From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 949
Date: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 1:44 PM

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderator_at_dml_dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

There are 22 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. DeLorean - In Style
From: "Montgomery, Ken" <kenm_at_dml_csus.edu>

2. Today the first of many
From: "Paul Salsbury" <paul.salsbury_at_dml_btinternet.com>

3. Starting Problem
From: "Jason Jones" <jason_at_dml_pcupgraders.com>

4. RE: Cristina Ferrare DeLorean book
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_hscis.net>

5. Starting Problem ----- *Update*
From: "Jason Jones" <jason_at_dml_pcupgraders.com>

6. Low Voltage at Idle
From: "dsscid" <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>

7. Re: Starting Problem ----- *Update*
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>

8. Re: Starting Problem ----- *Update*
From: "dmc6960" <ultra_at_dml_isd.net>

9. DeLorean Interview
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>

10. Re: Low Voltage at Idle
From: Les Huckins <jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net>

11. Re: Low Voltage at Idle
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_sybercom.net>

12. Re: Today the first of many
From: "tmpintnl" <tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com>

13. Re: Early passenger door for sale.
From: Jack The Stripper <motti_at_dml_optonline.net>

14. Re: Starting Problem ----- *Update*
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

15. Re: Low Voltage at Idle
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

16. Re: Re: Today the first of many
From: Paul Salsbury <paul.salsbury_at_dml_btinternet.com>

17. RE: Today the first of many
From: "Scott Mueller" <scott.a.mueller_at_dml_att.net>

18. RE: Early passenger door for sale.
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

19. poor acceleration... maybe she's just sleepy.. fuel and etc.
From: James LaLonde <krfds_at_dml_yahoo.com>

20. Re: Re: Low Voltage at Idle
From: shain_at_dml_elecmods.com

21. New Photo of the month!
From: "Tamir Ardon" <tamir_at_dml_entermyworld.com>

22. Re: DeLorean Interview
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>





Message: 1
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 08:54:24 -0800
From: "Montgomery, Ken" <kenm_at_dml_csus.edu>
Subject: DeLorean - In Style

     As we all know, our cars have class and sophistication, but now the
fashion world agrees.

On page 226 of the April 2002 issue of 'In Style' (with Ashley Judd on the
cover), Actress Amanda Peet can be seen posing with a DeLorean somewhere out
in the desert. It has the stainless bumper lettering and they did some
serious Photoshop work and turned the entire license plate area into the
squares found on each side of the license plate holder.

Does anyone have any idea who's car it is?

Ken



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 2
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 17:47:55 -0000
From: "Paul Salsbury" <paul.salsbury_at_dml_btinternet.com>
Subject: Today the first of many

AS the subject says"today was the first of many" happy days of driving my
Delorean.

After 9 month of owning my car today I took her to work for her first run
out in the 'wild' legally, taxed and MOT'd and didn't that feel just great!!

I won't go into all the stories how people stared and crowded round each
time I parked however I will ask a question of something that really bugged
me.

I ran the car to work 20miles, no problems there she sat for 5 hours. I then
had to go to another stop 30 miles away, again no problems, about 20 min
after parking I took some people out to see her, and to my horror she was
dripping underneath (coolant) this progressively got worse until it was a
steady stream, eventually stopping when there was none left.
I've just left, however before leaving I topped her back up with coolant
checked underneath, no drips and set off. I've just driven 23 miles home
parked up when back half an hour later ....... Guess what, NO leaks or
drips?????

Any Ideas, I have an over heat self bleeding system on the car, the
otterstat is fine the fans work and the coolant is being pumped around the
system OK.

Phantom leak???

Cheers
Paul
#6463

www.paul.salsbury.btinternet.co.uk




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 3
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 12:26:19 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time)
From: "Jason Jones" <jason_at_dml_pcupgraders.com>
Subject: Starting Problem



Hello all,  I was the one who last week posted the E-Check Not Passing issue
  Thanks for all your suggestions and support I got a New Catalytic
converter and O2 Sensor after I installed them I later discovered that the
O2 sensor was not plugged in all the way  (If you do not already know it
plugs into a "Socket" in the Driver's side Rear fender well.  I guess some
road debris knocked it off... I replaced them anyway simply because it did
not hurt anything and and I passed with Flying colors But my Gas Cap failed.
.. _at_dml_#$##  anyway I will be buying a new one soon....  any suggestions....



My question this time for all you seasoned owners is on my way leaving the
Emission station I tried to start my D and It would NOT start the engine
turned over but I did not hear that familiar Fuel Pump energizing sound.  I
was told by the last owner the Fuel System had been redone but I am not 100%
sure on that however I will be checking the receipts he gave me tonight.... 
after an hour I turned the key heard the Fuel pump and it started right up..
   Ugh one thing after another.....  :)  I have heard of the "Hot" start
problems and seen some posting on fuel pumps etc...  what do you all
recommend I do first and what do you think is the problem?



Jason S. Jones

#3121

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 12:20:02 -0800
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayf_at_dml_hscis.net>
Subject: RE: Cristina Ferrare DeLorean book

Yes, I agree, it is an interesting book for DeLorean fans that have
everything!!   Beautiful pictures of the happy family, but of course it was
18 years ago and we have all gotten older.  We see stuff about John Z and
daughter Kathryn quite a bit but I have wondered what is happening with son
Zachary.  Cristina had a  weekly home show on TV fairly recently that we
watched a lot.    I knew about the book and asked for it from Amazon and
forgot about it......about three years ago they found me one and I could not
believe the price was $6.00.  Did you beat that Walt?    Ha.  One time on
Cristina's show someone mentioned the DeLorean name and she said "that is a
bad word in our family and we don't talk about that"!!   My wife said the
book was really dated tho as to the fashions etc.  But then aren't we all!!

Murray
Vin: 05962
Lic:  DMC-XII





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 5
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 15:34:05 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time)
From: "Jason Jones" <jason_at_dml_pcupgraders.com>
Subject: Starting Problem ----- *Update*



I Checked the RPM Relay and it appears to be working.... i.e it clicks when
I turn the ignition....   Of course the problem is not happening right now, 
 so it's hard to "Try" something.  When it wasn't working I DID feel the
relay and it Felt  like it was working and I heard it click however when
this happened,  I DID NOT hear the Fuel pump energize.



Some other information:



The car was running about 45 min before it was turned off it was off for
about 5 min before trying to start it up again... it had to sit for about 30
min until it started up again.  and each time I tried I listened for the 2 -
3 second fuel pump sound and never heard it until after about 30 min... I
DID hear and felt the relay click each time.  Not sure this really means
anything but I want to make sure everyone knew this. Also the Engine DID
crank so (correct me if i am wrong) ..... think this rules out the Hot start
issue as I have read this is a Starting/Cranking Issue not a Fuel Pump.... 
I also read something about an Inertia switch however I think the car would
never start until it was fixed so I don't think the intermittent starting
problem would be related to it...although I am no expert..... 



 Hope this extra Information helps



Thanks again everyone



Jason S. Jones

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 20:58:17 -0000
From: "dsscid" <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>
Subject: Low Voltage at Idle

Hello Everyone,

Recently (probably ever since i got the new alternator) i have been 
experiancing low voltage when i'm at an idle.  The volatge at idle 
has been roughly around 8-10 volts, and as soon as i accelerate it 
jumps to to 12-14 volts depending on what is on in my car.  I took 
the car to the place made sure everything was on ok,  he insisted 
that I check the connections.  So every ground connection, power 
connection etc. on my car has been removed, cleaned, and replaced as 
needed.  Still low power at idle.  I tightened the belt, check the 
dash light and everything seems well.  I am reading little over 12v 
at the battery (engine off) and between 10-12 volts at the alternator 
when running.  Anyone have any ideas.  I just spent a few hours today 
running an additional ground wire from the battery to the frame in 
the rear (just in case).  BTW, i have a brand new ac/delco 140 amp 
alternator.

- Shain
#10140




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 7
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 16:22:36 -0700
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>
Subject: Re: Starting Problem ----- *Update*

My guess would have to go to the fuel accumulator. It's more or less a
check valve to keep pressure in the system for warm starts. It's located
inside the frame up in the center of the car just underneath where the
ashtray is on the inside.

My car did this a couple of years ago. It would start just after running.
And it would start after sitting for about an hour or more. But it would
not start after sitting for 20-40 minutes. I replaced the accumulator and
it's been fine ever since. Many of these are going bad after 20 years in
the cars.

Your problem COULD be that the fuel pump is getting hot and not running
until it cools back down, if you're sure that it isn't running when trying
to start the car. Keep in mind that it normally only runs for about 3
seconds when the key is turned on then doesn't run again.

Just my $.02.

Mark N
VIN 6820



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 8
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 23:09:21 -0000
From: "dmc6960" <ultra_at_dml_isd.net>
Subject: Re: Starting Problem ----- *Update*

The most likely cause of your problem is the fuel accumulator.  The 
lesser likely but still possible cause could be the check valve on the 
fuel pump.  Some RPM relays do not always activate the fuel pump for a 
few seconds when turned on.  Mine for instance, will not do it on the 
first turn to IGN II, but if you rapidly turn the key between IGN 0 
and IGN II, It will activate the fuel pump for those 2-3 seconds.

Another thing you might try when the car wont start, is swapping the 
CPR electrical connector onto the cold start valve.  To do this, 
unplug both the blue plug on top of the engine sticking right out at 
you, and also the grey plug on the CPR which is located on the 
driver's side cam cover (right behind the oil filler neck).  Plug the 
grey plug where the blue one went, and leave the blue one hanging.  Go 
back and start the car.  It should start right away, and once it does 
emmediately go back and unplug the grey plug from the blue cold start 
valve or you'll flood the engine.  The engine will stay running just 
fine.  Then simply plug both blue and grey back to where they belong. 
 (Somebody should really take some pictures describing this procedure. 
 I would do it myself, but my car is still in cold storage miles away 
from me).

This is known as the "hot start quick fix", to get the car running 
when you really need it to.  If this doesn't start the car when its 
being stubborn, you probably have a bigger problem somewhere.  Good 
luck. 

Jim Reeve
MNDMC - Minnesota DeLorean Club
DMC-6960



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 17:30:42 -0600
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>
Subject: DeLorean Interview

The current issue of Ward's Autoworld, a trade magazine for the auto
industry, has an interview with John DeLorean done this past January. If you
can find one it's interesting in that he expresses his views on the industry
today and some of his refections of past industry leaders he was associated
with. A side bar comments on his own car, the DMC12, and while it doesn't
say much, none of it it negative.

Bruce Benson




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 16:36:53 +0000
From: Les Huckins <jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net>
Subject: Re: Low Voltage at Idle

Shain, try bridging the POSITIVE cable, you have possibly a unique situation.  Once in a
great while there is a poor connection between the cable and the cable end, can be either
cable.  Jumper cable will work fine for the test.

dsscid wrote:

> Hello Everyone,
>
> Recently (probably ever since i got the new alternator) i have been
> experiancing low voltage when i'm at an idle. 



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 19:39:48 -0500
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_sybercom.net>
Subject: Re: Low Voltage at Idle

With a fully charged battery and everything turned off (AC, radio, heater
fan, radiator fans) you should be reading a minimum of 13 volts at the
alternator at idle. Assuming your volt meter is calibrated correctly it
sounds like your 140amp isn't.


> Hello Everyone,
>
> Recently (probably ever since i got the new alternator) i have been
> experiancing low voltage when i'm at an idle.  The volatge at idle
> has been roughly around 8-10 volts,
> - Shain
> #10140






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 12
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 23:59:12 -0000
From: "tmpintnl" <tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com>
Subject: Re: Today the first of many

Paul - I'll just spin this idea out to you ... perhaps you filled 
the coolant bottle completely to the top.  The system requires a 
little room for the coolant to expand, so you should only maintain 
a level of about 1 to 1.5 inches of coolant in the bottle when 
cool.  The rest of the volume can be taken up from expansion when 
the coolant gets hot.  Was the stream of coolant coming from the 
right rear of the car, or from some other location?  That is where 
the overflow tube should be routed.  If there is some other factor 
involved, then further investigation is necessary.

Toby Peterson  VIN 2248
Winged1

>to my horror she was dripping underneath (coolant) this progressively 
>got worse until it was a steady stream, eventually stopping when 
>there was none left.





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 13
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 22:52:22 -0800
From: Jack The Stripper <motti_at_dml_optonline.net>
Subject: Re: Early passenger door for sale.

What's the difference between the earlier doors and the later doors?

--Joe

> Message: 13
>    From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
> Subject: Early passenger door for sale.
> 
> I have a passenger door in my garage that was purchased from the Legend Industries "fire sale".  It is a early good (500 Vin series) complete with windows and locks. 




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 14
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 04:52:22 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Starting Problem ----- *Update*

It still sounds like the classic hot-start problem. It will crank well 
but not start after it is hot and when cooled off it starts right up. 
It will usually turn out to be either or both the fuel accumulater and 
the check valve in the fuel pump. Remove the return line at the 
accumulater and if fuel comes out of the accumulater it's diagraham is 
gone. Repalce it and see if that is enough. Be careful with the fuel 
lines as if you damage them you have to lift the body to replace them! 
While you are underneath replacing the fuel filter is a good idea 
especially if the accumulater went bad as small chunks of the rubber 
diaghram will be caught up in it.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Jason Jones" <jason_at_dml_p...> wrote:
> 
> I Checked the RPM Relay and it appears to be working.... i.e it 
clicks when I turn the ignition....   Of course the problem is not happening 
right now, so it's hard to "Try" something.



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 15
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 04:58:58 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Low Voltage at Idle

Causes for low voltage at idle

Wrong pulley on alternater
Dirty ground connections
Too much load at idle (a/c lights,radio, cooling fans etc all on at 
once)
Bad battery or dirty connections
Blown diodes in alternater causing low output
With the alternater putting out voltage with a fully charged battery 
should be about 13.5-14.5 volts at the alternater with low ripple.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "dsscid" <shain_at_dml_e...> wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
> 
> Recently (probably ever since i got the new alternator) i have been 
> experiancing low voltage when i'm at an idle.



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 16
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:55:15 +0000 (GMT)
From: Paul Salsbury <paul.salsbury_at_dml_btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Today the first of many

Thanks for that, I'm pretty sure there was not too
much ccolant in there.
It looked like it was running from the Trailing arm
sheild that is on the bottom of the car on the right
hand side.

Regards

Paul
#6463


 --- tmpintnl <tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com> wrote: > Paul -
I'll just spin this idea out to you ... perhaps you filled 
> the coolant bottle completely to the top.



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 17
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 05:55:25 -0600
From: "Scott Mueller" <scott.a.mueller_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: RE: Today the first of many

Are you sure that it was coolant?
Have you done a pressure test of the cooling system?
What part of the car was the fluid coming from?
Are your radiator caps OK? There are two, one on the header bottle in the
engine compartment and one on the radiator?

Scott Mueller
002981



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 18
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 08:42:16 -0500
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: RE: Early passenger door for sale.

There were some changes made to the latches, and no door guides..  There may be some other stuff, but I don't know for sure.


-----Original Message-----
From: Jack The Stripper [mailto:motti_at_dml_optonline.net]
Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 1:52 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [DML] Early passenger door for sale.


What's the difference between the earlier doors and the later doors?




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 19
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 08:40:20 -0800 (PST)
From: James LaLonde <krfds_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: poor acceleration... maybe she's just sleepy.. fuel and etc.

every morning when i start her for the first time,
my delorean is a little hesitant. If I gun it or right
when i let the clutch back out between gears she
stutters and doesn't want to go. 
Also... nearly all the time, there are spurts when
she's not as peppy-  kinda just sluggish (like
couldn't out-race a pinto kinda sluggish).
Starving for gasoline?
Clutch?
She has brand to pump and brand new clutch.

However... the fuse box is melting (or once did melt a
bit) around the fuse pump fuse, and the metal prongs
don't hold the fuse perfectly.. but sufficent for the
car to run apparantly. Could a poor connection here
cause, perhaps, low voltage at the pump and cause
these symptoms?
This is my next thing to fix on the list :) anyways.

lastly

I installed the new fuel pump a few weeks back, but
didn't put on the  upper boot. (I don't drive in the
rain much anyways.. and plan on putting the thing on
soon)
The clear tube that attaches to the dome-nut has no
hose clamp. None of the ones grady enclosed were that
small. Does it requre one. And the hose is really
stuck on there, is it safe to just cut it, or just try
to pull it off the fitting. (in order to get it
through the upper boot).

Might anyone have some sorta pics/description/drawing
on the how to install the nylon flange that goes on
the bottom of the fuel tank. I want to be ready if i'm
gonna go through the trouble of draining my fuel.

thanks!
James LaLonde 001697



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 20
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 10:29:27 -0500 (EST)
From: shain_at_dml_elecmods.com
Subject: Re: Re: Low Voltage at Idle

Hello,

Would you be able to tell me where to bridge what from where?  I recently in my efforts remove the old jumper from the alt to the the solenoid and replace the 3 starnds with a one larger wire.  Are you referring from the battery to the solenoid?

- Shain

----- In Response To -----

Shain, try bridging the POSITIVE cable, you have possibly a unique situation.  Once in a
great while there is a poor connection between the cable and the cable end, can be either
cable.  Jumper cable will work fine for the test.




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 21
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 01:17:53 -0800
From: "Tamir Ardon" <tamir_at_dml_entermyworld.com>
Subject: New Photo of the month!

Hey Group,

New pic. of the month on the dmcnews website shows the D Rex in contrast to my lowered DeLorean at the Chicago St. Patrick's Day Parade.  Very cool stuff, everyone should check it out when they can.  

And make sure to stop by my site at http://www.entermyworld.com and Rich's Site at http://www.entermyworld.com/rich for more images and video of the parade to be uploaded this week sometime.

Ciao,
Tamir   


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 22
Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 09:50:45 -0600
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean Interview

The DeLorean article can be accessed at www.wardsautoworld.com and then type
delorean in the search box.

Bruce Benson


> The current issue of Ward's Autoworld, a trade magazine for the auto
> industry, has an interview with John DeLorean done this past January.



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/