From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1515
Date: Thursday, May 22, 2003 12:05 PM

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There are 13 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: DeLorean Financing
From: Jonas Pitchford <Delorean3543_at_dml_yahoo.com>

2. Re: Re: Alternator time for me.
From: Jonas Pitchford <Delorean3543_at_dml_yahoo.com>

3. How could it happen...TWICE!
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>

4. Re: DeLorean Financing
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>

5. Re: Parts for a sad ebay DMC-12
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>

6. Sad DeLorean & new owners
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>

7. Re: DeLorean Financing
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

8. Cutting off fuel flow to injectors (Re: No Fuel to injectors)
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

9. Anyone in the PA area?!
From: "deloreanz" <deloreanz_at_dml_yahoo.com>

10. First road trip a success!
From: "Adam" <acprice1_at_dml_hotmail.com>

11. Re: Alternator time for me.
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>

12. Re: DeLorean Financing
From: "John Elgersma" <delorean_at_dml_telus.net>

13. Re: Parts for a sad ebay DMC-12
From: "fivetwofive" <CBL302_at_dml_msn.com>





Message: 1
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 19:03:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonas Pitchford <Delorean3543_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: DeLorean Financing

the only solution I found was to pay cash, I could not find a bank that would touch it.

Darin Wolf <son_darin_at_dml_hotmail.com> wrote: It would seem I have run into a minor position here in the good old 
state of Missouri. I want to be able to get a loan on a DeLorean 
that just happens to be sitting in a suitable location. There is 
only one problem.

What I want to know, is why it is that I can get financing on a 
newer vehicle and yet it seems no one here can get loans on one of 
these cars. It would seem that the bank is rather reluctant to help 
in this situation. I wonder how many of you out there have run into 
this kind of situation. What did you have to do to get around to it?

Thanks,



Daemon Wolf.



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Message: 2
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 19:06:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jonas Pitchford <Delorean3543_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Alternator time for me.

I also have a Delco alternator, the regulator went out in 2 weeks. I had a good alternator shop put in a new one and it has worked great for 10 months now
Jonas 3543

Harold McElraft <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com> wrote:
Sonny

I went through 3 Delco alternators and now I am back on old reliable -
the Motorola. I am convinced that the single wire hookup that the 
Delco mods use is the problem because of the digital voltage 
regulator that has to be used. It cannot tolerate the swings in 
voltage without another voltage sensor wire similar to the setup that 
is used in the midstates modification on their web site. I believe if 
I use that setup on my PJ Grady Delco it may last. I just got tired 
of messing with it. SpecialT does rebuild the Motorola's and so does 
DMCH. After all the work so far I am inclined to stay with the 
Motorola. The only reason I may put on the Delco is because I have it 
and it is a sunk cost at this point.

Harold McElraft - 3354



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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 22:08:36 -0400
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>
Subject: How could it happen...TWICE!

As many of you know, someone backed into my Delorean a couple of weeks
ago while I had it parked in front of a relatives house while I was
visiting. 
 
This past saturday (No more then 2 weeks later) a moving truck in my
development backed into my Dodge Intrepid (daily driver) while it was
parked in front of my garage at our apartment building!  :(
 
Danrc30 put it best to me the other day ("Dude...your a cars are
magnets!").
 
Now I have two injured vehicles...what a crappy way to start out the
summer.  :(   Worst of all, the moving truck guys took off without
notifying us.  We found out about an hour later when I went outside and
saw that they hit my car while attempting to turn the truck around.
 
WHAT LUCK I HAVE!  ;)
 
BTW:  I am done now...  Had my 3 bad things in a row. (I scaulded my
foot with hot water 3 weeks ago and got 2nd degree burns)
 
Status:  
Intrepid:  Insurance co. looked at intrepid and is ready to do repairs.
I am trying to get moving company to pay. (wish me luck)
Delorean:  Took it to PJ Grady for Insurance Adjuster to see.  Waiting
on final paperwork so i can have repairs done.
Foot:  All healed up! :)  Back to Mt. Biking!
 
 


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 4
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 23:25:38 -0400
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>
Subject: Re: DeLorean Financing

The problem is they look at the car as being 20 years old and needing 
alot of work meaning you may end up not having the money to pay the loan 
due to putting the money into the car. I myself have a savings account 
going just for the car which I am saving my money up in to purchase one.

Samuel

Darin Wolf wrote:

>It would seem I have run into a minor position here in the good old 
>state of Missouri.  I want to be able to get a loan on a DeLorean 
>that just happens to be sitting in a suitable location.  There is 
>only one problem.
>
>What I want to know, is why it is that I can get financing on a 
>newer vehicle and yet it seems no one here can get loans on one of 
>these cars.  It would seem that the bank is rather reluctant to help 
>in this situation.  I wonder how many of you out there have run into 
>this kind of situation.  What did you have to do to get around to it?
>
>Thanks,
>
>
>
>Daemon Wolf.



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Message: 5
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 03:42:51 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>
Subject: Re: Parts for a sad ebay DMC-12

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "supremeadmiralsenn" <
StadnickAd_at_dml_u...> wrote:
> yes, I know i shouldn't buy a car like this without having some 
> knowledge. But i figure between my dad (who restored a 1972 Chevelle 
> Malibu) and this list, I can get theinfo i need to fix it. Yes it 
> will be time-consuming, yes it will be expensive. I am prepared to 
> put in the time and money to get this car back to at least okay 
> conditiona nd maybe a full restore a couple years down the line. 
> Thanks for all your input, but I just wanted the people with these 
> parts that i need to answer, not opinions.

The biggest part about trying to obtain that first DeLorean is always going to 
be resistance. That just seems to come with the teritory. If you can make it past 
everyone's advice against buying it, then you're half-way there twards owning 
the car. If you've got not only the resources to bring the car back, but the 
passion and determination to bring it back, then nothing will be able to stop 
you from accomplishing your goal!

If you want to get the car, and take a crack at bringing it back, then I say what 
the hell, go for it! You only live once, so do it while you're young and 
confident. If you get the car and decide that it's not what you wanted, oh well. 
At least you can say that you tried, which is more than many others at least get 
to say. But if you succeed.... Let me tell you for a fact that it's a feeling of great 
pride when you get to show up everyone that said that you couldn't do it, and 
you get to prove them wrong. Especially with this car. Many folks out there say 
that it can't be done, or it's not worth it. Will you be the one to prove them 
wrong?

As for restoring the car, you're going to need 4 things for the DeLorean:
1. Workshop Manual.
Esential for learning how to repair things on the car.

2. Parts Catalogue.
When the Workshop Manual is too vague on descriptions of procedures on 
how to disassemble/install components, the Parts Catalogue will pick up the 
slack. A few times I've been left scratching my head about prepair 
descriptions, and the Parts Catalogue has helped clear things up.

3. Internet Connection.
Although admittedly not always 100% accurate, and information can be 
based off of opinion, the internet is a great resource of DeLorean information. 
The DML archive is MASSIVE when it comes to sniffing out info on repair 
procedures, upgrades, etc. And many DMLer's personal web pages also help 
to add to the wealth of information. In many cases I have even found that 
while reseaching issues/subjects on other cars has actually returned hits to 
DeLorean related web pages on Google many of the times that I've searched. 
(R134(a) conversion is a good example).

4. Inspiration.
Everyone needs that certain something to keep them going! Hang up a 
picture to remind you of what your project is going to look like once complete, 
or anything else that works for you. Me? When I get frustrated from working on 
something on my car, I head inside and pop in my copy of either BTTF, or 
Christine into the DVD player, relax, clear my head, and remind myself of why 
I began this task in the first place.


If you do decide to get the car, then I wish you good luck, and honestly do 
want you to succeed with your project!

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"




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Message: 6
Date: Wed, 21 May 2003 21:23:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Sad DeLorean & new owners

Well, I just want to warn you... a DeLorean is no '72 Chevelle. My Dad has restored his '69 Mustang from the ground up all by his self, and he was a mechanic all during the '70s, but my DeLorean still completely baffles him. The DeLorean is NOTHING at all like a good old simple American muscle car for the '60s or '70s. They're overly complex and EXTREMELY fickle little machines. Most car repair shops won't even hear what I have to say after I tell them I have a DeLorean. I really think that if this car were to be brought back to life (something that seems out of the realm of possibility to me), it should be done by someone who knows *DeLoreans* inside and out, and all of their oddities. 

On the other hand... it'd give you hands on experience with DeLoreans... and by the time you're finished with it (if you DO get that far...) you too will D's better than almost anyone. This obviously isn't a car you can beat the $20k rule with (price of car + repairs = $20,000), so anyone who would take this on should *only* do it for the love of the process. I'd be willing to bet one could build a DeLorean from completely NOS parts for cheaper than restoring the parts that are left on this one... LOL. I know you weren't asking for opinions on the subject... but it sounds to me like you have no idea what you're getting yourself into. If you don't know anything about DeLoreans... take a year or two to read the DML, go to DeLorean events, and meet as many DeLorean owners as you possibly can. If you're willing to spend $6,000-$10,000 you'll get a much better project car... at least one that's complete, and likely running.

Louie Golden
VIN 10115

_____________________________________________________________
See what you missed! Read the report on the 2003 DMC Open House Event at http://www.delorean.com/2003event.asp

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Message: 7
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 04:25:13 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: DeLorean Financing

The reason most banks are reluctant to finance a Delorean is that they
wouldn't know what to do with it if they had to reposses it. On more
modern cars they are more comfortable with it if they had to take it
back. The other route is to collateralize the loan with something else
like a home equity mortage or a personal credit loan so the bank would
be happier. Remember banks only lend money to people that don't need
it so if you are trying to borrow and use the Delorean as collateral
you are going to have an uphill road. If you are succesful in
borrowing the money to buy the car you MUST budget something for
repairs and parts. The worst possible position you can get yourself
into is to have a car that doesn't run, you can't afford to fix it,
and you have to keep making payments on it. Remember that you have to
insure it (the bank will not only insist on that but that they are the
beneficiary) tax, title, registration, inspection, and in some places
a personal property tax!
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Darin Wolf" <son_darin_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> It would seem I have run into a minor position here in the good old 
> state of Missouri.  I want to be able to get a loan on a DeLorean 
> that just happens to be sitting in a suitable location.  There is 
> only one problem.
> 
> What I want to know, is why it is that I can get financing on a 
> newer vehicle and yet it seems no one here can get loans on one of 
> these cars.  It would seem that the bank is rather reluctant to help 
> in this situation.  I wonder how many of you out there have run into 
> this kind of situation.  What did you have to do to get around to it?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> 
> 
> Daemon Wolf.




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Message: 8
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 04:33:09 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Cutting off fuel flow to injectors (Re: No Fuel to injectors)

If I lean mixture screw far enough, pulled injector does indeed stop
spraying as Volvo people suggest. Of course engine is running (or
dying at that point), so effect could be reduced activation of sensor
plate. Moot point anyway -- as soon as I crack it back open have
minimum necessary fuel injection at selected idle speed (remember: I
hard select with bypass screws).

All this physics is making my head hurt. Read yesterday's post to
science buddy and he claims I'm still not 100% correct -- hose
restriction redirects energy, not adds to it. He claims PSI measures
energy exerted sideways. Velocity measures energy exerted front to
rear. Apparently energy taken away from sideways pressure is added to
frontwards velocity. And I thought these little silver cars WEREN'T
rocket science!

eMail me direct and I'll tell you what he said about below post
(disagrees in principle, but he says system in car too small to make
any measurable difference). Besides, haven't we digressed totally from
original problem? As I recall fellow had short time to get car running
and out of his garage. I like idea of pulling injector loose and
sticking hose in coke bottle to ensure fuel getting that far. My hard
lines are soldered to banjos so I forgot this was an option (that's
why I suggested buying an extra banjo. Sometimes forget I'm the
exception...). In fact, would you even need to remove hose from banjo?
Couldn't you stick entire end in bottle, banjo and all?

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_w...> wrote:
> In a static situation in a pressurized system the pressure is equal in
> all parts of the system. Under flow conditions restrictions start to
> have importance. For the purposes of the fuel injection system in the
> Delorean you can assume that unless you have a kink in a hose or a
> plugged valve that the pressure you read is the pressure in that part
> of the fuel system. The size of the hose has no effect on the fuel
> pressure once the system has filled and pressurized. The fuel pump has
> EVERYTHING to do with the pressure in the system as well as the
> pressure regulating valves. You are correct that you need a certain
> minimum pressure before you get the injectors to open and start
> spraying. As long as fuel is getting to the injectors there is only 1
> reason they won't spray, not enough presssure. There can be 2 causes
> for not enough pressure, the pump can't make enough pressure and a
> pressure valve is letting the pressure out, back to the fuel tank.
> Messing with the mixture screw will not get the injectors to open at a
> lower pressure and you will just loose that critical adjustment. 
>  Start in the gas tank and make sure the fuel pump isn't sucking in
> any air and the pick-up hose isn't kinked. The fuel system is
> hydraulic, not pnuematic so if there is air getting in it won't work.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757 
> 
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_c...> wrote:
> > You didn't by chance replace the small diameter line from accumulator
> > to filter with something larger? That small diameter line is what
> > creates high fuel pressure, not the pump itself (is not 75 PSI from
> > the tank). Kind of like putting your finger over end of a garden hose.
> > 
> > See Message #32067. Sounds definitely as though you aren't "cracking"
> > the fuel injectors. Need minimum 50-51 PSI to start spraying. If
> > you're SURE everything from fuel distributor forward is factory spec,
> > may need to adjust fuel mixture screw. You may not have touched, but
> > are you sure no one else has? Note fuel mixture is set with car
> > running -- NO VACUUM LEAKS! If you've got an injector out, plug its
> > port in head -- 1/4" vacuum leak otherwise. Make sure line feeding
> > idle speed motor from under fuel distributor is tight -- 3/4" vacuum
> leak.
> > 
> >




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Message: 9
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 04:51:10 -0000
From: "deloreanz" <deloreanz_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Anyone in the PA area?!

Hey everyone, I'm going to go look at a Delorean(a 2nd time) that I 
am considering buying and would really appriciate a pretty 
knowledgeable person to come and help me evaluate more in depth.  I 
live near Allentown PA(about half way up the state from Philadelphia, 
and the car is near Hanover PA(near the southern border, south of 
Harrisburg) The trip for me is 2 hours.  Please contact me ASAP if 
you or someone you know could meet me there or accompany me there, I 
would be eternally grateful!  Thanks,




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Message: 10
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 08:01:25 -0000
From: "Adam" <acprice1_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: First road trip a success!

I just finished my car's first road rip, 800 miles from Portland to 
Salt Lake City and back for a total of 1600 miles. The only problem I 
encountered was self induced, I installed a new stereo the day before 
the trip and i had knocked the connector block partially off the 
headlight switch. I was driving down the freeway at dusk when I lost 
my lowbeams! Luckily I found the problem and was back on the road in 
an hour.

Adam P.
16683 rocking on




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Message: 11
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 02:50:27 -0000
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Alternator time for me.

I am running an alternator from John Hervey.  I must say that I am 
quite impressed with it.  John Hervey is a great guy and really 
knows his stuff.  I wouldn't overlook his alternators.  Its a pretty 
good product.

Erik


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Sonny V <sonnyvr2000_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> 
> 
> It's alternator time for me. I knew that I was on
> borrowed time with the Ducellier, and now that summer
> is here and I am ready to drive the car I want it
> ready, too.
> 
> Right off the bat, I am not interested in anything not
> offered by one othe regular DeLorean vendors.
> 
> I am told that DMCH will continue to offer the rebuilt
> Motorolas if supplied with a "good" core. Obviously
> that counts me out with my Ducellier. Warren did tell
> me that they have a new 105 amp alternator available
> OUTRIGHT for $295.
> 
> Specialty (or is it SpecialT?) around Dallas has his
> alternator, too, but I have heard about a lot of
> failures with them. Warranty or no, if it dies and I
> am in the middle of nowhere, the passenger (read:
> wife) won't be real understanding.
> 
> Grady has a 105amp for $360, but no indication of
> warranty and didn't find any mention of user
> experiences here.
> 
> Any firsthand thoughts here people willing to post
> publicly for posterity?
> 
> Sonny
> 
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com




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Message: 12
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 04:05:20 -0000
From: "John Elgersma" <delorean_at_dml_telus.net>
Subject: Re: DeLorean Financing

If you own a house and have a bit of collateral accumulated, your 
bank should be able to get you into a second mortgage or a line of 
credit at a low rate of 5% or something close to it. Then take out 
the cash, buy your Delorean and pay your monthly payment. I guess it 
is kind of like an overdraft on your chequeing. The rate will never 
be 1 or 2% but that is the way to do it. Loans are expensive and a 
much higher interest rate.
Good luck!!
JohnE

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Darin Wolf" <son_darin_at_dml_h...> wrote:


> It would seem I have run into a minor position here in the good 
old 
> state of Missouri.  I want to be able to get a loan on a DeLorean 
> that just happens to be sitting in a suitable location.  There is 
> only one problem.
> 
> What I want to know, is why it is that I can get financing on a 
> newer vehicle and yet it seems no one here can get loans on one of 
> these cars.  It would seem that the bank is rather reluctant to 
help 
> in this situation.  I wonder how many of you out there have run 
into 
> this kind of situation.  What did you have to do to get around to 
it?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> 
> 
> Daemon Wolf.




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Message: 13
Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 10:53:29 -0000
From: "fivetwofive" <CBL302_at_dml_msn.com>
Subject: Re: Parts for a sad ebay DMC-12

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "supremeadmiralsenn" 
<StadnickAd_at_dml_u...> wrote:
> yes, I know i shouldn't buy a car like this without having some 
> knowledge. But i figure between my dad (who restored a 1972 
Chevelle 
> Malibu) and this list, I can get theinfo i need to fix it. Yes it 
> will be time-consuming, yes it will be expensive. I am prepared to 
> put in the time and money to get this car back to at least okay 
> conditiona nd maybe a full restore a couple years down the line. 
> Thanks for all your input, but I just wanted the people with these 
> parts that i need to answer, not opinions.


Just remember the $20.000 rule,when it comes time to buy a 
Delorean,whatever you pay for it,is the difference,between,what it 
cost to buy,and what it will COST YOU to finish this car,meaning 
that,if you pay for example $2500.00 for this car it will cost you AT 
least $17,500 or MORE (not including labor) to complete this car.Hope 
this puts some understanding,into your head before you get into this 
project. 

Just think about this ONE question before you decide to buy this car:
WHY DID the last person restoring,this Delorean GIVE UP on this car? 
Something to think about.

Claude
00570





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