From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1568
Date: Thursday, July 03, 2003 7:18 AM

To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

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There are 16 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. How many Deloreans
From: "phoenix00622002" <barbara0892_at_dml_aol.com>

2. Re: Outside Parking
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

3. Re: Outside Parking
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>

4. RE: Power Antenna Fuse
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

5. Working on a Delorean
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>

6. Re: Outside Parking
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>

7. Re: Power Antenna Fuse
From: "Richard" <dmc_driver_at_dml_yahoo.ca>

8. Re: Outside Parking
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>

9. Re: Re: Power Antenna Fuse
From: <eric_at_dml_seviernet.com>

10. Re: How many Deloreans
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>

11. Car Show
From: "phoenix00622002" <barbara0892_at_dml_aol.com>

12. Re: Power Antenna Fuse
From: "theshovel1224" <theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com>

13. Re: How many Deloreans
From: Justin <voodoonova_at_dml_yahoo.com>

14. Re: How many Deloreans
From: "Jake" <jkampho_at_dml_siue.edu>

15. Re: Power Antenna Fuse
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

16. Re: How many Deloreans
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>





Message: 1
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 02:24:03 -0000
From: "phoenix00622002" <barbara0892_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: How many Deloreans

Whats the most accurate estimate of the total number of DMC12s made. 
What was the last serial number and date? Also what is the best 
method of cleaning and polishing?

Barbara & AJ
01550




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Message: 2
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 02:58:04 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: Outside Parking

Have 9 running vehicles (soon to be 8!) but no garage. Instead have
$1,000 invested in car covers...

Am extremely partial to CoverCraft covers retailed by JC Whitney. 5
fabric choices. Advertised as custom fit: Lincolns are good, AMC are
even better, DeLorean cover truly fits like a glove. Matches contours
perfectly. Even has pockets for mirrors. Best $120 I ever spent (note
JC Whitney has perennial 15% off sale going). 

My DeLo swam underwater previous trip to DC (remember all that rain
Rich Acuti was cursing...). Never missed a beat. Even discovered that
gull wing doors act like canopies! Water really only affects high
tension electricty, so as long as your ignition is weather tight you
shouldn't ever have moisture problems.

Remember that a DeLo advertised as "all new ignition" may be anything
but. Mine supposedly was, but in fact was plugs only. Distributor is
difficult to access (unless you remove upper air assembly!) -- many
third party mechanics apparently don't even try. Had terrible moisture
problems. Dewy mornings were the worst. But with new cap/rotor/wires
(and high voltage coil), defy the elements with impunity.

Speaking of old components not replaced by third party mechanics,
don't assume that "all new hoses" includes anything more than the two
formed radiator hoses. Are many more hidden and hard to reach. Are a
bigger threat than rain.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, John Gedeon <johne_g_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
>    I am trying to decide if I should buy a delorean or
> not and was wondering what the downfalls would be to
> parking a D outside. Would most probably get a D car
> cover and it would most likely be in a carport. (I
> live in San Diego, CA) 
> 
>    Also what downfalls are to driving in the rain.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> John
> 
> =====
> <>< Proverbs 3:5 "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not
on your own understanding;"




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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2003 20:22:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: Outside Parking

Since my parents Harleys have multiplied, my DeLorean has been forced outside. I keep it double covered... it's got a soft water repellent cover underneath, and a tarp on top. It's worked great so far... my car stays cleaner this way than it did in the garage.

Like the other guys said, the only real mechanical problem you'll run into with driving in the rain is water getting down to the sparkplugs, and this makes the car run crappy. I recently swapped out my spark plugs, and they were pretty rusty looking and pitiful from water building up around them. It made the car run 300% better though! The only other problem you may encounter in wet driving is handling. In dry weather it's impossible for me to lose traction in the DeLo... but it's very easy when it's wet. The windshield wipers are also pretty slow and weak on the car too.

Louie Golden
VIN 10115 Sanford, NC

--- John Gedeon <johne_g_at_dml_yahoo.com> wrote:
>Hi,
>
>   I am trying to decide if I should buy a delorean or
>not and was wondering what the downfalls would be to
>parking a D outside. Would most probably get a D car
>cover and it would most likely be in a carport. (I
>live in San Diego, CA) 
>
>   Also what downfalls are to driving in the rain.
>
>Thanks in advance
>John

_____________________________________________________________
See what you missed! Read the report on the 2003 DMC Open House Event at http://www.delorean.com/2003event.asp



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2003 23:57:31 -0700
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: RE: Power Antenna Fuse

Try a 2 amp.
John Hervey


-----Original Message-----
From: theshovel1224 [mailto:theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 6:36 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Power Antenna Fuse


Power antenna fuse blew the other day.  I can't seem to find the old
fuse and I don't remember what the amp rating was.  Can somebody
please tell me the correct size for the inline fuse in the red 12v
wire for the power antenna?

John Yeoman



To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/







________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 5
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 00:25:49 -0400
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>
Subject: Working on a Delorean

Over the weekend, I went and helped Walter Coe with one of his 
Deloreans. He said I should write up an email about my experience and I 
figure why not.

As a non owner who is saving up, I had a wonderful time helping Walter 
swap out the steering column brushing and replace the steering shaft 
with a newer one. One thing I enjoy about the Delorean community is how 
helpful it is. The ability for a non-owner to help rebuild and fix 
problems on a car so things can be learned before getting one is very 
useful in my opinion. I'd much rather work with someone and help them on 
their car and learn things before I get one and end up causing problems. 
Walter took pictures for documentation and a write up. I am unsure where 
he plans on putting the write up at though.

I did find it interesting that it doesnt take many tools to take the car 
apart. Couple of wrenches, a screwdriver, bit of spray for the rusty 
areas and you can take most of the car apart. Now I just have to try to 
keep myself from buying a project car but aim for my original $16k mark 
as I dont have any place to do a project car.

Samuel




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Message: 6
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 08:50:02 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_lvcm.com>
Subject: Re: Outside Parking

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_f...> wrote:
> It all depends on what kind of neighbourhood you live in.
<SNIP>

That for the most part, pretty much sums up, and says the same for a garage 
as well. If you're worried about someone stealing/valdalizing your car, then a 
garage isn't going to really stop anyone, if they're determined, *technicly*. 
However, a more likely problem with a garage that you'd run into is the 
possibility of things falling off of shelves durring rummaging, earthquakes, 
etc... Although that too is a variable factor depending upon how tidy you keep 
things.

As for carports, the downsides are that you may not be able to work on your 
car if you park it in a carport (this depends upon the association rules of your 
condo/apartment complex). Nor will you be able to obtain most (if not all) 
collector car insurance, if that's something that you're after. Everyone that I 
spoke with stated that one of the requirements was a locked garage for the 
vehicle.

Aside from myself, I personally know of 2 other DeLorean owners here in Las 
Vegas that live in apartments, and park their cars in open carports. So far, 
none of us have problems, or at least, none that I'm aware of. Where you live, 
and who/what type of people your neighbors are is going to play a BIG part. 
Before I settled on my apartment, I toured the entire place, and made it a point 
to look at the other cars that were parked there. A few classic cars, a few 
pickups, a couple of work trucks, and then mostly coupes, and family type 
sedans. Only 2-3 modified import cars (or as everyone I know affectionaly 
refers to them, "rice rockets") out of over 500 units. Now this may not be 
scientific, or a proven method to avoid car theft (GTA can happen anywhere), 
but everyone I know that lives in an apartment complex that's had a number of 
stolen cars, always seem to have a large number of modified import cars 
around, and much younger residents (not that I've much room to talk, since I'm 
only 24). So while it may be a flawed theory, it works for me. Plus it also helps 
to live in a unit which is also in constant line of sight with your car. I made that  
requirement, and my rental company was able, and more than happy to 
accomodate my request.


As for driving in the rain, you do of course want to make sure that your car is 
watertight. The gullwing door design for the DeLorean isn't a problem at all, 
and most time you'll probably find that reseating the door seals will go a long 
way. Otherwise, the DeLorean does have TSBs for water leaks, just like other 
cars. And with a good driver, you'll probably find that the previous owner(s) 
have already done most, if not all of the work for you in sealing up the car.

One rule that I always have tried to adhere to for any vehicle is to try wait at 
least an hour+ or so after a rainstorm has started before driving in it. That'll 
give time for the rain to wash away excess oil from the road (traction), and 
allows most accidents to occur, and get out of the way. Can't speak for snow, 
but I can tell you that with a good set of tires, the DeLorean drives just fine in 
the rain, with minimal slipping of the rear wheels.

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"




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Message: 7
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 11:58:44 -0000
From: "Richard" <dmc_driver_at_dml_yahoo.ca>
Subject: Re: Power Antenna Fuse

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "theshovel1224" <theshovel1224_at_dml_y...>
wrote:
> Power antenna fuse blew the other day.  I can't seem to find the old
> fuse and I don't remember what the amp rating was.  Can somebody
> please tell me the correct size for the inline fuse in the red 12v
> wire for the power antenna?
> 
> John Yeoman

Just went out to my car to check what size fuse is there, and it is a
5amp fuse.  I changed it a few months ago and the old one was a 5A so
I replaced it with the same.  That does not neccessarily mean that
it's the correct size, however.  The old one might have been wrong to
begin with, but I haven't had any problems since, and no sign of the
wire getting too hot. Unfortunately, the DMC manual doesn't show any
information about the power antenna, at least mine doesn't. 
Apparently, it was written before Deloreans were made with power
antennae.  Hope this helps.

Richard Rowe
Vin 5853 
 




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Message: 8
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 13:03:21 -0000
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: Outside Parking

I live in a townhouse without a garage. While it pains me to have to 
keep it outside, it's better than living without it. I agree that 
a "non-advertising" car cover is a good way to go.

Of course in my case, it probably helps that my car presents the 
appearance of being demolished. When my neighbors see me with the 
back end torn off and me standing in the engine compartment making a 
racket with the air tools, I figure everyone decides it's not worth 
taking.  :-)

But hey, it's not demolished. Just sleeping.

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "therealdmcvegas" <DMCVegas_at_dml_l...> 
wrote:
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_f...> 
wrote:
> > It all depends on what kind of neighbourhood you live in.
> <SNIP>
> 
> That for the most part, pretty much sums up, and says the same for 
a garage 
> as well. If you're worried about someone stealing/valdalizing your 
car, then a 
> garage isn't going to really stop anyone, if they're determined, 
*technicly*. 
> However, a more likely problem with a garage that you'd run into is 
the 
> possibility of things falling off of shelves durring rummaging, 
earthquakes, 
> etc... Although that too is a variable factor depending upon how 
tidy you keep 
> things.
> 
> As for carports, the downsides are that you may not be able to work 
on your 
> car if you park it in a carport (this depends upon the association 
rules of your 
> condo/apartment complex). Nor will you be able to obtain most (if 
not all) 
> collector car insurance, if that's something that you're after. 
Everyone that I 
> spoke with stated that one of the requirements was a locked garage 
for the 
> vehicle.
> 
> Aside from myself, I personally know of 2 other DeLorean owners 
here in Las 
> Vegas that live in apartments, and park their cars in open 
carports. So far, 
> none of us have problems, or at least, none that I'm aware of. 
Where you live, 
> and who/what type of people your neighbors are is going to play a 
BIG part. 
> Before I settled on my apartment, I toured the entire place, and 
made it a point 
> to look at the other cars that were parked there. A few classic 
cars, a few 
> pickups, a couple of work trucks, and then mostly coupes, and 
family type 
> sedans. Only 2-3 modified import cars (or as everyone I know 
affectionaly 
> refers to them, "rice rockets") out of over 500 units. Now this may 
not be 
> scientific, or a proven method to avoid car theft (GTA can happen 
anywhere), 
> but everyone I know that lives in an apartment complex that's had a 
number of 
> stolen cars, always seem to have a large number of modified import 
cars 
> around, and much younger residents (not that I've much room to 
talk, since I'm 
> only 24). So while it may be a flawed theory, it works for me. Plus 
it also helps 
> to live in a unit which is also in constant line of sight with your 
car. I made that  
> requirement, and my rental company was able, and more than happy to 
> accomodate my request.
> 
> 
> As for driving in the rain, you do of course want to make sure that 
your car is 
> watertight. The gullwing door design for the DeLorean isn't a 
problem at all, 
> and most time you'll probably find that reseating the door seals 
will go a long 
> way. Otherwise, the DeLorean does have TSBs for water leaks, just 
like other 
> cars. And with a good driver, you'll probably find that the 
previous owner(s) 
> have already done most, if not all of the work for you in sealing 
up the car.
> 
> One rule that I always have tried to adhere to for any vehicle is 
to try wait at 
> least an hour+ or so after a rainstorm has started before driving 
in it. That'll 
> give time for the rain to wash away excess oil from the road 
(traction), and 
> allows most accidents to occur, and get out of the way. Can't speak 
for snow, 
> but I can tell you that with a good set of tires, the DeLorean 
drives just fine in 
> the rain, with minimal slipping of the rear wheels.
> 
> -Robert
> vin 6585 "X"




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Message: 9
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2003 09:10:15 -0400
From: <eric_at_dml_seviernet.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Power Antenna Fuse

Where on the car is the power antenna fuse?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard" <dmc_driver_at_dml_yahoo.ca>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2003 7:58 AM
Subject: [DML] Re: Power Antenna Fuse


>
> Just went out to my car to check what size fuse is there, and it is a
> 5amp fuse.  I changed it a few months ago and the old one was a 5A so
> I replaced it with the same.  That does not neccessarily mean that
> it's the correct size, however.  The old one might have been wrong to
> begin with, but I haven't had any problems since, and no sign of the
> wire getting too hot. Unfortunately, the DMC manual doesn't show any
> information about the power antenna, at least mine doesn't.
> Apparently, it was written before Deloreans were made with power
> antennae.  Hope this helps.
>
> Richard Rowe
> Vin 5853

[Quote trimmed by moderator]



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Message: 10
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 07:04:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Louie G <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: How many Deloreans

It all depends on who you ask. I believe the traditional number is 8586. How that was calculated, I can't tell you. More recent studies by this very website show that there were likely more than 9200 produced. Check out the findings of that study here- http://www.dmcnews.com/faq/n_chron.htm There's a VIN list, build rates by month, options breakdown, and a map of the distribution of remaining cars across the US today. It's a great tool. 

The "last" DeLorean (VIN 20105) was one of the three American Express 24kt Gold DeLoreans... but it wasn't the last one to roll off the continuous assembly line. Instead this car was assembled from leftover parts after the factory had closed. 

Production began in April of 1981, and ended in December of 1982 (though continuous production really ended in August), VINs start at 500 and end at 20104 (this is sans the last Gold DeLorean). 81 VINs begin at 500 and end in the mid 7000s, 82s VINs begin at 10,000 and end in the mid 15,000 range, and '83s are from there on up to 20105. It's important to note that VIN numbers are not continuous, there were quite a few numbers skipped. Production itself wasn't continuous either because of DMC being placed in recievership, and the fact that in '82, the cars just weren't selling. The vast majority of DeLoreans were '81's (something like 6500), the '82s and '83s had build rates of 1000 to 1500 a year respectively. The majority of cars were grey-interior 5-speeds, with the minority being black-interior automatics. 

My preferred cleaning method is scrubbing the car down with a brush, and car soap, then drying it, and using the foaming windex in a can. The scrubbing gets the grain clean and sparkly, and the foaming windex gives the car a great shine, without the reverse effects I've found in the stainless cleaners. The stainless cleaners are expensive, leave greasy marks on other surfaces (such as glass), and sometimes leave a haze on the stainless. Hopefully I hit all your questions :-) .

Louie Golden
VIN 10115 (an '82!) Sanford, NC

--- "phoenix00622002" <barbara0892_at_dml_aol.com> wrote:
>Whats the most accurate estimate of the total number of DMC12s made. 
>What was the last serial number and date? Also what is the best 
>method of cleaning and polishing?
>
>Barbara & AJ
>01550

_____________________________________________________________
See what you missed! Read the report on the 2003 DMC Open House Event at http://www.delorean.com/2003event.asp



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 15:21:45 -0000
From: "phoenix00622002" <barbara0892_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Car Show

Hello,

There is going to be a car show at Cooper River Park and old fashion 
movie. The date is going to be July 25th and the movie is going to 
be "Back to the Future". The website is camdencounty.com and I 
believe they have directions. They have the phone number to register 
your car. Or contact us. Hope to see yous there.
Barbara & AJ




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Message: 12
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 15:54:50 -0000
From: "theshovel1224" <theshovel1224_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Power Antenna Fuse

I found my old power antenna fuse today.  It slipped through down
into the "vault" behind the driver's seat.  Mine was a 6 amp.  So I
guess a 5 or 6 amp fuse will work well.  Anybody happen to know what
size fuses were put in at the factory, or what size the inline fuse
"should" be?

John Yeoman

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Richard" <dmc_driver_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "theshovel1224" <theshovel1224_at_dml_y...>
> wrote:
> > Power antenna fuse blew the other day.  I can't seem to find the
old
> > fuse and I don't remember what the amp rating was.  Can somebody
> > please tell me the correct size for the inline fuse in the red 12v
> > wire for the power antenna?
> > 
> > John Yeoman
> 
> Just went out to my car to check what size fuse is there, and it is
a
> 5amp fuse.  I changed it a few months ago and the old one was a 5A
so
> I replaced it with the same.  That does not neccessarily mean that
> it's the correct size, however.  The old one might have been wrong
to
> begin with, but I haven't had any problems since, and no sign of the
> wire getting too hot. Unfortunately, the DMC manual doesn't show any
> information about the power antenna, at least mine doesn't. 
> Apparently, it was written before Deloreans were made with power
> antennae.  Hope this helps.
> 
> Richard Rowe
> Vin 5853




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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 13
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 09:22:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Justin <voodoonova_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: How many Deloreans

Total estimated of Ds was about 8,583. The VIN to the 
First, SCED-T26-T8-BD0005000
Last, SCED-T26-T8-DD02014
I have aquired this information a few years ago when I was designing a web page for the D.
If anyone else has more accurate info that would be great!
 
As for polishing, I havent got a clue as to the best chemical to use.
 

[Duplicate quote snipped by moderator]



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Message: 14
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2003 11:40:10 -0500
From: "Jake" <jkampho_at_dml_siue.edu>
Subject: Re: How many Deloreans

Sounds like you'll be interested in Knut's compilation:

http://www.dmcnews.com/faq/faq.htm

Jake Kamphoefner



----- Original Message -----
From: "phoenix00622002" <barbara0892_at_dml_aol.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 9:24 PM
Subject: [DML] How many Deloreans


> Whats the most accurate estimate of the total number of DMC12s made.
> What was the last serial number and date? Also what is the best
> method of cleaning and polishing?
>
> Barbara & AJ
> 01550



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 15
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 18:23:34 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Power Antenna Fuse

The power antennae fuse is an in-line fuse. It is located nearby the
relay behind the driver's seat under the carpet and left side cover
panel. As far as size is concerned it should be large enough that it
doesn't blow and small enough that if the motor or wiring should
ground out it will blow. The smaller the better. If you can live on a
2 amp then that is fine. The difference between a 2 and a 5 is small.
This  fuse is meant to blow on a direct short to ground before you
melt wires or relays. The fuse should really be over by the circuit
breaker where it taps off so the wire going across is also protected
but that is the way they did it.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, <eric_at_dml_s...> wrote:
> Where on the car is the power antenna fuse?
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard" <dmc_driver_at_dml_y...>
> To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2003 7:58 AM
> 




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Message: 16
Date: Wed, 02 Jul 2003 18:23:43 -0000
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: How many Deloreans

Speaking of which, how do you go about getting yourself put into 
the "distribution list of remaining cars"?

I'd love to be listed in that.

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Louie G <louie_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> It all depends on who you ask. I believe the traditional number is 
8586. How that was calculated, I can't tell you. More recent studies 
by this very website show that there were likely more than 9200 
produced. Check out the findings of that study here- 
http://www.dmcnews.com/faq/n_chron.htm There's a VIN list, build 
rates by month, options breakdown, and a map of the distribution of 
remaining cars across the US today. It's a great tool. 
> 

[moderator snip]



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________________________________________________________________________



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