From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1892
Date: Sunday, February 29, 2004 9:38 AM

There are 13 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Throttle body
From: John Podlewski <john_podlewski_at_dml_yahoo.com>

2. Re: Re: Do it yourselfers might wanna see this
From: Jan van de Wouw <delorean_at_dml_home.nl>

3. Re: Old Tires and Hoses
From: DMCVIN6683 <dmcvin6683_at_dml_wi.rr.com>

4. Atlantic City Classic Car Auction - DeLorean
From: Dmc3360_at_dml_aol.com

5. Electrical/Alternator Problem.
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>

6. valve duration
From: "Andrei Cular" <acular_at_dml_tampabay.rr.com>

7. Re: Johnny D the Pseudo Man
From: H Currier <h_currier_at_dml_yahoo.com>

8. Re: Johnny D the Pseudo Man
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>

9. Re: Johnny D the Pseudo Man
From: "Brian McCool" <bjmccool_at_dml_comcast.net>

10. Re: windshield washer pump motor
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>

11. How To Secure DeLorean Properly on Trailer
From: "R... V.W." <phaedradolly_at_dml_yahoo.com>

12. NEW OWNER FINALLY!!!!!!! Question regarding Insurance
From: "racaliendo" <RACaliendo_at_dml_aol.com>

13. won't start
From: advantics_at_dml_aol.com





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:26:20 -0800 (PST)
From: John Podlewski <john_podlewski_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Throttle body

Similar problem Idles _at_dml_ 900 RPM but sticks sometimes _at_dml_ 1500 RPM, a blimp of gas fits it right away til the next time.  Not sticking throttle plate though, it is all clean.  Could it be the accell. cable seems a bit stretched out.  Big channel locks work great on stuck Oil Filter. THANKS!

Roland Smith <roland_at_dml_dnai.com> wrote: I had an idle fast problem. My DMC has an automatic transmission and when I
came to a stop and moved the selector to neutral the rpm soared to 1800. A
quick blip with the throttle dropped the rpm to 800.

My mechanic cleaned and lubricated the throttle linkage and cured the
problem.

Roland Smith
6667
Oakland, California
----- Original Message -----
From: "doki_pen" 
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 7:08 PM
Subject: [DML] Throttle body


> Hi everyone
>
> My car tends to idle fast, however if I push on the throttle lever
> on the throttle body the idle drops down some. Do you think it may
> be time to rebuild it? Or maybe there's a spring adjustment on it
> or something.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Jon
>
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>





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Message: 2
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 17:33:25 +0100
From: Jan van de Wouw <delorean_at_dml_home.nl>
Subject: Re: Re: Do it yourselfers might wanna see this

On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 22:25:52 -0500, Noah wrote:

> On Thu, Feb 26, 2004 at 08:08:46AM -0800, jdub wrote:
>> I don't know why I didn't think of this...
> Also this:
> http://accessiblesystems.com/etfiles/et.htm

I can't help but think it's a clumsy thing...
You have to remove 3 wheels befor the car is
even an inch off of the ground...

I'd think it would take you more that an hour
each job you do to install and remove the system.

On top of that, no car is supposed to be on it's side,
there might be problems with fluids leaking and there
WILL be stresses on parts that are not supposed to take
them in the way  and length of time the forces are presented.
I'm thinking of suspension bushes and things
like the front lower control arms...

Besides that, this will NOT be of ANY help when doing
a lube job, as the oil will not drain properly.

Renting a lift bay in a DIY workshop would e my advice...

Jan van de Wouw

Thinking Different...   Using a Mac...
Living the Dream...   Driving a DeLorean...

DMC-12 "Dagger" since sep. 2000
100NX "Saphire" since nov. 2002
-------------------------------




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 3
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:20:11 -0600
From: DMCVIN6683 <dmcvin6683_at_dml_wi.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Old Tires and Hoses

For belts and hoses i was always told 4 years or 40,000 miles, what 
ever comes first. This is similar to oil changes. 3 months 3000 miles 
what ever comes first.

I agree that no one should be driving on coolant hoses that are older 
than 10 years old because in 10 years you can put a million miles on 
that car and a hose blowing out will happen thats why i say 4 years 
40,000 miles.

Gates the worlds most trusted name in belts and hoses also recommends 
the 4 year rule, and they now their belts and hoses. www.gates.com

Mark


On Friday, February 27, 2004, at 11:27 AM, David Teitelbaum wrote:

> This subject is comimg up more and more frequently on other car
> bulletin boards and newsletters. The current advice is to replace
> tires after 7 years even if they still look good and sooner if they
> have "dry rot" or tiny cracks in the sidewall or ANY other defect. No
> one should be driving on coolant hoses older than 10 years old, less
> if they are swollen, cracked, or hard. When a new owner gets an old
> car they aren't always ready to spend a large sum of money on a car
> that runs so they put off replacing these old parts and instead
> concentrate on the cosmetics, neglecting safety and reliability. Even
> owners that have a car for a long time will procrastinate on replacing
> what look like perfectly good parts. Ownership of a car means
> budgeting for replacing parts if you use the car or not. Batteries
> need to be replaced 5-7 years. Brake and clutch fluid EVERY 2 years.
> Anti-freeze tested every year. Failure to heed this advice WILL result
> in the car letting you down when you least expect it but you should
> have! On Deloreans you also have the struts that don't last forever if
> you want the doors to stay up. On cars that have been in "storage" you
> can expect to have to replace EVERYTHING. The alternative is to fix
> things as they break (which they will) meanwhile stranding you
> everywhere until you lose all confidance in the car and stop driving 
> it.
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757
>
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see 
> www.dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
Come see all of my Photo's at my Website.
http://photos.yahoo.com/snextime




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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 12:09:15 EST
From: Dmc3360_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Atlantic City Classic Car Auction - DeLorean

I attended the Atlantic City Classic Car Auction on Friday.  They had a 1983 
DeLorean on the auction block that day. The car was claimed to have 2,000 
original miles.  The car was in good shape but not by any means a top condition 
DeLorean.  It had some brush marks in the stainless and some small cosmetic 
issues in the engine and interior.   However I watched the crowd as the bidding 
progressed.  Even with the auctioneer making jokes during the bidding about 
frying an egg on the car in hot weather, there seemed to be two parties very 
interested in the car.  It sold for $22,500.  I thought that to be a good price for 
this particular DeLorean.  I would rate it at about a 15,000 to 18,000 
condition car.  Hopefully this (as well as the prices at the Barret-Jackson event) 
is a sign that the cars are rising in demand and value.

Gary Gore


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 5
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 09:30:05 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Electrical/Alternator Problem.

While driving home from work Friday afternoon, my alternator decided to quit charging, 
and the gagues decided to quit functioning as well. About 6-7 miles of driving on battery 
power alone got me safely home. But I am puzzled.

The oil temp gague is disconnected, but instead of pointing straight up, it goes to the "L" 
in the word "OIL", and my temp gague is reading hotter than normal. Not sure if the fuel 
gague is working still, but the Voltmeter is dead, and the Tach is stuck _at_dml_ 1900, like it is 
when it's off. When I Put the ket in the "ON" position, NONE of the warning lights in the 
binnacle turn on.

If this was something as simple as a burned out lightbulb in the dash, for the battery, I 
wouldn't think that these other items would be affected. So I am curious as to if there is 
perhaps a common ground point (such as the one behind the radio) that may have come 
loose, and would have caused all of these problems, seeing as how grounding problems 
can cause such problems. Although another oddity is that with the key out, my door 
buzzer squeeled a couple of times, even though it's been disconnected from the door 
plunger.

Any ideas on this one? I had to leave for another engagement, and have not even had time 
to check up on the car since. Not even the fuses. But otherwise, the radio, blower motor, 
and most other accessories work fine. Although the turn signals did die on me a couple of 
weeks ago...

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"




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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 23:28:36 -0500
From: "Andrei Cular" <acular_at_dml_tampabay.rr.com>
Subject: valve duration

Does anyone know why the timing is different between the RH and LH banks?
According to the shop manual page A:02:01 Inlet opens 9 BTDC for the LH and
7 BTDC for the RH.  Then closes at 45ABDC and 43 ABDC for the LH and RH
banks respectivly.  Is this a typo or do the RH valves stay open 4degrees
less than the LH?


Andrei and the Fridge Run Gang without Rich....




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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 7
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:21:02 -0800 (PST)
From: H Currier <h_currier_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Johnny D the Pseudo Man

In the month and a half I've been enjoying this
Delorean group e-mail list, I must say that this is
the most emotion stirring message I've read so far.
While others like me are saddened that John D has
chosen not to attend the Delorean Show, there is
absolutely no benefit in pointing out his
shortcomings. I choose to remain positive.  I would be
honored if the man behind such a great car made an
appearance at the show to please Delorean fans.
  
I'm old enough to remember when the television news 
showed pictures of John D getting arrested at the
airport with cocaine. I was disappointed for many
reasons - one was the demise of such a revolutionary
car. 

I'm also an engineer. Here are the facts: 
1. Nobody's perfect.
2. John D had a hellava vision - the car speaks for
itself.
3. He took a tremendous personal risk to save the
company. 
4. The 8,000+ cars built bearing his names speak for
his accomplishments.

OK, I'm off my soap box. Hope the moderator lets this
through. Suspect there'll be many replies.

Thanks to all for your contributions to this email
group.

Howard
Delorean owner wannabe
(I've already ID'd a prospect D for ownership)

--- BePositive2000_at_dml_Yahoo.com wrote:
> Over the past several months I have read a lot of
> comments on John
> DeLorean the legend and John D the man.  More
> recently, I have read
> discussion relating to decisions of attending Pigeon
> Forge base on Mr.
> D's attendance.
> 
> As a owner of 2 D's, I have a great appreciation for
> the innovation
> that was incorporated into the car. It's an
> engineer's car and I'm an
> engineer. Whether the car is a result of John D's
> concepts or he just
> hired some very creative designers, there is no
> question that the car
> is still innovative by today's standards, 20+ years
> after it's initial
> production. DeLorean went up against the big guys
> and made a
> revolutionary car.
> 
> Yet is was John DeLorean himself, not the big guys
> and not his
> employees or suppliers that made the company fail.
> It was HIS inept
> management, ego, arrogance, greed, quality problems,
> poor business
> practices and at least questionable business ethics
> that cause the
> company failure.  The ripple effect of his actions
> also cause the
> demise of other inovative companies that naievely or
> foolishly relied
> on his word and made significant investments in
> anticipation of a
> successful DMC.
> 
> I for one would not pause a second to shake John
> DeLorean's hand, not
> because I do not appreciate his vision, but because
> I do not respect
> him as a man of integrity.  In no way would his
> presence or lack
> thereof influence my decision to attend Pigeon
> Forge.   Conversely,
> shaking the hand of one of you that have given of
> your time willingly
> to offer helpful comments and share your personal
> experiences is
> unquestionably a reason for me to drive over 1000
> miles.  Plus, 
> several of you can probably tell me more than Johnny
> Boy about how to
> fix my cars.
> 
> Thanks again guys & ladies for all your help.
> 
> Woody
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating
> team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for
> sale see www.dmcnews.com
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
>      dmcnews-unsubscribe_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
> 
>  
> 


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Message: 8
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:10:29 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Re: Johnny D the Pseudo Man

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, BePositive2000_at_dml_Y... wrote:
<SNIP>
> Yet is was John DeLorean himself, not the big guys and not his
> employees or suppliers that made the company fail. It was HIS inept
> management, ego, arrogance, greed, quality problems, poor business
> practices and at least questionable business ethics that cause the
> company failure.  The ripple effect of his actions also cause the
> demise of other inovative companies that naievely or foolishly relied
> on his word and made significant investments in anticipation of a
> successful DMC.
<SNIP>

Speaking totally unbiased, I can honestly tell you this: Pinning the
entire responsibility for the failure of DMC on John DeLorean, is like
trying to give him the entire credit for the companies' ability to
actually make it into production. While you can cite examples of JZD's
actions that may fit into the catergories of "inept management, ego,
arrogance, greed, quality problems, poor business practices and at
least questionable business ethics", you'd be even more hard pressed
to find other employees who were not guilty of those same negative
actions against the company.

And just as it was a group effort to start-up the company, so was it
to bring it crashing down. There is no chaos action here which cause
the company to come falling down. While one can site both examples of
good business moves, and negative ones, and what the company should
have done, it still doesn't change the fact that the company was
brought down by many, and not a single person. And hell, believe me
when I say that I'd LOVE to have a 'scapegoat to blame the companies
failure one! The fact that I can't go down to my local dealership to
buy a brand new 2005 DeLorean, that I can't go and buy parts from said
dealer, the fact that many people don't respect my car, and that I
catch allot of hell in the form of crude drug jokes and other negative
comments, and I totally despise the fact that the storybook tale of a
man who rallied many to take one the giants of the automotive industry
doesn't have a happy ending. I hate all the negativity surrounding my
car, because of the companies failure, and most of all, I hate the
fact that I have absolutely no one to blame it on! I'd love to say,
"Detroit did it!", or "The British Government did it!", or someone
else did it because of some sort of hidden agenda! But I can't,
because that wouldn't be true. There is no single person/organization,
or cause that lead to the companies demise.

Did JZD mismanage DMC? Maybe, since after all he had to spend an
insane amount of time and focus on gaining working capitol to fuel the
company, rather than drive it. But lets not forget that entire
managerial staff that the company hired, and issued regular paychecks
to, so they could MANAGE the company. Like I've said before, DMC was
this giant cookie jar that everyone had their hands in, and when even
the jar broke, JZD was the first one blamed. He took a HUGE risk
putting his name the company, so it's failures and successes would
reflect the most upon him.

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:16:49 -0600
From: "Brian McCool" <bjmccool_at_dml_comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Johnny D the Pseudo Man

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
 I personally think it would have been more appropriate to just say you were
still coming to Pigeon Forge and it would be fun and its sad John won't be
there like most of the other posts. But you chose to blast the man that is
responsible for their being a car for us to enjoy owning  in the first
place. Am I disappointed that John isn't coming? You bet I am. This is the
third time I won't get to meet him. I didn't have the money when I was in
college to go to the Cleveland show and now I'm really kicking myself. I did
go ahead and go to the Memphis show and enjoyed meeting his daughter
Katherine. Ken puts on a great show, and anyone that hasn't gone to at least
one is really missing out. But my main reason for going to this show was
because John was going to be there. Now that he's not going, I just can't
justify the money it would cost me. I could speculate all day long about the
reasons why John isn't coming, but I'm not going to start making personal
attacks toward his integrity.
 Saying that John is solely responsible for the downfall of his company is
ridiculous. Granted, every decision he made wasn't the correct one, but
until I start an auto company from scratch, I'm not going to blame
everything on John. There are numerous other factors that have been gone
over on this list, books, and the media. It's always easier to say he should
have done some things differently looking back. I'm sure John would have
made different decisions looking back, but what's done is done. I think he
has sacrificed more than enough over the last 20 years.
I would be glad to shake John's hand, and hopefully, one day, I'll have the
chance.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <BePositive2000_at_dml_Yahoo.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2004 2:45 AM
Subject: [DML] Johnny D the Pseudo Man


> Over the past several months I have read a lot of comments on John
> DeLorean the legend and John D the man.  More recently, I have read
> discussion relating to decisions of attending Pigeon Forge base on Mr.
> D's attendance.
>
> As a owner of 2 D's, I have a great appreciation for the innovation
> that was incorporated into the car. It's an engineer's car and I'm an
> engineer. Whether the car is a result of John D's concepts or he just
> hired some very creative designers, there is no question that the car
> is still innovative by today's standards, 20+ years after it's initial
> production. DeLorean went up against the big guys and made a
> revolutionary car.
>
> Yet is was John DeLorean himself, not the big guys and not his
> employees or suppliers that made the company fail. It was HIS inept
> management, ego, arrogance, greed, quality problems, poor business
> practices and at least questionable business ethics that cause the
> company failure.  The ripple effect of his actions also cause the
> demise of other inovative companies that naievely or foolishly relied
> on his word and made significant investments in anticipation of a
> successful DMC.
>
> I for one would not pause a second to shake John DeLorean's hand, not
> because I do not appreciate his vision, but because I do not respect
> him as a man of integrity.  In no way would his presence or lack
> thereof influence my decision to attend Pigeon Forge.   Conversely,
> shaking the hand of one of you that have given of your time willingly
> to offer helpful comments and share your personal experiences is
> unquestionably a reason for me to drive over 1000 miles.  Plus,
> several of you can probably tell me more than Johnny Boy about how to
> fix my cars.
>
> Thanks again guys & ladies for all your help.
>
> Woody
>
>
>
>
>
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
>
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:25:55 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Re: windshield washer pump motor

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "aaron_t_graham" <aaron_t_graham_at_dml_y...> wrote:
<SNIP>
> Also, does anyone know of a good place to get a good WS washer pump?  
> Last one I bought didn't even last through a single winter.  And it 
> was actually replaced (and installed) by one of the main DMC 
> vendors...
> 
> Aaron
> #1506

Nothing wrong with the stock washer fluid pump, it's the drain holes on the bottom! They 
easily allow water to be pushed in, but won't allow it to drain back out, because they're so 
small. Next time you drop the bucket to replace the washer pump, take a large knife, and 
twist it in each of the 3 holes to drill them out so they'll be larger, and will allow the water 
to flow back out. Do this from the inside, so the beveled scrape marks from the blade 
won't show.

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:01:31 -0800 (PST)
From: "R... V.W." <phaedradolly_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: How To Secure DeLorean Properly on Trailer

Hi All,
 
I Just bought a trailer for my DeLorean and I am interested in driviing from California to Tennessee with it to attend the DeLorean Car Show. I would like some great suggestions in securing the D. on the bed right. It is an open trailer.
 
 
Thank you so much,
Rita
#3003


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Message: 12
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 22:50:38 -0000
From: "racaliendo" <RACaliendo_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: NEW OWNER FINALLY!!!!!!! Question regarding Insurance

Hello Everyone, 

I have been a member of the list for quite a few years now, but I've 
only been an owner for about two weeks. My last post back in 
September was when I was looking at an 81 with the wide side stripes. 
I had posted to ask if they were removable and the response I 
received from the list was very encouraging. it is nice to associate 
with people who are as passionate about the car as I am.

The 81 purchase did not work out, but I am the exceptionally proud 
owner of a one-owner, 24k mile, 1983 Automatic, with black interior. 
VIN 16793

My question for the list regards insurance. I'm a 28 year old male 
with a perfect driving record. However, the quotes that I have been 
receiving for insurance would make all of you cry. My current vehicle 
is insured with State Farm, but my agent's office assures me that 
State farm will not insure Deloreans.

However, by searching the DML I had noticed that several people say 
that their cars insured with State Farm. If anyone has any advice on 
this subject, I would really appreciate it. Also, if anyone is 
willing to share their approximate insurance cost examples, it would 
be appreciated. I would not be opposed to companies other than State 
Farm if anybody has anyone to recommend. I live in the Western 
Chicago suburbs.

Thanks to all in advance.


Richie Caliendo
RACaliendo_at_dml_aol.com






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________________________________________________________________________


Message: 13
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:50:18 EST
From: advantics_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: won't start

Howdy group. VIN number 5326 now has a new fuel accumulator (as well as 
everything else from the tank to the injectors) and now for the first time I have 
fuel pressure. She still won't start, and I'm sure the 02 is way out of whack 
from all the adjusting I did before I realized the accumulator was bad. Can 
anyone recommend a good starting point to get it close. Thanks again for all your 
help. I still have a lot to learn, but have learned a whole lot.

John 5326 and 1383


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


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