Christine."
> The kid restoring the 1958 Plymouth Fury may have gone through it
quite
> a bit, replacing old/damaged parts and such, but the evil soul of the
car
> was alive. 

Ah... Now we're getting into my area.  I own both a "Christine" and a
DeLorean, so I have some knowledge of the subject. (I'm not kidding).

Mechanical objects do not have a soul; we place a personification of one
upon them.  Any soul you see in the car is a reflection of your own
thoughts and feelings about it.  Thus, the better you make both yourself
and your car, the better it's 'soul' becomes.  I've written about this
before: http://www.projectvixen.com/zen.htm

Legally, however, the definition is a different story.  It's generally
either the 'cab' or the frame which legally is the vehicle, and this
varies from state to state.  The majority of states proclaim the cab,
with it's attached VIN, as the legal entity of 'vehicle'.

-Dave
VIN #05927
http://www.projectvixen.com
DMC & Christine Pics:
http://www.projectvixen.com/week134.htm and
http://www.projectvixen.com/week138.htm



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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 17:56:14 -0000
From: "James LaLonde" <deloreandmcxii_at_dml_excite.com>
Subject: DeLorean on Ebay, inspection

there is a nice (looking) DeLorean on ebay in Inkster, Mi.
Just in case anyone is looking I'm right next to inkster and can 
check this car out for you if you like!

thought I'd offer.

seeya!
James L 4009 




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Message: 8
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 18:18:27 -0000
From: "silverdelorean2002" <silvercrw646_at_dml_cs.com>
Subject: Interior Re-Dye Pictures

i have posted pictures of before and after of my Interior Re-dye job. 
hte only thing left to do is put on the new seat covers. The brand 
new leather should be here soon. Its in the photos section under 
interior Re-Dye. If you have a fast connection click the thumbnail 
once and click again when it gets bigger to see the full size pic.



Jon
vin# 10103




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Message: 9
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 12:27:16 -0600
From: Farrar Hudkins <fhudkins_at_dml_uno.edu>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

/comes out of lurk mode for a little philosophy/

> In fact, over the course of 50 years I could go through the car and
> practically replace EVERY part of the car, and yet she would retain
> the vin 4009. Putting aside such trite things as "the law" or "common
> sense"; why is it that a car that (hypothetically) 50 years ago
> consisted of completely different parts... is still consider by the
> owners and world at large to be the SAME CAR?

James, 

Look at it this way: If I had my kidneys, liver, heart, lungs, and upper
intestine replaced, and had a few prosthetic limbs, wouldn't I still be
me? What matters is that if it's your car, it's your car, and what
others think of it isn't really that important. If you're going after it
from a VIN point of view, then you'd have to say you still own VIN XXXX
because your plates still say that, and even though not everything is
original, what's left of the "original" car is still intact, which is
more than you could say for any of the parts you've replaced, destroyed,
sold, melted, whatever. So it's your car, and it's the same VIN it
always has been. And if you're a pantheist or have a similar belief that
your car has a soul, who's to say you're wrong or right? Believe what
you believe; it certainly won't hurt anyone to believe that cars have
souls. But of course the most important thing is that a.) it's your car
and b.) unlike some of us, your girlfriend doesn't say "I still like my
Mustang better." :P

Kind regards and all the best for the holidays,
Farrar in New Orleans

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 10
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 18:56:11 +0000
From: "robert parker" <roberthparker_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

Good anamatapea. (sp?)   Now, reverse it.  If one receives a heart, lung, 
liver, or kidney transplant, and/or loses a spleen, appendix, or yards of 
intestine, are they the same person?   Ask them...      My cars will always 
BE my cars.     Drive Stainless    Robert  VIN 6924




From: "James LaLonde" <deloreandmcxii_at_dml_excite.com>
Reply-To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] DeLorean's Soul
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 17:56:48 -0000

> This is an interesting question that my girlfriend and I were
> pondering over the other night. It suppose it could be applied to any
> car, but moreso to a rare (some would call it an endangered species
> of) car such as ours.

[moderator snip]



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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 14:16:21 -0500
From: Noah <sitz_at_dml_onastick.net>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

On Thu, Dec 05, 2002 at 08:53:01PM -0800, john fredt wrote:
> 
>  
> This is an easy one,its not the same car anymore when the doors are replaced.

How are we defining replaced? Rich's convertible sure looks like a DMC
to me... =)

Noah
#2867



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Message: 12
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 12:37:46 -0800
From: "Donald Ekhoff" <ekhoff_at_dml_seagullsolutions.net>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

As an analogy to the human body, it is not the originality of all the
components but the path that has been taken to get there.  The human body
continuously replaces itself , cell by cell.  We change as we get older but
do not change our identity (even without a VIN #).  As long as the lump of
parts, designated as VIN 9XXX, generally remains a lump than it retains it's
identity.  If it gets "parted out" (dies) than it looses it's identity.

Don't know if this helps or not.

Don E.
(four D's)

----- Original Message -----
From: <RJRavalli_at_dml_AOL.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 4:56 PM
Subject: Re: [DML] DeLorean's Soul


> James, interesting--I never knew there could be such a thing as DeLorean
philosophy/metaphysics.  So if you close a DeLorean gull wing door in a
forest, does it make a sound? :)
>
> Honestly, I have no answer to your question--but I would start with asking
if it is ever feasible that an owner *would* replace *every single* but of
car that is original, meaning all screws, carpet pieces, knobs, windows,
etc.  If it is probably never going to happen (?), then maybe we never need
to worry about the issue, because as long as *something* original exists, it
can still be considered its VIN number, right?
>
> Richard



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Message: 13
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 16:11:12 -0600
From: "Scott Mueller" <scott.a.mueller_at_dml_mchsi.com>
Subject: RE: Re: DeLorean's Soul

DeLorean's Soul?

Are you guy's nuts?

You remind me of a College English Professor I had.  He assigned us the
book, "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance".  Now I love working
on mechanical things, so I thought that this would be a good book.  Was
I wrong.

Get a life.

;>))

Scott Mueller
002981
RNDOLA




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Message: 14
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 23:20:51 -0000
From: "gullwingmagazine" <gullwingmagazine_at_dml_juno.com>
Subject: Re: Calendar

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., <cahamond_at_dml_b...> wrote:
Where do we send the photos?

E-mail address:
gullwingmagazine(at)juno.com

Snail mail address:
Gullwing Magazine
P.O. Box 991
St. Peters, MO 63376





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Message: 15
Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 23:28:27 -0000
From: "treehouse2000us" <treehouse2000us_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean's Soul

I have no idea how to spell that word!  But the point I think James L 
is making is more on a non biological level.  Instead of a person 
recieving a 'transplant', what about an electronic heart, an iron 
lung, a stainless steel kidney and a used spleen and so on...   Well, 
its not that great a comparison versus a human/car, ooops, Icon!, but 
I can see both ways.  

To me, replacing about everything in a car, and its still the same 
car, provided the vin hasnt been changed, is all right.  If that has, 
something illegal has gone on.  A DeLorean is a DeLorean, whether is 
be a 5xx vin or something around 20xxx.  Replace it with the proper 
parts and your D wont have rejection syndrome. 

On a final note, if I had a heart transplant, do I turn into the guy 
who gave me the heart?

Tom Porter/Maine
Vin: Summer/Fall 2003


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "robert parker" <roberthparker_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> Good anamatapea. (sp?)   Now, reverse it.  If one receives a heart, 
> lung, liver, or kidney transplant, and/or loses a spleen, appendix,
> or yards of intestine, are they the same person?   Ask them...
> My cars will always BE my cars.
>
> Drive Stainless    Robert  VIN 6924

[moderator snip]




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