From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1556
Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 4:01 PM

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There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. RE: DeLorean HP issue again...
From: "supremeadmiralsenn" <StadnickAd_at_dml_usa.irene.net>

2. Re: Java (Was: Vin 5386 Restoration Site Now REVAMPED!!!!!)
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>

3. RE:First, Everyday driver
From: "Palatinus, Joe" <jopalatinus_at_dml_davidson.edu>

4. RE: Re: Stalls after starting
From: elvisnocita_at_dml_gmx.de

5. Re: INDIGLO!
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

6. DeLoreans as first cars
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>

7. Re: Question from an owner's wife
From: "d_rex_2002" <rich_at_dml_outernet-tech.net>

8. RE: Re: Stalls after starting
From: "K. Creason" <dmc4687_at_dml_mindspring.com>

9. Re: Re: What about my AC high pressure cut of switch?
From: id <ionicdesign_at_dml_execpc.com>

10. RE: Re: Stalls after starting
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

11. Re: Re: Question from an owner's wife
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>

12. RE: Re: Stalls after starting
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

13. RE: Re: What about my AC high pressure cut of switch?
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

14. Cycling A/C Compressor
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

15. Vacuum leaks (Re: Stalls after starting)
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

16. No sweat: Re: RE: DeLorean HP issue again...
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

17. Was Re: Question from an owner's wife- Now Storage
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

18. Re: Stalls after starting
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

19. fan failure,I though this was strange
From: "Jonas P" <Delorean3543_at_dml_yahoo.com>

20. Rear view electric mirrors.
From: jordan rubin <nuttenschleuder_at_dml_yahoo.com>

21. Re: Was Re: Question from an owner's wife- Now Storage
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>

22. RE: DeLorean HP issue again (first car=no)
From: "supremeadmiralsenn" <StadnickAd_at_dml_usa.irene.net>

23. Re: fan failure,I though this was strange
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

24. Re:[DML}Young Owners (was DeLoreans as first cars)
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>

25. Re: RE: DeLorean HP issue again...
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>





Message: 1
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 03:13:04 -0000
From: "supremeadmiralsenn" <StadnickAd_at_dml_usa.irene.net>
Subject: RE: DeLorean HP issue again...

Mr. Robertson:"Apparently DeLo HP issue is raising its head again 
(SS frame thread).
Are people really having that much trouble with their cars, or is 
this
just hypothetical what-if?"

Mr. Robertson:
If you read my original post on this topic, you'll see that this is 
all hypothetical (I don't have a D yet) and is planning for a long 
term project. I know De Loreans can go as fast as any other car for 
normal use, it's just that 130 hp seems a little low. My last post 
might not have reached you yet, but in it I explain the point behind 
all this. This is somewhere between hypothetical what-if and "maybe 
this would be fun, let's try it". I have to see what's possible, and 
asking people what they think will yield a negative response (blah 
blah I blew up my engine doing that you're crazy etc.) instead of 
answers. Sorry if I sound rude, i'ts late here and I'm kinda tired. 

Still looking for answers
Adam Stadnick
VIN: T minus 2 years and counting......




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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2003 21:32:28 -0600
From: Mark Noeltner <mark_at_dml_buffalochips.org>
Subject: Re: Java (Was: Vin 5386 Restoration Site Now REVAMPED!!!!!)

If you need IE 8 then everyone is out of luck!! v6.x is current right now.
:-)

Michael has a valid complaint. There ARE other browsers out there other
than Netscape and IE, plus some people turn off Java for security reasons
(or have it turned off for them at work). Personally, I don't think Java is
all that bad. ActiveX has a lot more security risks IMHO. Anyway, a plain
text menu at the very bottom of the page can help out those who are
Java-challenged while still keeping the look you want.

Another thing to consider are software readers used by handicapped people.
These can read text but not Javascript. W3C (the group that regulates HTML
and other web stuff) specifies that you should have text equivilants for
all images and scripted items to make your web site handicapped accessable.

Mark N
VIN 6820

At 04:32 PM 6/23/2003 -0700, you wrote:
>Shouldn't be any problems with viewing the site. Just
>use Netscaoe 7 or IE 8 or similar and you should have
>no problems. It's a Java scrip and works like enhanced
>HTML
>
>Todd
>Vin5386
>
>
>--- Michael Paine <mpaine_at_dml_tycomsystems.com> wrote:
>> Javascript menus for easy navigation?? can you be so
>> kind as to add a TEXT link as well for us non-javascript users :-)




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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 01:45:10 -0400
From: "Palatinus, Joe" <jopalatinus_at_dml_davidson.edu>
Subject: RE:First, Everyday driver

I am currently a college student driving just my delorean 250 miles from
home.
I got my daily driver Delorean as a Junior in High school, and I drove
the heck out of it while I was still close to home (in TN).  I had the
a/c go out, the waterpump/alternator belt break, the alternator stop
working the fuel pump go out, the clutch master/slave cylinder go out,
all in my first two years of ownership.  I learned a lot about the car
and signs and symptoms of most of the problems I was likely to run into
while I was near home and able to fix the issues.  THIS IS 100%
NECESSARY.  There are many people with Deloreans who have minimal
knowledge about their car's workings, but these people probably do not
drive their car very far often (drive daily).  My Delorean is my only
mode of transportation, and I know pretty much the status of every bolt,
I know each distinct hum my car makes, and this way I can catch and fix
problems before they get me stranded somewhere.  You need to devote time
and energy to the car or else.

As for the car and the college environment, I have had two school
newspaper articles about my car, one talking about how cool it is, and
the other explaining how my car is the source of the entire campus'
cocaine. (no joke)  Some people will love your car, and others will hate
it.  I actually had a guy walk up to me when I was in the tampa bay area
filling up with gas and tell me that I was driving a stainless steel
hunk of $H*T and it was trash, and he called me a few other expletives
just because of my car, (I had never, nor do I ever wish to see that guy
again).

Bottom Line: Owning a delorean as your only car in college is an
experience that can be very fun (you can fit three college girls in the
delorean with you and go clubbing, trust me ;),  but if you don't have
the patience to think consciously about your car and learn about all of
its systems and mechanism, then I would not recommend it.
I am however a proud owner and I would not want to drive anything else
while I'm here at school.

Joe P.
VIN 17167 146,000 miles, (~20,000 problem free at school)
 




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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:12:29 +0200 (MEST)
From: elvisnocita_at_dml_gmx.de
Subject: RE: Re: Stalls after starting

If it is the CPR, then it shouldn't be possible to rev up the engine when
cold.
Does it make 4000rpm when cold (of course only to check it for a few seconds
!) ?

What do you think guys ?

Elvis

> As David says the CPR ( Control Pressure regulator ) Warm up regulator
> could be going bad, but also the 02 adjustment could be adjusted to lean
not
> allowing the control plunger in the fuel distributor to rise high enough.
> If it doesn't rise then very little or no gas goes to the injectors. If
you
> try to start it and it dies, Then pull a plug as fast as you can and see
if
> it's wet or dry.
> John Hervey
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Teitelbaum [mailto:jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net]
> Subject: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting
> 
> The first thing that comes to mind would be to check the control
> pressure regulater aka the warm-up regulater. 

-- 
+++ GMX - Mail, Messaging & more  http://www.gmx.net +++
Bitte lächeln! Fotogalerie online mit GMX ohne eigene Homepage!




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Message: 5
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 11:17:20 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: INDIGLO!

Hi Ryan

Is there any way of getting the needles on the guages to light up? It 
looks fantastic, but if you can't see where the needle's pointing to...

Martin
#1458
#4426

Ryan wrote:

>Hello all!
>
>I must apologize for the delay, but the gauge kits will be ready in 
>about two weeks!  I have uploaded pictures of my protoype kit under 
>D.A.R.T.  Again, this is a protoype, so you may notice that the 
>needles and the A/C knobs are not lit.  This has been corrected and 
>the final products are in their final stage and ready for production.
>
>The price will be $180 US per kit and includes everything you will 
>need for installation.  I am still setting up the page on my website 
>for ordering (www.d-a-r-t.com) but you may visit www.speedhut.com 
>and look at all the color combinations that will be available.  
>There are too many to list here.
>
>Enjoy!
>
>Ryan Gould
>
>
>  
>






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Message: 6
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:31:51 -0000
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: DeLoreans as first cars

I know I'm going to get flamed for this but.....

This is also not directed soley at the gentleman who posted the 
original question.

I've noticed a large number of "young people" who claim to desire a 
DeLorean as their first vehicle. This just makes me cringe. With only 
9,000 or so produced in the first place and fewer on the road every 
10 years or so, the thought of these cars in the hands of impatient, 
inexperienced people makes me cry.

As Bill Robertson likes to say, we're basically driving glorified 
prototypes. They are rolling history. One reason I bought a non-
runner was to put it back on the road in what may be a vain attempt 
to increase the population of surviving vehicles. 

I'm not a total purist though..I do believe in certain modifications, 
especially in the interest of safety and preserving the car from say, 
electrical fires and such. 

I'm only 31 but I remember 15 years ago how I drove, and how my 
friends drove. We were like filthy little primate animals behind the 
wheel. My first accident was when I hit a Buick Grand National. I 
don't know many "young people" who want the car for it's automotive 
historical value versus the fact that it's "shiny" and has cool doors.

All I have to do, is point out my neighborhood as an example. -Every- 
time I'm out working on it, some punk in a Honda CRX with a chromed 
exhaust tip rolls up and asks: "Dude! Are you selling it? Is it 
fast?" When I tell them no, you can see the dissapointment in their 
face.

Louie, I do realize that not -all- teens/young people think that way, 
so don't get too bent out of shape. I've heard good things about you.

But....I'm sure the original DMC-12 owners, the rich, older crowd 
thought the same thing when we 20 and 30 year olds started buying 
them...

Just my 2 dirhams.

Rich
#5335  -MD




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Message: 7
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:45:55 -0000
From: "d_rex_2002" <rich_at_dml_outernet-tech.net>
Subject: Re: Question from an owner's wife

I am behind Bruce's statements 100%.  Please tell your husband
we thank him for his service to our country.  I also think we
can go one step further with assistance in this case, so if 
you let us know the city/state where the Delorean is being
garaged (stored) maybe someone from the DML could make a trip
out to get the car started and running, and possibly make some
arrangements to check on the car for you, every few months, to
make sure the vehicle is given regular "exercise".

A minimum schedule should be at least every 6 - 8 weeks and I
would disconnect the battery between these startup sessions if
there is an existing power draw on the battery causing a dead
battery within a few weeks or months.

Let us know if we can be of any futher assistance.

Later,
Rich W.
 

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, abatt10347_at_dml_a... wrote:
> I would have a friend take the battery out and have it charged and 
put back 
> in the car. The battery is located behind the passenger seat. Just 
lift up the 
> carpet flap and remove the cover. Battery may or may not have a tie 
down strap 
> on it. It takes a small seat of hands to get into the compartment 
but it can 
> be done. You need to find out from your husband what he did before 
leaving 
> overseas to get the car ready for storage. Did he add stabol or 
something like it 
> to the tank to keep the gas from getting old? After you have the 
battery 
> charged set up a schedule to start it at least once every couple of 
weeks. I know 
> others will post on this topic but this is what I would (and have) 
done. If I 
> or the list can be of any future help, please post. Also please tell 
your 
> husband thank you from me for his service to our country.
> Bruce Battles
> VIN 06569
> RNDOMTA




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Message: 8
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 07:48:33 -0500
From: "K. Creason" <dmc4687_at_dml_mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Stalls after starting

That's interesting John. Now I've got to speak up and my twists to this
situation.

I've been monitoring this thread because I have similar issues after my 30k
miles service, and leaning my car out. I've probably leaned it out tooo
much, but I was trying to find out why I only get 15 city mpg; how hard I
drive makes almost no difference.
Early morning or four hour parked starts smell very gassy and run rough,
almost bad timing-like. I did have a bad vacuum hose on the timing advance
unit, but that is fixed. I'm thinking something else is losing vacuum and it
takes time to build it back up after starting? Say the system loses vacuum--
how long does it take the system to get it back up? And if you lose vacuum
in one part, does it effect other parts, like the air mode switch?
Hmmm, reminds me that last summer I had starting issues if the car had been
sitting in the hot sun for all day. Never did solve that, it just became
less of an issuel. Is that the fuel accumulator? Could that be working in
tandem or is that my real problem?

-----Original Message-----
From: John Hervey [mailto:john_at_dml_specialtauto.com]
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 11:23 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting


As David says the CPR ( Control Pressure regulator ) Warm up regulator could
be going bad, but also the 02 adjustment could be adjusted to lean not
allowing the control plunger in the fuel distributor to rise high enough. If
it doesn't rise then very little or no gas goes to the injectors. If you try
to start it and it dies, Then pull a plug as fast as you can and see if it's
wet or dry.
John Hervey


-----Original Message-----
From: David Teitelbaum [mailto:jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net]
Subject: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting

The first thing that comes to mind would be to check the control
pressure regulater aka the warm-up regulater.



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "painintheass7565" <advantics_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> Howdy. I have two D's and one runs like a top and one has this
> problem. I starts right up but unless I keep my foot on the gas it
> stalls out.


To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
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To search the archives or view files, log in at
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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 08:59:54 -0500
From: id <ionicdesign_at_dml_execpc.com>
Subject: Re: Re: What about my AC high pressure cut of switch?

I just got my A/C recharged by a place that just works on cooling systems and they said
the compressor will only cycle if it is low on freon, DMCH also agreed. The compressor
should never cycle.

Mark



David Teitelbaum wrote:

> Not all cars have the high pressure switch and sometimes it is on the
> condensor coil on the left side. There is also a low pressure switch
> on the accumulater N:03:03. That low pressure switch also cyles the
> compressor on and off if everything is set-up properly. If you can't
> see the leak it is possible it is one of the hoses running front to
> back in the frame with the high pressure hose on the left being the
> most likely. The high presure safety valve is on the back of the
> compressor unless it was removed to run the F-134. The hose can be
> replaced without removing the body but you have to bend the flange on
> the frame to do it (don't worry, you can bend it back and touch it up
> with some paint). Read N:01:01 the second paragraph.  If at all
> possible the best thing to do is to return the system back to R-12. In
> your case you should also replace the dryer/accumulater, the orifice
> tube, and the service valve cores along with draining and replacing
> the oil and all of the "O" rings. You may also need a new low pressure
> switch or fix the problem in the wiring so it works. The system can be
> pressureized with nitrogen or dry air and leak-tested using soapy
> water or a leak-test solution to look for bubbles which would indicate
> a leak. Since the system was running -134 you may find ALL of the "O"
> rings must be replaced with the "green" ones. The black ones (Buna)
> don't like the 134 and start to leak. You might consider finding
> another shop to do this right.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757
>
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Michiel Böhmer <michiel.bohmer_at_dml_i...>
> wrote:
> > Dear list-members,
> >
> > I'm lost here. I have AC troubles and I can't find my answers in the
> archive.
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 09:16:11 -0700
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Stalls after starting

Elvis, That is true that normally the hi revs won't be there if the CPR is
bad, but here we may not have a fully disfunctional CPR. Were fortunate that
we have one of the few CPR that has an enrichment feature that others don't.
We have the vacuum tubes and the 1 second delay valve attached to the CPR
bottom plate which is for enrichment. We also have the enrichment full
throttle switch to aid as well when you floor the pedal.That may also no be
working.
John Hervey
www.specialTauto.com



-----Original Message-----
From: elvisnocita_at_dml_gmx.de [mailto:elvisnocita_at_dml_gmx.de]
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 1:12 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting


If it is the CPR, then it shouldn't be possible to rev up the engine when
cold.
Does it make 4000rpm when cold (of course only to check it for a few seconds
!) ?

What do you think guys ?

Elvis

> As David says the CPR ( Control Pressure regulator ) Warm up regulator
> could be going bad, but also the 02 adjustment could be adjusted to lean
not
> allowing the control plunger in the fuel distributor to rise high enough.
> If it doesn't rise then very little or no gas goes to the injectors. If
you
> try to start it and it dies, Then pull a plug as fast as you can and see
if
> it's wet or dry.
> John Hervey
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Teitelbaum [mailto:jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net]
> Subject: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting
>
> The first thing that comes to mind would be to check the control
> pressure regulater aka the warm-up regulater.

--
+++ GMX - Mail, Messaging & more  http://www.gmx.net +++
Bitte lächeln! Fotogalerie online mit GMX ohne eigene Homepage!



To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/







________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 09:21:36 -0500
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Question from an owner's wife

There are a number of opinions about long term storage and more precisely
what constitutes long term strorage. Without a doubt DeLoreans that have sat
for years suffer expensive fuel system problems but storing the car for 6
months or less shouldn't be a problem. There have been a variety of opinions
about how the cars should be stored and here's what I've experianced. I've
owned my car for over 21 years and live in Minnesota where winter storage is
a given for a car like the DeLorean. I fill the tank with  non-ethonal gas,
ad a can of Sea Foam, ( a fuel system cleaner which also prevents gasoline
break down over a long period. Stabile is another similar product ) pump the
tires to about 60psi, park the car on a sheet of plastic to prevent moisture
build up under the car, and disconnect the battery. I don't start the car
over the winter. Periodic starting and idling will not get the combustion by
products like sufuric acid and H2O out the engine and exhaust system. It
takes a good 10 to 20 mile drive to do this. When you start the car and idle
it for a period of time you allow these by products to build up in the oil
pan and exhaust system. Then while the car sits for another month these
corrosive by products are working on bearing surfaces and muffler insides.
In the 21 years I've been driving this car I've had no problems related to
storage and it remains a very reliable vehicle. I've criss crossed the
country many times with it and wouldn't hesitate leaving today on a trip of
any length. The thing here is that the car is driven frequently with enough
miles to keep things working during the summer months.

Bruce Benson




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Message: 12
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 09:57:40 -0700
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Stalls after starting

See below:

-----Original Message-----
From: K. Creason [mailto:dmc4687_at_dml_mindspring.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 5:49 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting


That's interesting John. Now I've got to speak up and my twists to this
situation.( OK )

I've been monitoring this thread because I have similar issues after my 30k
miles service, and leaning my car out. I've probably leaned it out tooo
much, but I was trying to find out why I only get 15 city mpg; how hard I
drive makes almost no difference.

( Typically, The 02 setting can be adjusted when running to rich to
compensate for the 02 sensor age.It should be changed out at the 30,000 mile
mark or sooner if it's been abused by over enrichment.) But, if your warm up
reg ( cpr ) is not putting the pressure on the top of the control plunger in
the fuel distributor, then your trying to adjust one to compensate for the
other. Meaning you can't adjust the 02 to make up for the CPR pressure. I
would replace the CPR and the 02 sensor then readjust and you should be back
up to the 21 MPG +. Results to me based on what were talking about you would
run to rich.)

Early morning or four hour parked starts smell very gassy and run rough,
almost bad timing-like. I did have a bad vacuum hose on the timing advance
unit, but that is fixed. I'm thinking something else is losing vacuum and it
takes time to build it back up after starting? Say the system loses vacuum--
how long does it take the system to get it back up? And if you lose vacuum
in one part, does it effect other parts, like the air mode switch?
( Dave may have a better handle on the vacuum build up, but I would think
it's instant or a second or two.)

Hmmm, reminds me that last summer I had starting issues if the car had been
sitting in the hot sun for all day. Never did solve that, it just became
less of an issuel. Is that the fuel accumulator? Could that be working in
tandem or is that my real problem?
( Was this a hot start problem.)If so then you know accumulator and new O
rings in the distributor will normally stop that.)In the hot sun if the
coolant temperature doesn't go down below 95 degrees the TTS switch won't
let the CSV( cold start valve ) fire off when you try to start the car.
Coolant is to hot.) Where as at night and in the morning it may.

John hervey
www.specialTauto.com





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Message: 13
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:08:55 -0700
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: RE: Re: What about my AC high pressure cut of switch?

Mark, Not true. The AC compressor will cycle. That's the way it protects
it's self to keep from freezing up the evaporator coil. You can adjust the
frequency by the amount of refrigerant and by how much hot/warm air is
blowing over the evaporator coil and how the switches are adjusted. They can
be made not to cycle, but why go to all the trouble. They normally cycle.
John Hervey


-----Original Message-----
From: id [mailto:ionicdesign_at_dml_execpc.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 7:00 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [DML] Re: What about my AC high pressure cut of switch?


I just got my A/C recharged by a place that just works on cooling systems
and they said
the compressor will only cycle if it is low on freon, DMCH also agreed. The
compressor
should never cycle.

Mark



David Teitelbaum wrote:

> Not all cars have the high pressure switch and sometimes it is on the
> condensor coil on the left side. There is also a low pressure switch
> on the accumulater N:03:03. That low pressure switch also cyles the
> compressor on and off if everything is set-up properly. If you can't
> see the leak it is possible it is one of the hoses running front to
> back in the frame with the high pressure hose on the left being the
> most likely. The high presure safety valve is on the back of the
> compressor unless it was removed to run the F-134. The hose can be
> replaced without removing the body but you have to bend the flange on
> the frame to do it (don't worry, you can bend it back and touch it up
> with some paint). Read N:01:01 the second paragraph.  If at all
> possible the best thing to do is to return the system back to R-12. In
> your case you should also replace the dryer/accumulater, the orifice
> tube, and the service valve cores along with draining and replacing
> the oil and all of the "O" rings. You may also need a new low pressure
> switch or fix the problem in the wiring so it works. The system can be
> pressureized with nitrogen or dry air and leak-tested using soapy
> water or a leak-test solution to look for bubbles which would indicate
> a leak. Since the system was running -134 you may find ALL of the "O"
> rings must be replaced with the "green" ones. The black ones (Buna)
> don't like the 134 and start to leak. You might consider finding
> another shop to do this right.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757
>
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Michiel Böhmer <michiel.bohmer_at_dml_i...>
> wrote:
> > Dear list-members,
> >
> > I'm lost here. I have AC troubles and I can't find my answers in the
> archive.
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/







________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 14
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 15:18:25 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Cycling A/C Compressor

Agreed. Only reason compressor cycles is because evaporator is
freezing up (good charge), or because freon is low to begin with.

Cycling compressor makes car unpleasant to drive. DMC only sold 8,000
copies as it was. Imagine how sales would have been if that was normal.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, id <ionicdesign_at_dml_e...> wrote:
> I just got my A/C recharged by a place that just works on cooling
systems and they said
> the compressor will only cycle if it is low on freon, DMCH also
agreed. The compressor
> should never cycle.
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
> David Teitelbaum wrote:
> 
> > Not all cars have the high pressure switch and sometimes it is on the
> > condensor coil on the left side. There is also a low pressure switch
> > on the accumulater N:03:03. That low pressure switch also cyles the
> > compressor on and off if everything is set-up properly. If you can't
> > see the leak it is possible it is one of the hoses running front to
> > back in the frame with the high pressure hose on the left being the
> > most likely. The high presure safety valve is on the back of the
> > compressor unless it was removed to run the F-134. The hose can be
> > replaced without removing the body but you have to bend the flange on
> > the frame to do it (don't worry, you can bend it back and touch it up
> > with some paint). Read N:01:01 the second paragraph.  If at all
> > possible the best thing to do is to return the system back to R-12. In
> > your case you should also replace the dryer/accumulater, the orifice
> > tube, and the service valve cores along with draining and replacing
> > the oil and all of the "O" rings. You may also need a new low pressure
> > switch or fix the problem in the wiring so it works. The system can be
> > pressureized with nitrogen or dry air and leak-tested using soapy
> > water or a leak-test solution to look for bubbles which would indicate
> > a leak. Since the system was running -134 you may find ALL of the "O"
> > rings must be replaced with the "green" ones. The black ones (Buna)
> > don't like the 134 and start to leak. You might consider finding
> > another shop to do this right.
> > David Teitelbaum
> > vin 10757
> >
> > --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Michiel Böhmer <michiel.bohmer_at_dml_i...>
> > wrote:
> > > Dear list-members,
> > >
> > > I'm lost here. I have AC troubles and I can't find my answers in the
> > archive.
> >
> > To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> > moderators_at_dml_d...
> >
> > For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
> >
> > To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 15
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 15:12:14 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Vacuum leaks (Re: Stalls after starting)

Vacuum leaks are fuel economy killers. Because engine is breathing
elsewhere than over air sensor plate, you have to open it further to
keep some sort of ratio that will combust. Ever notice that people
with vacuum leaks usually crank fuel mixture screw clockwise? (myself
included). You'll smooth the idle out, but at the cost of extra fuel
metered into engine.

PRV is a bit different from familiar domestic blocks. Will suck air
from the wierdest places (pull out dip stick -- vacuum leak). In the
bad old days loose valve and timing chain covers just leaked oil. On a
PRV they let air into engine. No joke: spray ENTIRE block with leak
detector of choice. You'll be amazed at what you find. Long gone are
days of just replacing a few hoses and tightening down carb/intake
manifold.

Re: fuel economy -- noticed on an eBay auction for repro window
sticker that original EPA was only 19 mpg. Since highway is in low
20's, that means upper teens in town should be normal (15 mpg may be a
bit low, but obviously couldn't be more than 17 or so). Remember the
RPM's we're pulling (why does my DeLo bring out the Mario Andretti in
me?). I notice most on highway. Virginia's lower speed limits yield
better economy than North Carolina. At time of original EPA cars
percolated 55 mph / 2000 rpm. Now I'm driving 80 mph / 3000 rpm. 

Re: John Hervey's suggestion to diagnose distributor plunger letting
fuel out to injectors, I'd recommend popping out an injector itself
and placing in neck of coke bottle. If you actually want engine to run
like that you'll have to seal injector port. I used to do that with
3/4" hose and a plug streched over lip. Worked but was difficult to
install. When I replaced injector seals made an internal plug from old
seal and a bolt (smooth portion of shank). Much easier.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "K. Creason" <dmc4687_at_dml_m...> wrote:
> That's interesting John. Now I've got to speak up and my twists to this
> situation.
> 
> I've been monitoring this thread because I have similar issues after
my 30k
> miles service, and leaning my car out. I've probably leaned it out tooo
> much, but I was trying to find out why I only get 15 city mpg; how
hard I
> drive makes almost no difference.
> Early morning or four hour parked starts smell very gassy and run rough,
> almost bad timing-like. I did have a bad vacuum hose on the timing
advance
> unit, but that is fixed. I'm thinking something else is losing
vacuum and it
> takes time to build it back up after starting? Say the system loses
vacuum--
> how long does it take the system to get it back up? And if you lose
vacuum
> in one part, does it effect other parts, like the air mode switch?
> Hmmm, reminds me that last summer I had starting issues if the car
had been
> sitting in the hot sun for all day. Never did solve that, it just became
> less of an issuel. Is that the fuel accumulator? Could that be
working in
> tandem or is that my real problem?
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Hervey [mailto:john_at_dml_s...]
> Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 11:23 PM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting
> 
> 
> As David says the CPR ( Control Pressure regulator ) Warm up
regulator could
> be going bad, but also the 02 adjustment could be adjusted to lean not
> allowing the control plunger in the fuel distributor to rise high
enough. If
> it doesn't rise then very little or no gas goes to the injectors. If
you try
> to start it and it dies, Then pull a plug as fast as you can and see
if it's
> wet or dry.
> John Hervey
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Teitelbaum [mailto:jtrealty_at_dml_w...]
> Subject: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting
> 
> The first thing that comes to mind would be to check the control
> pressure regulater aka the warm-up regulater.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "painintheass7565" <advantics_at_dml_a...>
wrote:
> > Howdy. I have two D's and one runs like a top and one has this
> > problem. I starts right up but unless I keep my foot on the gas it
> > stalls out.
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_d...
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 16
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 15:46:22 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: No sweat: Re: RE: DeLorean HP issue again...

No sweat (Re: late and kinda tired). Read list and posted last night
at office after 13 hour makeup day, so I know where you came from.
Even mispoke in A/C message (converted R134 system isn't letting too
much freon into evaporator, is allowing low side pressure to drop too
low, but you know what I meant).

If you are fortunate enough to buy a running DeLo, PRV may surprise
you. Yes, it could be beefier. But unless engine swap is your first
objective, attend to other problems (trust me -- they'll be there)
while living off factory block. Before purchase I was all hot and
bothered to throw a Vortec back there. Now, I'm passing traffic with
the PRV, and STILL haven't fixed all my other problems. Of course
would replace before I'd rebuild it, but that crisis is far away.

If engine swap IS your primary objective, contact me direct
(brobertson(AT)carolina.net) and I'll forward all correspondence and
pics in my archive from owners who have done same.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "supremeadmiralsenn"
<StadnickAd_at_dml_u...> wrote:
> Mr. Robertson:"Apparently DeLo HP issue is raising its head again 
> (SS frame thread).
> Are people really having that much trouble with their cars, or is 
> this
> just hypothetical what-if?"
> 
> Mr. Robertson:
> If you read my original post on this topic, you'll see that this is 
> all hypothetical (I don't have a D yet) and is planning for a long 
> term project. I know De Loreans can go as fast as any other car for 
> normal use, it's just that 130 hp seems a little low. My last post 
> might not have reached you yet, but in it I explain the point behind 
> all this. This is somewhere between hypothetical what-if and "maybe 
> this would be fun, let's try it". I have to see what's possible, and 
> asking people what they think will yield a negative response (blah 
> blah I blew up my engine doing that you're crazy etc.) instead of 
> answers. Sorry if I sound rude, i'ts late here and I'm kinda tired. 
> 
> Still looking for answers
> Adam Stadnick
> VIN: T minus 2 years and counting......




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 17
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 16:40:09 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Was Re: Question from an owner's wife- Now Storage

I don't like fuel stabilizers. I have seen too many times where a car
was put into storage and 6 months turned into years. The safest thing
is to drain the gas. It eliminates the potential fire hazard and when
you are ready to start up you have clean fresh gas. If the worst was
to happen and you didn't use the car for a season or 2 then the fuel
won't go bad on you. Draining the fuel also gives you a chance to
inspect the parts in the fuel tank. Another point to make is although
the stabilizer may preserve the volitility of the fuel I worry what it
does to the rubber parts in the fuel tank long term. Gasoline also
absorbs moisture from the air. Over time the moisture will collect in
the tank and corrode anything metal it comes in contact with. I can
think of no good reason to leave the fuel in the tank during storage.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_p...> wrote:
> There are a number of opinions about long term storage and more
precisely
> what constitutes long term strorage. Without a doubt DeLoreans that
have sat
> for years suffer expensive fuel system problems but storing the car
for 6
> months or less shouldn't be a problem. There have been a variety of
opinions
> about how the cars should be stored and here's what I've
experianced. I've
> owned my car for over 21 years and live in Minnesota where winter 




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 18
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 16:55:13 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Stalls after starting

15 MPG is awful mileage. No wonder the car smells "gassy". First off
look for fuel leaks, that can kill your gas mileage. Next go over
every vacuum hose. Make sure they are all soft, not kinked, connected
right and don't leak. If the car hasn't been tuned-up that is next.
Have the fuel injectors cleaned and replace the injector seals. Your
fiddling with the mixture screw is a hopeless attempt to richen the
fuel mixture to make up for the vacuum leaks. Dragging brakes can also
kill mileage. If the fluid is dark and thick flush the brakes, you
might have a sticking caliper which means rebuilding the brake system.
Alignment affects mileage. Look at the tires and see how they are
wearing. Finally for your hard hot start pull the short rubber hose
off the back of the accumulater and attach a hose from the accumulater
into a pail. Turn the key on and see if fuel comes out of the
accumulater. If it does then order a new one. A bad accumulater
doesn't affect performance or mileage, only hot starting. Vacuum
builds up almost immediatly once the leak is stopped. Vacuum is Power!
So if you don't have vacuum you don't have power. Vacuum is how the
engine gets the combustible mixture inside, the higher the vacuum the
more fuel, the more power. This only applies to naturally aspirated
engines like a stock Delorean.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "K. Creason" <dmc4687_at_dml_m...> wrote:
> That's interesting John. Now I've got to speak up and my twists to this
> situation.
> 
> I've been monitoring this thread because I have similar issues after
my 30k
> miles service, and leaning my car out. I've probably leaned it out tooo
> much, but I was trying to find out why I only get 15 city mpg; how
hard I
> drive makes almost no difference.
> Early morning or four hour parked starts smell very gassy and run rough,
> almost bad timing-like. I did have a bad vacuum hose on the timing
advance
> unit, but that is fixed. I'm thinking something else is losing
vacuum and it
> takes time to build it back up after starting? Say the system loses
vacuum--
> how long does it take the system to get it back up? And if you lose
vacuum
> in one part, does it effect other parts, like the air mode switch?
> Hmmm, reminds me that last summer I had starting issues if the car
had been
> sitting in the hot sun for all day. Never did solve that, it just became
> less of an issuel. Is that the fuel accumulator? Could that be
working in
> tandem or is that my real problem?
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Hervey [mailto:john_at_dml_s...]
> Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 11:23 PM
> To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting
> 
> 
> As David says the CPR ( Control Pressure regulator ) Warm up
regulator could
> be going bad, but also the 02 adjustment could be adjusted to lean not
> allowing the control plunger in the fuel distributor to rise high
enough. If
> it doesn't rise then very little or no gas goes to the injectors. If
you try
> to start it and it dies, Then pull a plug as fast as you can and see
if it's
> wet or dry.
> John Hervey
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Teitelbaum [mailto:jtrealty_at_dml_w...]
> Subject: [DML] Re: Stalls after starting
> 
> The first thing that comes to mind would be to check the control
> pressure regulater aka the warm-up regulater.
> 
> 
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "painintheass7565" <advantics_at_dml_a...>
wrote:
> > Howdy. I have two D's and one runs like a top and one has this
> > problem. I starts right up but unless I keep my foot on the gas it
> > stalls out.
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_d...
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 19
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 17:28:26 -0000
From: "Jonas P" <Delorean3543_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: fan failure,I though this was strange

Both of my cooling fans failed at the same time. I have an fan fix 
kit from PJ Grady. I went crazy tring to figuar out what the problem 
was. I checked the voltage and found that both fans where getting 
power. Then I tapped twice on one of the fans (while the car was 
running with A/C on) and it came on. I did the same to the other and 
it came on. Now I can understand why this would happen to a fan 
motor, but both at the same time? Any comments? I for one thought 
this a bit strange
Jonas 3543
P.S. Thanks to Mr. Rob Grady (he was very busy but still took time to 
help me) for help on this matter. 




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 20
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:50:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: jordan rubin <nuttenschleuder_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Rear view electric mirrors.

Hello all:

   I wasnt going to post anything about this until the
new switch came in from delorean.  There was not
argument that the old switch/joystick was broke since
it was found in 3 pieces.

   With the new switch in, the driver side mirror
seems to work ok, (IS IT NORMAL FOR IT TO BE THAT
LOUD).  Im getting nothing from the passenger side.

Ive established a couple of things.

1: There's power to the switch that controls both
sides
2: The switch works in all directions.
3: The passanger mirror does not respond to the
switch.

and possible conclusions

1: There is no power making it to the passanger side.
2: There is power, but the mirror motor is broken.

Here lies the question.

1:  what would be the best place to check for power on
the pass side (barring removing the mirror).  Is there
a harness in the arm rest as well, under the blanking
cap?

2:  If it is the mirror motor, does anyone know the
best way to remove that thin panel to get at the
mirror screws?  Should I order new fir clips before
taking this off?

thanx

jordan 11613  




__________________________________
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________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 21
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:03:42 -0500
From: "B Benson" <delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com>
Subject: Re: Was Re: Question from an owner's wife- Now Storage

David,

Some of what you say makes sense but if you use your DeLorean regularly
throughout every summer the work involved with empting the tank, not to
mention fuel lines and such, is a waste of time IMHO. I have around 70,000
miles on my car and all the fuel tank components are original with the
exception of the fuel pump. That was changed during the first year of
ownership simply to get the newer style pump with the external check valve.
I opened the tank this spring and examined the boot, baffel and hoses. They
look fine. My neighbor who does a talk radio program about car maintainance
along with a weekly newspaper column covering the same subject has also done
this same storage proceedure for years with his cars. If you have a reason to
think your car may end up stored longer than about 6 months your advice is
sound but otherwise I think it's a complete waste of time.

Bruce Benson


> I don't like fuel stabilizers. I have seen too many times where a car
> was put into storage and 6 months turned into years. The safest thing
> is to drain the gas. It eliminates the potential fire hazard and when
> you are ready to start up you have clean fresh gas. If the worst was
> to happen and you didn't use the car for a season or 2 then the fuel
> won't go bad on you. Draining the fuel also gives you a chance to
> inspect the parts in the fuel tank.  I can
> think of no good reason to leave the fuel in the tank during storage.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 22
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 18:25:41 -0000
From: "supremeadmiralsenn" <StadnickAd_at_dml_usa.irene.net>
Subject: RE: DeLorean HP issue again (first car=no)

Thanks Mr. Robertson. I do intend to get the car in decent, safe 
condition before an engine swap. Now, to the rest of you...

Um. I'm hoping this 'first car' discussion isn't about me. Yes I'm a 
teenager, but I'm not stupid. I have a first car (83 Ford Fairmont 
Futura) and I intend to practice driving on it first before ever 
touching a De Lorean (not hard to do, since I have 2 years before 
geting a D anyways). Okay, just my opinion from a teen's 
perspective. 

Adam Stadnick
Waiting out for a VIN




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 23
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 20:09:19 +0100
From: Martin Gutkowski <webmaster_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Re: fan failure,I though this was strange

I have had this problem on my (then) 5000 mile car. Here's the reason:

The cooling fan motors have a drain hole which is located at the shaft 
end of the casing. If you drive through some deepish water, it will 
collect at the back of the casing where the brushes are - it can't drain 
because the DeLorean's fan motors sit tilted backwards. My guess is that 
one or more of the brushes get siezed up in their springs (which hold 
them against the commutator) meaning that althought hte water will 
eventually dry out, the brushes will stop making contact to the 
commutator a while down the track. Tapping with a hammer will free them up.

To prevent this happening again, drill a small hole at the base of the 
rear of the casing

Best Wishes

Martin
#1458
#4426

Jonas P wrote:

>Both of my cooling fans failed at the same time. I have an fan fix 
>kit from PJ Grady. I went crazy tring to figuar out what the problem 
>was. I checked the voltage and found that both fans where getting 
>power. Then I tapped twice on one of the fans (while the car was 
>running with A/C on) and it came on. I did the same to the other and 
>it came on. Now I can understand why this would happen to a fan 
>motor, but both at the same time? Any comments? I for one thought 
>this a bit strange
>Jonas 3543
>P.S. Thanks to Mr. Rob Grady (he was very busy but still took time to 
>help me) for help on this matter. 
>
>
>
>To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
>moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
>For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
>
>To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
>
>
>.
>
>  
>






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 24
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:20:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re:[DML}Young Owners (was DeLoreans as first cars)

LOL... Rich you knew I wouldn't just let that one slip by ;-) . It seems like a lot of owners have some very unfounded misconceptions about us younger counterparts. To even be a member of the DML (or DMCForum, or any other list) you have to really be a diehard DeLorean fan. One who subscribes to these lists doesn't just think the DeLorean as some "cool car" from Back to the Future. They're fascinated by it's style, history, and want to know how they operate, how to fix them... everything. 

I think it's important to note that some of the most passionate owners I've come across are young ones. They're totally on fire about the car, and it shows! Two of the nicest DeLoreans I've ever seen are owned by people under 25. People like Aaron Posey who won the Concourse at Memphis, and Darren Decker won his class at Memphis. These guys have both put countless hours worth of work to get their cars into the shape they are today, and have spent a dollar or two doing it. I myself have put thousands and thousands of dollars into my DeLorean, and it will need many more thousands before I'm happy with it. What I'm trying to say is, us young owners don't take ownership lightly. Almost every spare dollar I have goes into that car, and any free weekend I have I drive 2 hours home to spend the weekend tackling the next project on my list for the car. 

So I simply don't buy your suggestion that young people who buy DeLoreans trash them. I don't know of ANYONE under 25 who has bought a DeLorean and totally misused it, and left it in worse condition than it came to them in. I can't say the same for some older owners though. It seems I've come across many older owners who have simply lost interest in their cars... and don't maintain them, or even drive them anymore. Anyways... all I'm trying to say is that I think you are highly underestimating the younger DeLorean owners. Not to say that all young people are excellent drivers, and good stewards to their transportation... but I've yet to come across any young *DELOREAN* owner like that.

Louie Golden
VIN 10115

--- "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com> wrote:
>I know I'm going to get flamed for this but.....
>
>This is also not directed soley at the gentleman who posted the 
>original question.
>
>I've noticed a large number of "young people" who claim to desire a 
>DeLorean as their first vehicle. This just makes me cringe. With only 
>9,000 or so produced in the first place and fewer on the road every 
>10 years or so, the thought of these cars in the hands of impatient, 
>inexperienced people makes me cry.
>
>As Bill Robertson likes to say, we're basically driving glorified 
>prototypes. They are rolling history. One reason I bought a non-
>runner was to put it back on the road in what may be a vain attempt 
>to increase the population of surviving vehicles. 
>
>I'm not a total purist though..I do believe in certain modifications, 
>especially in the interest of safety and preserving the car from say, 
>electrical fires and such. 
>
>I'm only 31 but I remember 15 years ago how I drove, and how my 
>friends drove. We were like filthy little primate animals behind the 
>wheel. My first accident was when I hit a Buick Grand National. I 
>don't know many "young people" who want the car for it's automotive 
>historical value versus the fact that it's "shiny" and has cool doors.
>
>All I have to do, is point out my neighborhood as an example. -Every- 
>time I'm out working on it, some punk in a Honda CRX with a chromed 
>exhaust tip rolls up and asks: "Dude! Are you selling it? Is it 
>fast?" When I tell them no, you can see the dissapointment in their 
>face.
>
>Louie, I do realize that not -all- teens/young people think that way, 
>so don't get too bent out of shape. I've heard good things about you.
>
>But....I'm sure the original DMC-12 owners, the rich, older crowd 
>thought the same thing when we 20 and 30 year olds started buying 
>them...
>
>Just my 2 dirhams.
>
>Rich
>#5335  -MD

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Message: 25
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: RE: DeLorean HP issue again...

I don't think it's fair to judge the DeLoreans horsepower by just looking at the numbers, and write it off as a slow car. Until you've driven one (especially in everyday, real life conditions), you really can't make judgements on the cars performance, can you? Yes, I once thought that the DeLorean must be a really sluggish, and unispired car to drive just looking at the hp and weight numbers. However the car is surprisingly peppy, and what the engine doesn't make in power, it certainly makes up for in flexibility. My car accelerates freely up to the 6500 rpm redline, and is an extremely preditable handling car because of its power to weight ratio... I'd even say the car is nimble. By any measure, it's fun to drive, and always makes me grin when i drive it hard. I personally plan on installing DMC-Houston's exhaust system in my D, but it's not because I'm displeased with the cars performance. Instead, I just don't like the exhaust note... it simply doesn't match the cars looks.

I've worn out this example... but I'm going to cite it again. My Dad is a muscle car enthusiast (he's owned his '69 Boss 302 Mustang since he was a teen in the early '70s). He gave me absolute hell for wanting a car with only 130 hp. HOWEVER, after his first test drive in my DeLorean, he came back grinning from ear to ear telling me how fun the car was to drive... how peppy it was... and how it cruised on country roads effortlessly at 80 mph. He was genuinely impressed... and very few cars impress this man. Again, all I'm trying to say is... drive a DeLorean for 6 months... if you still are totally unsatisfied... then make drastic plans so that the car fits your needs. Until you've gotten there... give the DeLorean a chance.

Louie Golden
VIN 10115

--- "supremeadmiralsenn" <StadnickAd_at_dml_usa.irene.net> wrote:
>>Mr. Robertson:
>If you read my original post on this topic, you'll see that this is 
>all hypothetical (I don't have a D yet) and is planning for a long 
>term project. I know De Loreans can go as fast as any other car for 
>normal use, it's just that 130 hp seems a little low. My last post 
>might not have reached you yet, but in it I explain the point behind 
>all this. This is somewhere between hypothetical what-if and "maybe 
>this would be fun, let's try it". I have to see what's possible, and 
>asking people what they think will yield a negative response (blah 
>blah I blew up my engine doing that you're crazy etc.) instead of 
>answers. Sorry if I sound rude, i'ts late here and I'm kinda tired. 
>
>Still looking for answers
>Adam Stadnick
>VIN: T minus 2 years and counting......
>
>
>
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>moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
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>
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>
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