From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 997
Date: Tuesday, April 23, 2002 5:52 AM

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There are 23 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Clackety clackety clackety?
From: Andrew <aos+yahoo_at_dml_boom.net>

2. Re: Brakes keep locking up
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

3. Re: Front coil springs
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

4. Re: No more lurking for me!
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>

5. Re: my 134a conversion begins...
From: "Chris" <chris_at_dml_internets.freeserve.co.uk>

6. Mileage tracking for the show
From: "Hank Eskin" <heskin_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>

7. Re: Clackety clackety clackety?
From: "adam_one_million" <acprice1_at_dml_hotmail.com>

8. Delorean Car Show 2004
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>

9. Key blanks
From: Les Huckins <jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net>

10. 134a
From: "Mike Cutting" <mcutting_at_dml_nt.net>

11. R-12 WARNING!
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>

12. Re: fan breaker hot - Everything's hot - Driver hot.
From: Steve Peck <stevepeck1_at_dml_yahoo.com>

13. Re: Brakes keep locking up
From: "James LaLonde" <krfds_at_dml_yahoo.com>

14. DeLorean for Sale
From: "Jason Rowe" <rowejj_at_dml_nupoint.net>

15. Re: Clackety clackety clackety?
From: "rendy_cheng" <rcheng_at_dml_eng.umd.edu>

16. Re: Mileage tracking for the show
From: kkoncelik_at_dml_aol.com

17. aluminum reservoir
From: Delorean17_at_dml_aol.com

18. Re: brakes locking up and won't release
From: Steve Peck <stevepeck1_at_dml_yahoo.com>

19. Re: high hydrocarbon in exhaust
From: "rendy_cheng" <rcheng_at_dml_eng.umd.edu>

20. Re: aluminum reservoir
From: jwit6_at_dml_cs.com

21. Brake Pedal Preasure
From: "shainbrannan" <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>

22. Re: Re: brakes locking up and won't release
From: "Payne" <bpayne_at_dml_macnet.com>

23. Re: aluminum reservoir
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>





Message: 1
Date: Sun, 21 Apr 2002 23:08:33 -0500 (CDT)
From: Andrew <aos+yahoo_at_dml_boom.net>
Subject: Re: Clackety clackety clackety?

On Sun, 21 Apr 2002, Patrick Cowan wrote:

> did the noise change pitch with idle advancement?

The noise definitely changed pitch, but did not sound directly
proportional to engine speed.

I drove the car around today for maybe 15 minutes and haven't heard it
again.

-andrew




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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 04:15:20 -0000
From: "jtrealtywebspannet" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Brakes keep locking up

Here is what I would do. First flush out the system with fresh Castrol 
GTLMA DOT 4 brake fluid. If that doesn't help then disconnect and plug 
the vacuum line to the brake booster and go for a drive. If that does 
it you need a new or rebuilt booster. BTW look inside the vacuum hose 
from the booster and if it is wet with brake fluid it is dead anyway. 
My first guess is that the fluid is so contaminated with water that 
when it heats up and boils it is locking the brakes. If the system is 
as bad as I think it might be you will soon be doing a complete 
rebuild of all of the calipers and master cylinder anyway. BTW if it 
is a 5-speed flush the clutch master and slave too. This should be 
done every 2 years as per the owner's manual (flushing that is, not 
rebuilding the system). A brake shop I know says about every 6 months 
or so he has a similar complaint from a customer. It usually turns out 
the customer or the gas station put WINDSHIELD WASHER FLUID into the 
brake master cylinder resovoir!!!!!
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "Payne" <bpayne_at_dml_m...> wrote:
> I must say this is the most frustrating problem I've had with my car 
yet.
> If I drive it for any longer than five minutes, the brakes will lock 
up and
> the pedal get's incredibly stiff with no travel at all.  It seems to 
be
> mostly the front calipers and they will eventually release after 
they cool
> down.  The brake fluid does look rather old and I know it needs to 
be
> flushed, but would that cause them to lock up?  I've driven it every 
day for
> a year and it happened rather suddenly.
> 
> Thanks for your help!
> 
> payne




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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 03:29:12 -0400
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: Front coil springs

Paul,

Save yourself money investing in spring compressors and the time and labor
involved in spring removal not to mention the possibility of serious injury
by having the procedure done by your local suspension service facility. The
DeLorean front springs are considerably more difficult to remove than on
most other cars so if you don't have experience with coil spring removal
leave the job to a pro.

WARNING: As with all springs under tension, BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL. They can
fly off with lethal force! (Auto Service & Repair M.W. Stockel/ MT Stockel)

DMC Joe
Tech Information, DMC Joe Help Club, & Store
"Summer Parts Sale"
http://shopping.oraclesmallbusiness.com/dsvstore
DeLorean Website Directory www.dmc.tv

----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Salsbury" <paul.salsbury_at_dml_btinternet.com>
To: <doc-uk_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>; <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2002 5:28 PM
Subject: [DML] Front coil springs


> Can any one give me a step by step idiots guide to changing front coil
> springs....
>
> I have new springs and fancy doing the job tomorrow.
>
> Thanks
> Paul



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Message: 4
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 03:43:13 -0400
From: "DMC Joe" <dmcjoe_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: No more lurking for me!

Matt,

You asked:
        "I got 5 out of six which isn't bad, but how do you get to the left
front one near the AC compressor? Any special technique? Any method of
taking the least amount of parts off to get to the plug?"

To remove plug # 5 remove the idle speed motor (PM 2/5/0 #10). When removing
this component be careful not to pull the brass tube (PM 2/5/0 #21) away
from the mixture control unit. Re-installation of this tube is difficult and
may require the replacement of the O ring seal. (See dherv10 prior posting
"O Rings & Vacuum leaks")

You additionally asked:
".........are there any blanks from Curtis, ILCO,.."

Yes, Taylor (Volvo) blanks are also compatible with DeLorean keys.

DMC Joe
Tech Information, DMC Joe Help Club, & Store
"Summer Parts Sale"
http://shopping.oraclesmallbusiness.com/dsvstore
DeLorean Website Directory www.dmc.tv

----- Original Message -----
From: "argent486" <argentum_at_dml_hit.net>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2002 10:34 PM
Subject: [DML] No more lurking for me!


> Hello,
>
First objective was to replace the spark plugs. I got 5
> out of six which isn't bad, but how do you get to the left front one
> near the AC compressor? Any special technique? Any method of taking
> the least amount of parts off to get to the plug?
>
> My car has the two key system and I know that the suppliers have
> official blanks for sale. I will probably grab some in the future but
> are there any blanks from Curtis, ILCO, or others that really work?
> With only one set of keys I'm going to have a nightmare of locking
> them in sometime.





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Message: 5
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 09:33:21 +0100
From: "Chris" <chris_at_dml_internets.freeserve.co.uk>
Subject: Re: my 134a conversion begins...

> I've had an even better result: R12 can still be used legally if it's for
a system meant
> to be used with R12... I had mine recharged a few weeks ago for 40.
>
> Needs a vacuum test though :-(

80 is to check the system then gas, it can take over an hour to properly
check the system. Pointless filling a 20yr old system if it all leaks out.

Did you put any dye in?

What do the the vendors use?

Chris S
Vin 16327






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Message: 6
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 08:34:19 -0400
From: "Hank Eskin" <heskin_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Mileage tracking for the show

Hello All,

  I'm still debating whether or not to drive my D to Memphis this summer
(about 2600 r/t miles), but that got me thinking about the TOTAL number of
miles we all collectively are going to put on our cars for the Delorean show
in June.

So, I'm proposing that I can put up a website to allow people to enter their
info (and remain anonymous, if you choose), which will include City and
State of origin, pre-trip estimated mileage, actual starting&ending (or just
total mileage) from the trip, and maybe amount of fuel used and anything
else people may suggest that would be interesting to track. (I have this
thing for websites that track things.. ;) )  I think if we got most people
to enter their information, it would reveal some interesting aggregate info,
and of course, all personal info (like Name and VIN) would be your option to
display, but the aggregate info would be available for all to see (even if
you didn't register).   Once done for this show, it would be easy to modify
for and use for any other Delorean gathering.

If there is enough interest, I'd try to get this up as soon as possible (a
week or so), to give people a chance to enter their estimated mileage.

Thanks,

-Hank Eskin  #1619






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Message: 7
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 11:59:20 -0000
From: "adam_one_million" <acprice1_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Clackety clackety clackety?

Hey Andrew, my car has also made this noise ever since I've had it. 
Sounds like its coming from the rear somehwere, kinda like a rattling 
chain sound? I cant figure out what it is either.

Adam


> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andrew" <aos+yahoo_at_dml_b...>
> To: <dmcnews_at_dml_y...>
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2002 11:12 PM
> Subject: [DML] Clackety clackety clackety?
> 
> 
> > I started hearing a new and distressing noise tonight.  It is best
> > described as sounding like my subject line, and is very metallic 
in tone.



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Message: 8
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 12:44:44 -0000
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Delorean Car Show 2004

Just a reminder:

If anyone would like to go to the Delorean Car Show in 2004....make 
sure you buy out all of Kens raffle tickets at Memphis!!!  The sale 
of these tickets will ensure that we all can meet again in 2004!!

See you all in Memphis!!
Erik Geerdink
4512




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Message: 9
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 06:29:16 +0000
From: Les Huckins <jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net>
Subject: Key blanks

I still have some Ilco blanks, I bought 100 of them, sold most of them
on eBay, have maybe a dozen left.  Two for $4 including shipping if you
want some.  Fits all standard years, there was a stubby 2nd key on the
very earlies, won't fit that one.




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Message: 10
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 14:52:13 -0400
From: "Mike Cutting" <mcutting_at_dml_nt.net>
Subject: 134a

greetings.

2 years ago, i had to have my air-con system re-done and since i am in
canada, r-12 is not obtainable because it is no longer legal here.  the shop
that i deal with retro fitted my system with a product called fR-12.  it's
brand name is frigic.  it works great and is one of the drop-in replacements
for r-12.  all that was needed was to change the input valves on my
compressor.  check out frigic online and try to find a shop that uses it.
the whole conversion process took about 10 minutes!  i am completely happy
with it.

just my $0.02.

mike cutting
11434





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Message: 11
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 11:40:28 -0400
From: "Marc A. Levy" <malevy_at_dml_paramanet.com>
Subject: R-12 WARNING!

Woah!!  

We do this every year.

I agree with David T and DMC Joe, it is best to stick with R-12 in a system designed for it.  Some of the drop-in replacements may be good too, but I have no experience with it.

My warning is always to use PURE R-12!!  Their are a lot of places that sell blends, and some of the blends include PROPANE!  The Propane works great as a R-12 replacement, but a small leak could render you and your DeLorean DEAD.  PLEASE be careful when buying R-12 and think twice about going south of the border for it!


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Les Huckins [mailto:jhuckins_at_dml_cybersurfers.net]
> Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2002 5:43 AM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [DML] R-12
> 
> 
> If you happen to be driving in Mexico and you brought your 
> installation
> connector, R-12 is about $6 (US) a can.
> 



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Message: 12
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 12:00:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steve Peck <stevepeck1_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: fan breaker hot - Everything's hot - Driver hot.


DMC Joe,

Thanks for your reply.  My fans run almost all the time because in SC in April, the compressor rarely shuts off.

I am very concerned about the hot wires.  It has been suggested that one or both of my fans is going bad.  They both start and run strong.  I don't have an ammeter to test current.

It was also suggested that the polarity of the breaker may be backwards.  I confess that I simply plugged it in and turned the AC on to test it.  I'll check that.

It was also suggested as I expected that the fan fail by-pass wiring guage is too small.  I can fabricate a new one, and have not done so yet, because I want to see what else may be the matter before I test it.  Testing requires driving for a half hour, and I fear having to test the fire extinguisher...  

By the way, who will sell me comprehensive insurance?  Nobody will touch me with my wife's driving record.  OK that's another issue entirely.

Is there an alternative fan test that calls only for use of an ohm meter?

I buy almost everything from PJ Grady.  I left a message at PJ Grady's tech info line last week, but nobody called me back.

When fear begins to approach technical abilities, the car gets garaged...

Thanks.

#3302


-Steve Peck


---------------------------------
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 13
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 15:56:39 -0400
From: "James LaLonde" <krfds_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Brakes keep locking up

i just spoke with rob grady on this problem after i replaced my brake
pads/rotors/ and master cyl.
you may have too much fluid in the system... when it heats up it'll expand
and cause the brakes to apply.... it heats up gradually so the brakes apply
gradually. if the master cyl looks too full (anything above the max line is
too full : P ) then use the red cup inside the resevior to spoon out one or
two cup-fulls.
if that doesn't help... you may try looking at the vaccum assitance push
rod. i don't how it would change suddenly but you could try turning it back
one rotation.

if you need help doing those things... i just did them not even 2 weeks
ago... imagine your brakes doing that all of a sudden on the freeway at
70mph.... and having to drive a mile and a half to get to an exit.....
yeah.... fun...

good luck!!
-james lalonde 001697



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Do You Yahoo!?

Get your free _at_dml_yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com






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Message: 14
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 16:26:51 -0700
From: "Jason Rowe" <rowejj_at_dml_nupoint.net>
Subject: DeLorean for Sale

    Hello All,
            I came across this ad in the Indiana Auto-RV paper and thought I'd pass it on
in case someone was looking for a project car. It's in Grovervhill Ohio and they want 
$8,000 for it. Heres what the ad says. 

1981 DELOREAN. 6 cyl., AT, 17,000 mi., stored for 17 years, won't run, 
body perfect. $8,000. Groverhill, OH. (419) 587-3568

The ad and picture of the car can be seen at this link. 

http://63.107.16.25/browser.asp?ADName=BHMDI6520396D&showbanner=0

                                 Have a good day.........................Jason #5903




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 15
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:52:59 -0000
From: "rendy_cheng" <rcheng_at_dml_eng.umd.edu>
Subject: Re: Clackety clackety clackety?

I think it is coming from the metal mesh hitting the engine cover.
There are some metal clips holding those metal mesh.  If there 
is gap between them, it will rattle.

rendy

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_y..., "adam_one_million" <acprice1_at_dml_h...> 
wrote:
> Hey Andrew, my car has also made this noise ever since I've 
had it. 
> Sounds like its coming from the rear somehwere, kinda like a 
rattling 
> chain sound? I cant figure out what it is either.
> 
> Adam
> 
> 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Andrew" <aos+yahoo_at_dml_b...>
> > To: <dmcnews_at_dml_y...>
> > Sent: Saturday, April 20, 2002 11:12 PM
> > Subject: [DML] Clackety clackety clackety?
> > 
> > 
> > > I started hearing a new and distressing noise tonight.  It is 
best
> > > described as sounding like my subject line, and is very 
metallic 
> in tone.




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Message: 16
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 17:45:13 -0400
From: kkoncelik_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Mileage tracking for the show

If you do that I would be interested in having you share that with the group at the show.

Seems like us engineering types like a lot of data

Ken



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Message: 17
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 17:05:36 EDT
From: Delorean17_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: aluminum reservoir

HI,
    My car had an aluminum coolant reservoir on it when I purchased 
it(Delorean ONE part I believe) but it leaks a little bit where the copper 
neck is soldered to the tank.  I removed all of the remaining solder and 
rebrushed the entire tank last night.  I took it to 3 shops today to have the 
neck reinstalled and they said there is no good way to weld or solder brass 
to aluminum and that I should just use Fas-weld steel epoxy to put it back 
on.  Any other ideas before I epoxy the neck back on? I can't weld or solder!


Thanks
David



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Message: 18
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 12:33:31 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steve Peck <stevepeck1_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: brakes locking up and won't release


Your brake master cylinder is trashed.    I chased the same gremlin in my car for a while and finally bought a new MC. 

Mine stuck me IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD during rush hour.  There was no moving the car at all for ten minutes.  Note: Clutches put out a great deal of smoke if you try to move.   That isn't good...  Had to crack open a bleed screw and the car groaned as if it was dead.  Got moving just in time to avoid the shouts of, "Need some Plutonium??"

You can get it from the vendors - DMC Joe now selling it for a great price, or from any local vendor for a 1986 Saab 900.  Different numbers, (different bore) same result.  ($71) That's what I did. No problems.  YMMV.

Good luck.

#3302


-Steve Peck


---------------------------------
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Games - play chess, backgammon, pool and more

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 19
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 00:19:48 -0000
From: "rendy_cheng" <rcheng_at_dml_eng.umd.edu>
Subject: Re: high hydrocarbon in exhaust

<This is from original question poster>
After following the advise on this forum, I have replace the O2 
sensor, spark plugs, spark plug wires, Dis cap, dis rotor.
Earlier today, I had my car smog check again..  Guess what?  It 
failed the test again.  Result from the test are following :

HC (ppm)    Max allow:150     My car: 111,
CO (%)      Max allow:1.50        My car: 0.54
CO2 (%)    Max allow:NA          My car: 13.8
O2 (%)      Max allow:NA          My car: 1.1
RPM                    2466

So... for high RPM, it is okay.  The following values are from idle 
case.

HC (ppm)    Max allow:120     My car: 241 (too high)
CO (%)      Max allow:1.50        My car: 0.67
CO2 (%)    Max allow:NA          My car: 13.4
O2 (%)      Max allow:NA          My car: 1.5
RPM                    734

Other than catalytic converter, what else can be the cause of 
this..

Thanks every one!

rendy  #4220

> Hi
> 
> Yesterday, my Delorean failed the smog check due to high 
hydrocarbon.  The 
> technician played the rpm  little bit but it did not lower the 
hydrocarbon.
>    The technician has suggested me replace the catalytic 
converter.  I 
> thought the catalytic converter support to last forever.  There is 
no leak 
> on my exhaust system.  My car does idle a little low around 600 
rpm.  I 
> also notice a little less power from the engine and higher fuel 
consumption 
> in recent months.  My car is approaching 30k miles and still 
has the 
> original O2 sensor.  Does any one has idea what else I can do 
before I 
> replace the catalytic converter?
> 
> I would like to thank everyone in advance.
> 
> Rendy #4220




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Message: 20
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 20:54:51 EDT
From: jwit6_at_dml_cs.com
Subject: Re: aluminum reservoir

In a message dated 4/22/02 7:29:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
Delorean17_at_dml_aol.com writes:

<< I took it to 3 shops today to have the 
 neck reinstalled and they said there is no good way to weld or solder brass 
 to aluminum and that I should just use Fas-weld steel epoxy to put it back 
 on.  Any other ideas before I epoxy the neck back on? I can't weld or solder!
  >>
Have you considered 328 aluminum brazing rod? It will solder to sheet alum 
and copper i believe with just a propane torch. Available thru J.C Whitney or 
welding rod distributors..
Jim 6147



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Message: 21
Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2002 00:48:06 -0000
From: "shainbrannan" <shain_at_dml_elecmods.com>
Subject: Brake Pedal Preasure

I recently within the last 2 months replace my front calipers, master
cylinder, rebuilt the rear calipers, replace all brake lines with ss
ones, and replaced both hard lines are the trailing arm.  My brakes
work well but I feel that the pedal preasure should be greater then
what it is.  I bled the lines a few times making sure i have no
bubbles, and when bleeding the pedal gets very firm.  Soon as the
engine is on the pedal preasure seems to go down.  I don't think it's
a serious problem,  but I would like to have a pedal that is much
softer.  Is there any way of doing this?  

- Shain
#10140




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Message: 22
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 18:18:22 -0700
From: "Payne" <bpayne_at_dml_macnet.com>
Subject: Re: Re: brakes locking up and won't release

Based on all of your advice and having my car in our shop today, I think
everyone's right about the problem.  First we flushed the system A LOT with
fresh DOT 4, then I went for a drive and noticed the same gradually stiffer
brake pedal.  After a few minutes of driving we pulled it on the lift and
all of the wheels were difficult to turn by hand.  The tech relieved
pressure at a couple of the bleeder screws and the wheels were able to turn
freely again.  So obviously pressure keeps building toward the calipers but
fluid is not returning to the resevoir.  Therefore it's got to be a bad
master cylinder, right?  I hope that's all, however I also need a new right
front caliper since one of the pistons is frozen in place.

Oh well.  I can't help but love the car no matter what happens.  That's
something probably no other car in the world could do for me.

payne







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Message: 23
Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 21:57:03 -0400
From: "Walter Coe" <Whalt_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: Re: aluminum reservoir

There is a special kind of solder that sticks well to non-ferrous alloys.
It's melting temperature is about 300 F degrees less than aluminum and will
join dissimilar metals very well.  It takes some practice to be good at
using it because it doesn't stick very well unless you are just below the
melting point for aluminum.  Just a little too hot and everything quickly
turns into a blob.

I saw some of this solder in the JCWhitney catalog, but couldn't find it
just now.  It's there somewhere.

Walt    Tampa, FL






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