From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1852
Date: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 10:02 PM

There are 16 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Delorean at Toyota Dealership in Dallas
From: grub nroot <grubnroot_at_dml_yahoo.com>

2. Re: Original DeLorean Retail Price?
From: Louie Golden <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>

3. Teeny Tiny Ground wires
From: "supermattthehero" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>

4. Re: Re: Barrett-Jackson auction
From: "Lauren" <LPLand_at_dml_earthlink.net>

5. Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

6. Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

7. Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>

8. Re: Dead Battery?
From: "foxmul2001" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>

9. Re: Original DeLorean Retail Price?
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com

10. Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal
From: Pete Berveiler <zamphyr2000_at_dml_yahoo.com>

11. Re: Re: Dead Battery?
From: Darryl Givens <mydmc5898_at_dml_yahoo.com>

12. Fuel Disposal
From: Michael Paine <mpaine_at_dml_tycomsystems.com>

13. Re: Teeny Tiny Ground wires
From: "Dave Swingle" <swingle_at_dml_dmcnews.com>

14. Re: Dead Battery?
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

15. Bricklin-Turner Rotary Vee Engine
From: benjamin strand <benjamin_strand_at_dml_yahoo.com>

16. The rack---The end
From: george caprita <dobedoc2000_at_dml_yahoo.com>





Message: 1
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 12:37:22 -0800 (PST)
From: grub nroot <grubnroot_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Delorean at Toyota Dealership in Dallas

I am not sure if anyone answered this yet, but the '83
at the Dallas(Irving) Toyota Dealership is Vin 6933.
It has 113 miles and is a blk auto. It is in the used
car showroom across the highway from the main
dealership. They said in the last 6 years it has been
out on the road only a couple of times.

Ryan


--- Jerry Harry <jlharry_at_dml_mcloudteleco.com> wrote:
> Robert, Who was the dealer that had the 82 model.
> Since I live here in oklahoma city thought I might
> check on it for the
> list..
> Jerry
> Vin# 4890
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "robert parker" <roberthparker_at_dml_hotmail.com>
> To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 2:34 PM
> Subject: RE: [DML] Delorean at Toyota Dealership in
> Dallas
> 
> 
> > There is also, I believe, a Datsun dealership in
> Okla. City with an unsold
> > '82.  Several yrs. ago I checked on it & it was
> still there. They wanted a
> > rather high price, then, too.  This was the OKC
> DeLorean dealership.
> > Someone so inclined might follow up on its status.
>   Drive Stainless
> > Robert  VIN 6924



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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:53:48 -0800 (PST)
From: Louie Golden <louie_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: Original DeLorean Retail Price?

MSRP for '81 DeLoreans was $25k, but destination and processing charges ran the sticker up to about $26.5k. Just as in most cars, DeLoreans commanded a larger price as time wore on. With the DeLorean though this wasn't due to a remodel, or upgrades, but instead was because the company was sinking, and dealers weren't selling their cars, inflation problems, and everyone needed profit. It seems that the people at DMC felt that if the car had a higher asking price, then it's percieved quality and value were higher as well. I'm not making this stuff up folks... in the Pennebaker Hedgus documentary there is a meeting of DeLorean execs discussing a JD Power study on this exact subject. I also have a consolidated advertisement from '83 that has MSRP for '83 DeLoreans being $34k, but they are advertising for $13k off that list price... $21k. You answered your own question when you mentioned that your friend's car was bought through a dealership... not through consolidated itself.

Louie Golden
VIN 5252 Charlotte, NC

--- PRC1216_at_dml_aol.com wrote:
Hey all,
     I recently found a copy of a friend's window sticker he had given to me 
long before I had my own DeLorean.   His car is an '83, port of entry was 
Baltimore, and it was purchased at Williams Ford in Cincinnati, Ohio.   It says 
that the total suggested retail price is $34,007.90    Doesn't this seem 
excessive?   I thought that the average list price was around $25,000.    I would 
expect an '83 to be even less $ than that due to Consolidated liquidating them.   
Can someone clear this up?

Patrick Conlon
1880



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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 04:14:11 -0000
From: "supermattthehero" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>
Subject: Teeny Tiny Ground wires

In the process of cleaning up around my luggage compartment and
windshield headers, I keep finding these little tiny ground wires that
are about as thick as a piece of string.  They are usually corroded
very badly when I find them and fall apart easily.  Is it necessary to
replace these or are they just there for good measure?  One place in
particular I found a few is underneath the rubber strips on the sides
of the luggage compartment.

Matt
#1604




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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:36:41 -0700
From: "Lauren" <LPLand_at_dml_earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Barrett-Jackson auction


> Here are the results from the auction.  Lot #202 did sell for a fair
> price however the car looked like a 12,000 car.

Thank you so much.   I see that the auction results are finally up on 
the B-J website.  And yes, up close, the car wasn't *dazzling.*

.....................LP



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Message: 5
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 03:26:55 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal

Don't even think of doing this anymore. Modern gasoline has some very
nasty additives that have a high affinity to water. Once in the ground
they get into the water table and a tiny amount can contaminate a huge
aquifer. In particular MTBE is terrible. You will eventually be
drinking that in your well water. Use up the old fuel or take it to a
gas station. In many areas they have a "recycle day" where you can
bring old paint, old gas, insecticides, etc. Try to get rid of ANY
hazardous waste correctly. BTW if you remove the heat shields for the
muffler or catalytic converter double bag them and dispose of as
hazardous waste also. They are asbestoes. Any other fluids like engine
oil, trans fluid, or brake fluid should also be disposed of correctly.
Try places like the quick change lube shops, they usually are happy to
take it. Recycle anti-freeze too. NEVER leave puddles on the ground,
it is toxic but attractive to animals. Your pet dog or cat will die
quickly from even a little bit of it. If you are unsure of where to
take these things call your local EPA office or just talk to a local
gas station. In New Jersey any place that sells oil MUST either take
in old oil or have arrangements with someplace that they can send
customers to. Even supermarkets (they sell motor oil) MUST take old
oil (which they don't) so they have arrangments with a local gas station. 


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Michael T Twigger <marktwigger_at_dml_j...>
wrote:
> [Moderator Note: This suggestion might be illegal, depending on
where you live]
> 
> Well if you own a lot of land just find a spot
> way out the way of your house and tip it out
> on a rainy day for after. Kills those weeds like nothing else.
> 
> If your fuel tank is out the car. Take it to a
> high power washer. That will clean out all the gunk.




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Message: 6
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 05:11:57 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal

Have you actually tried this? Conventional wisdom in my neck of the
woods is: drizzling used oil from an oil change in driveway cracks
will keep grass and weeds from growing, so I tried it. Honestly, they
grew BETTER with the oil! And the most overgrown places on Earth are
funky old junkyards. I don't think automotive petroluem products are
as caustic to plant life as rumored. 

Old fashioned green antifreeze does kill grass (centipede at least) --
if you spill a bunch while working on a cooling system, don't just
assume that running off the edge of the driveway will be OK. Also be
careful with puddles of it around animals: they like the sweet taste
but it causes kidney failure a couple of days later.

Regarding gunk in the fuel tank: you'd be amazed at what accumulates
after 25 or 30 years. One of my Lincolns' is so bad I use 2 fuel
filters -- one before the pump and the regular one on the carburetor.
Running close to empty in an old or high mileage car is a bad idea
(you'll suck that gunk right up).

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Michael T Twigger <marktwigger_at_dml_j...>
wrote:
> [Moderator Note: This suggestion might be illegal, depending on
where you live]
> 
> Well if you own a lot of land just find a spot
> way out the way of your house and tip it out
> on a rainy day for after. Kills those weeds like nothing else.
> 
> If your fuel tank is out the car. Take it to a
> high power washer. That will clean out all the gunk.




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Message: 7
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 07:10:35 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Michael T Twigger <marktwigger_at_dml_j...>
wrote:
> [Moderator Note: This suggestion might be illegal, depending on
where you live]
> 
> Well if you own a lot of land just find a spot
> way out the way of your house and tip it out
> on a rainy day for after. Kills those weeds like nothing else.
> 
> If your fuel tank is out the car. Take it to a
> high power washer. That will clean out all the gunk.

(Sorry Mods, but I've got to chime in on this one)

No matter where you live, it is absolutely ILLEGAL to dump gasoline
out in the enviornment! Fines aside, what you dump will end up in the
local water table, and 
depending upon where you live, if you drink untreated well water,
you'll just end up 
consuming the same hazardous chemicals that you just dumped!

If you absolutely MUST avoid burning the old fuel off as the EPA
recomends, or if no hazmat recycling facilities are available, there
is of course one alternative.

Local coin-op car washes use traps which are designed to capture mud
and sand, 
before they can clog the local sewer system. And of course because mud
washed from cars potentiall contaminated with petrolium products, it
serves that dual purpose as well. And as a result, the waste sludge is
pumped out every so often
for sanitary disposal. Also, if any trace amouts of fuel do make it
into the sewer, your local water treatment/reclamation plant is more
than capabile of handling small trace amounts when they skim waste
water. (but they perfer not to, as it kills off aerobic bacteria, and
results in more solid waste that needs disposing of). But I would
still consider this method a "last ditch effort" when ridding yourself
of waste fuel.

Otherwise, proper safety equipment aside, I'd reccomend the powerwash
method at the local carwash for cleaning the gastank if removed, as
well, because of this. Plus, if you live in a cold region, you'll find
storm doors on the wash bays for a little extra privacy while you
perform your work.

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"




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Message: 8
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 02:50:45 -0000
From: "foxmul2001" <foxmul_at_dml_bellatlantic.net>
Subject: Re: Dead Battery?

I already had the Throttle cover recall on my car and now the cable 
has frozen at the max position.  How do i unfreeze it, lube it, and 
antifreeze it.  Thanks,

JOseph M.





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Message: 9
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:42:23 EST
From: Soma576_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Re: Original DeLorean Retail Price?

In a message dated 1/27/04 11:27:05 PM Central Standard Time, 
louie_at_dml_delorean.com writes:
You answered your own question when you mentioned that your friend's car was 
bought through a dealership... not through consolidated itself.

Louie Golden
VIN 5252 Charlotte, NC
>>>>>>.
My car (VIN11596) was purchased at a DMC dealership in Ohio, yet i have 
paperwork from consolidated outlining warranty rules, consolidated business cards, 
etc.

Surely Consolidated utilized the dealer network as best they could to save 
time and money.

Andy


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 10
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 05:23:20 -0800 (PST)
From: Pete Berveiler <zamphyr2000_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Flushing Fuel System/ Fuel Disposal

[Moderator Note: This subject has drifted away from the DeLorean.  Pete's message will be the last word on the subject.  - moderator Mike Substelny]


Michael,

As an Environmental Engineer, your comment astounds
me..  Do people really know so little about our
ecosystem??  Please note I am not a hippie liberal
treehugger, but I see what the EPA and state agencies
are demanding, and the cost to get most site to this
level is significant. 

A single gallon of gasoline can contaminate 1,000,000
gallons of groundwater, based on partition
coefficients.  True it usually takes 10 gallons
spilled at the surface to get the 1 gallon to the
aquifer, but en masse, we usually do this at almost
every gas station every day (drip spills, etc)

Gasoline and many other automotive substances (fuel,
etc) should be properly disposed of by professionals. 
Almost any service station (not pep boys, etc) with
service bays can handle it.

If you have no other recourse, find a place to burn
it.  The volatile components have less impact on the
atmosphere than on soil/groundwater.

Pete


--- Michael T Twigger <marktwigger_at_dml_juno.com> wrote:
> [Moderator Note: This suggestion might be illegal,
> depending on where you live]
> 
> Well if you own a lot of land just find a spot
> way out the way of your house and tip it out
> on a rainy day for after. Kills those weeds like
> nothing else.
> 
> If your fuel tank is out the car. Take it to a
> high power washer. That will clean out all the gunk.
> 
> 


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it!
http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/



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Message: 11
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:23:54 -0800 (PST)
From: Darryl Givens <mydmc5898_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Dead Battery?

the way I set back the cable, and this may not be the right way, but the wheel that is closests to the rear of the car that the cable goes around, I just pulled on it and it moved back into the regular postion. I didn't brake anything, but I'm not sure how wise it is to do that.
 
Darryl
5898



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Message: 12
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:17:17 -0500
From: Michael Paine <mpaine_at_dml_tycomsystems.com>
Subject: Fuel Disposal

FYI 

http://www.wswmd.org/greenpages#gas

Regards,

Michael



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Message: 13
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 20:45:12 -0000
From: "Dave Swingle" <swingle_at_dml_dmcnews.com>
Subject: Re: Teeny Tiny Ground wires

Those links are primarily to keep the sheet metal parts from building 
up a static charge. Disconnected, there's a slight chance that you'll 
notice more incidence of getting static shocks when you touch the car 
after being driven, and slightly more incidence of radio interference 
(mostly on AM). 

My guess is that you wouldn't miss them. They are not used to carry 
any real ground current (e.g. lighting systems). 

Dave Swingle

 --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "supermattthehero" <supermatty_at_dml_p...> 
wrote:
> In the process of cleaning up around my luggage compartment and
> windshield headers, I keep finding these little tiny ground wires 
that
> are about as thick as a piece of string.  They are usually corroded
> very badly when I find them and fall apart easily.  Is it necessary 
to
> replace these or are they just there for good measure?  One place in
> particular I found a few is underneath the rubber strips on the 
sides
> of the luggage compartment.





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Message: 14
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 15:43:34 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Dead Battery?

To "unfreeze" it put the car in a warm garage. To lubricate it get the
Throttle Recall Procedure and follow the steps to force anti-freeze
into the throttle cable. If this doesn't work then you have other
problems. Something is binding somewhere and you will have to
disconnect things till you figure out what is binding.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "foxmul2001" <foxmul_at_dml_b...> wrote:
> I already had the Throttle cover recall on my car and now the cable 
> has frozen at the max position.  How do i unfreeze it, lube it, and 
> antifreeze it.  Thanks,
> 
> JOseph M.




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Message: 15
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 13:49:44 -0800 (PST)
From: benjamin strand <benjamin_strand_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Bricklin-Turner Rotary Vee Engine

[Moderator Note: I've approved this message because several DMLers are knowledgeable about Bricklins and might have the answers.  Please respond by private email, as I will not approve further messages on the subject.  - moderator Mike Substelny]

I was hoping someone on the list with knowledge of Malcolm Bricklin could help me learn about the history of his Rotary Vee Engine endeavor.
 
I was researching rotary engines when I came across this website:
http://www.saintjohn.nbcc.nb.ca/~Heritage/bricklin/Rotary.htm
 
Does anyone have any information on this engine? or could possibly give a better explanation of how such an engine would work (pistons yet still rotary?)?  I would really like to get in touch with this Frank Turner and get the schematics if anyone has heard of him.



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Message: 16
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:02:24 -0800 (PST)
From: george caprita <dobedoc2000_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: The rack---The end

List:  I humbly apologize to the subject of this post for being so late. 
On Wednesday, January 13, at !:00 p.m. (the day after my rack story) I
answered my phone to hear:  "This is Stephen at DeLorean Motor Company"
(I'm not sure about his name as I went into mild shock when I heard D.M.C.)

He said, "How are you today?"  I said I was doing pretty good, but I guess I'm going to get chewed out now!  He said "no, not at all.  I called to thank you for bringing this matter to my attention."

I about fell off my chair!!  It turns out he knew nothing about it.  He said he went to look for it (the rack), found the crate and the letter still in it, but no rack.  He said he was sorry this happened and they were going to make changes in procedures to assure this sort of thing never happens again.  He also said he  would see to it that I got a full refund. (Feeling somewhat guilty) I said he could just give me a credit.  But he said," No, that would lock you in to having to deal with us" and he wanted that to be my decision. Can you believe that!

One week after our conversation, Wednesday the 20th, I received a full refund.  DMCH can be assured they will get it all back and more.  I would not hesitate in the future to deal with a company that has treated me so honestly and has been more than fair with me.  

It is reassuring to know that all of the dealers and vendors we have to depend on are of this caliber!

Thank you, Stephen - Thank you, DMCH
 
George Caprita



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