From: <>
To: <>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1900
Date: Friday, March 05, 2004 4:10 PM

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean

2. Re: Speedometer Button Question
From: Josh Haldeman <>

3. Cincinnati St. Patricks Day Parade!
From: Josh Haldeman <>

4. Re: Volvo's new female designed Gullwing Sports Car
From: "Richard" <>

5. Re: Electrical question
From: "Richard" <>

6. RE: Carbureted PRV
From: "John Hervey" <>

7. RE: Carbureted PRV
From: "John Hervey" <>

8. Re: What is BEST cleaning method for Stainless?
From: "Richard" <>

9. RE: Gauge Problems
From: "John Hervey" <>

10. Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean
From: "Richard" <>

11. Re: "second generation"
From: Andrew Prentis <>

12. Best Car Cleaning Method
From: Tom Watkins <>

13. Raffle car Update

14. Re: Gauge Problems

15. Re: Gauge Problems
From: "David Teitelbaum" <>

16. Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean
From: "thebrave65" <>

17. Re: fuel lines

18. Re: "second generation"
From: "David Teitelbaum" <>

19. Re: Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean
From: "Henry" <>

20. RE: Electrical question
From: "jdub" <>

21. Re: Famous TV/Movie Car Poll --- RESULTS
From: Shannon Yocom <>

22. Re: Carbureted PRV
From: "content22207" <>

23. Re: Speedometer Button Question
From: "James" <>

24. Re: Volvo's new female designed Gullwing Sports Car
From: "therealdmcvegas" <>

25. door adjustment workshop in Pigeon Forge?
From: <>

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:15:06 EST
Subject: Re: Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean

In a message dated 3/4/2004 9:09:33 PM Pacific Standard Time, writes:
- Horror stories. What is the most difficult repair job you've had to
deal with? Difficulty being assessed in terms of the job itself as
well as locating parts. 
First of all parts are not an issue.

I have disassembled and reassembled total wrecks and have had the cars come 
out just fine.  We have rebuilt engines, transmissions, front ends.  There has 
been replacement of all of the stainless panels, door repairs (handles, window 
motors, door locks) Dealt with wiring problems etc.  

And none of them compare to the difficulties I have had with Jaguars, 
Mustangs or even my wife's Ford Taurus.  I find this car relatively easy to repair 
and while I am still learning there is nothing on the car I would not attempt.  

The raffle car itself got a complete refurbish inside and out. It can also be 
done cost efficiently.  So that is one reason I am into DeLoreans

Buying a D was the best thing I ever did.

Wait until you see my next project.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 2
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:44:06 -0500
From: Josh Haldeman <>
Subject: Re: Speedometer Button Question

Hi Adam,

0. "Discover" the upside down seating position for the DeLorean, by 
sticking your head into the driver's footwell, then maneuvering your 
torso around the seat, and sticking your legs up either on the door 
sill, or the seat top.

1. Underneath your dashboard, there are six 7mm nylock nuts, four of 
which have huge wide washers on them.  Remove those (two front, two 
back, and two next to the steering column) and the binnacle will fall 
forward a bit. 

2. Reposition to "standard seating orientation", Lift the binnacle up 
and forward far enough to reach in and disconnect the two wiring 
harnesses from the back. (hard to see...just pinch the clips on the ends 
of the long sides and they should pull out)

3. Release the speedo cable by pushing and sliding the friction ring on 
it.  (Sometimes it's easier to disconnect the upper cable at the lambda 
counter...near the clutch/brake pedals)

4. Binnacle will be free now...turn it over and remove the 8 phillips 
head screws holding the instruments to the binnacle.

5. Flip the instruments over, and remove the screws that hold the clear 
plastic.  This will give you access to the bug.

For the trip odometer reset arm, you most likely will have to replace 
the whole speedo...but I have heard of a few instances where the arm 
could be repaired.  I've got a speedometer for sale...the orange paint 
on the "55" is a bit faded though.  Contact me privately if interested.  

Thanks, and let me know if you have any questions along the way.

a whole bunch of VINs currently.


Message: 3
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:52:49 -0500
From: Josh Haldeman <>
Subject: Cincinnati St. Patricks Day Parade!

Hey Gang,

That time of year again!  St. Patricks Day is right around the corner, 
so make sure you get your Irish cars out there to celebrate.

Those of you in, around, near, or even far away from Cincinnati are all 
invited to attend the annual Cincinnati St. Patricks Day Parade!  This 
year it will be on Sunday, March 14th, starting at 11:00 AM.  We will 
meet at my house in the morning, and head downtown from there.  E-mail 
me privately for directions if you are interested! 
(jhaldeman(at)  Enthusiasts welcome too!

Have a great weekend,
VIN 5102...gonna get done before the parade, I swear!
and the rest...


Message: 4
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 06:41:51 -0000
From: "Richard" <>
Subject: Re: Volvo's new female designed Gullwing Sports Car

> Thought people here might find this interesting. Its like the female 
> version of the Delorean, literally.
> Joe

There's no way the designers of this car didn't think about our little
silver beauties when they came up with this design.  Yet, in the news
reports, there's no mention of Delorean at all.  Last year, Nissan had
a concept car with gull-wing doors as well, and of course no mention
was made of Deloreans, or Bricklins either.  Our stainless steel works
of art immortalized the concept of gull-wing doors, so why don't they
at least acknowledge this?  They make it sound like this is the first
car ever made with this feature.  Just another snub against DMC, I
suppose.  I feel better now that I got that off my chest.  lol!

Richard Rowe


Message: 5
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 06:51:52 -0000
From: "Richard" <>
Subject: Re: Electrical question

--- In, "Trey Brown" <treybpd3_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> Hey Everybody.
> I know that one of the most common gripes about our cars is the 
> electrical system. What can be done to improve this?

Buy one of John Hervey's alternators.  I got the D-150 and it gives me
lots of juice even at idle with A/C running.


Message: 6
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:54:55 -0600
From: "John Hervey" <>
Subject: RE: Carbureted PRV

Ben,  I can tell you this. There is a customer here in Dallas area that is
switching one back from a make shift carburetor system. I don't know the
detail but I could find out.

-----Original Message-----
From: benjamin strand []
Subject: [DML] Carbureted PRV

Has anyone switched their fuel injected PRV to a carbureted PRV?


Message: 7
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:57:47 -0600
From: "John Hervey" <>
Subject: RE: Carbureted PRV

Ben, I don't know why you want to go to a carbureted system. The Bosch K
jetronic system was started on the Porsche in 1973 and used up till I think
about 86. It was also used on Mercedes, Volvo and many more.
Just an FYI.
John Hervey

-----Original Message-----
From: benjamin strand []
Subject: [DML] Carbureted PRV

Has anyone switched their fuel injected PRV to a carbureted PRV?


Message: 8
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 07:00:26 -0000
From: "Richard" <>
Subject: Re: What is BEST cleaning method for Stainless?

--- In, "Adam Lee" <delorean852003_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> I have heard 100 different do's and don't's for the cleaning of the 
> stainless steel.

Try laundry soap!  Mix it with warm water and hand-wash with a sponge.
 Rinse with straight water and dry with a soft cloth or chamois.  This
really makes stainless steel shine.  I got this idea from Marvin
Stein, and it really works!  

Richard Rowe


Message: 9
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:03:38 -0600
From: "John Hervey" <>
Subject: RE: Gauge Problems

Kramer; See below.

-----Original Message-----
From: Kramer []
Subject: [DML] Gauge Problems

Dear List,
  Recently I have been having problems with my gauges on my dash. The
first is that my gas gauge is jumping up and down. It goes down to the
lowest line and then sometimes jumps up to the quarter spot and then
sometimes even goes to the halfway and then goes down. I can't trust
the thing.

( Throw it away and replace it for $99.95 with a new one. I used to fix them
but when the new unit came out it wasn't worth the time.)

  Also my oil guage has me a little worried. It only goes up to the
second line in first gear then in the other gears it goes only halfway
and idles at the quarter level. What should I do? Am I getting low oil
pressure or should I clean the connectors? Where are they located?

( Again Replace it with the new correct reading version. It's located next
to the oil filter and the new ones don't rub the filter.
Be sure to run the correct oil for the correct reading . 20/40  or 20/50
depending on the climate.

John Hervey


Message: 10
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 07:27:45 -0000
From: "Richard" <>
Subject: Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean

--- In, "ryanpwright" <yahoo1_at_dml_r...> wrote:
> Hi Folks,
> I've wanted a DeLorean as long as I can remember, and now find myself
> in a financial situation to buy one later this year. My questions here
> involve reliability & maintenance.

Hello Ryan,

A Delorean that's been properly maintained and has had all the
recommended upgrades is one of the most reliable cars on the road
today!  However, "buyer beware" still applies.  These cars are over
twenty years old, so if you find a "cheap fixer-upper", be prepared
for a lot of headaches.  The worst problem you will find with
repairing Deloreans is almost always rusted, seized and broken nuts
and bolts that are almost impossible to get to in the first place. 
You will need a set of stud extractors, drills, heli-coils, torches,
and a large vocabulary of swear-words.  It's all worth it though, if
you have the passion.

Richard Rowe


Message: 11
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:26:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Andrew Prentis <>
Subject: Re: "second generation"

No, there was no "second generation".There was only
one model, alternatively called the "DMC -12" or
"DeLorean Sports Car".He's either pulling your leg or
he thinks its true.The car did however evolve a bit
during production with changes such as different hoods
and wheel colours.But definately only one model.

VIN 2883

   but the one thing is the "second generation."  Any advise?
> L. Bauer


Message: 12
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 07:20:12 -0500
From: Tom Watkins <>
Subject: Best Car Cleaning Method

I second what Dick says here.  I too have tried numerous products and have found 
that nothing has made the car look better than a real soap and water bath.  The stainless
sparkles and looks great.  Aerosol products are O.K. at car shows and such where you have 
no water but I feel I'm basically rubbing in the dirt.   I always S+W my car before a car show
as it has given me the best results.

Tom Watkins
VIN 05732

   From: Dick Ryan <>
Subject: Re: What is BEST cleaning method for Stainless?

 let me simply say that I have tried at least 3 dozen
different products in my 21 years of DeLorean
ownership and I invariably come back to soap and water
and/or windex.  EVERY other product I've tried leaves
a film that actually makes fingerprints and dust

Dick Ryan
VIN 16867


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 13
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:07:15 EST
Subject: Raffle car Update

The Raffle car is gaining in momentum.  

A BIG thanks to Dave Swingle.  His efforts went above and beyond the call of 
duty in doing some more detail work on the car and spending a full day on it 
to get it into perfect running condition.  He ran a radiator pressure check (no 
leaks) rechecked the brakes, a little more tweeking on the engine (runs like 
a champ) and overall clean up ( lots of overspray).
Dave and Rich did the final fuel system and engine check last weekend as well.

The car is looking great and to add to it we have had interest in the car 
from many DeLorean Suppliers,

DMC Houson has donated a variety of parts to improve the function and looks 
of the car. 
I will publish a list of the parts that they have donated later so you can 
see the detail that has gone into this car.

My thanks to James and Stephen for helping on this project.  They really went 
above and beyond the call of duty on this one and again deserve a big thanks. 
 This takes the car from being just a good car to a great car.

P.J. Grady has also donated a number of parts to the car as well and again I 
will list those parts later on a list as soon as we get everything done.

Rob and I have worked together for years and I appreciate his and Deb's 
continous support for the projects I get into no matter how wild they may be. 

DeLorean Motor Center has also donated parts to the car and again my thanks 
to Don and all involved. They have added nice finishing touches to the car that 
the new owner will definately appreciate.

The car is ready for the Parade and if all goes well we will try to drive it 
after the St Patricks day Parade in Chicago down to Cincinnati and drive it in 
the parade here the next day then drive it back to Chicago.

Next major trip will be to Pigeon Forge.

Tickets are going well so go to and reserve our 
raffle ticket and sign up for the DeLorean Car Show.  We have more surprises to 
come so stay tuned for more.

Starting next month we will be advertising in Hemmings for this show and 
after the show we will continue to advertise for the magazine so we will be a 
permanent prescence in the magazine from now on.


More pictures of the Raffle car will be in the DeLorean Car Show Magazine to 
be issued in April.

DeLorean Car Show Inc
DeLorean Car Show Magazine

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 14
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:43:14 EST
Subject: Re: Gauge Problems


I'm still pretty much a newbie here at the forums, and even with DeLoreans in 
general...  So don't take my word for gospel truth: have it confirmed 
elsewhere, but...

It sounds to me like the fuel sending unit in your car is borxed up.  You 
might want to get a replacement by Special T Auto, DeLorean Motor Company of 
Houston, PJ Grady, etc etc.

As for your oil gauge... I have no clue.  Hope someone else here can help you 
with that! :)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 15
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 14:58:01 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <>
Subject: Re: Gauge Problems

I am going to guess that you are dealing with 2 separate problems. To
fix the fuel gauge will probably require replacing the sending unit.
You can go with either Houston's replacement sender or you can go to
the Fanzilla from P J Grady. For the oil pressure again the sending
unit (the one by the oil filter) may have to be replaced. You should
put a mechanical guage on first to verify that the engine is in fact
OK. The fuel sender can be accessed by removing the spare tire and
unscrewing the access panel underneath.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757  

--- In, "Kramer" <jettaman95_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> Dear List,
>   Recently I have been having problems with my gauges on my dash.


Message: 16
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 15:02:20 -0000
From: "thebrave65" <>
Subject: Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean

Ryan - if you want to know about any kinds of repair and/or horror 
stories, do what I did and start with April 1999 right here on this 
list.  It's the best education you will ever get for the Delorean. 

Granted, it took me a few months to read it all, but I can honestly 
say that I did - and I'm REALLY glad I did before I bought 5518.

Plus, I also created my own 500+ page technical manual directly from 
these posts.  I can't tell you how invaluable that has been when I'm 
crammed under the car!


I know what would help me - if some of you would be so kind as to
share your DeLorean repair stories. 


Message: 17
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:12:28 EST
Subject: Re: fuel lines

Special T Auto sells the stainless steel fuel lines for about $300.  PJ Grady 
might also have them in kit form (for rebuilding the entire fuel system, but 
I could be wrong... too lazy to check his site).  And maybe he even has them 
with just the lines, not sure...

Just out of curiosity, why is DMCH not an option for you?

No clue if those coils/ign. system improves performance on the PRV, though I 
would imagine so.

Happy miles.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 18
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 15:14:38 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <>
Subject: Re: "second generation"

There really is no such thing as "second generation". There IS such a
thing as many running production changes. These are mostly things that
a casual observer may not even notice and some are more easily
noticable than others. For instance there are differences on the hood,
tailpipes, and antennae. Some of the early cars never got the recalls
done. Each car must be taken on a case by case basis. An early car
that was well taken care of and has all the updates and recalls may be
a better deal than a latter car that was not taken care of and needs
everything. At this point how the car was made matters less than how
it was cared for. Try to find a local owner that is knowledgeable and
can look the car over with you. Try to remember that you should factor
into your offer all the expense it will take to get the car into the
condition you want. As expensive as cosmetic work may be the hidden
mechanical and electrical work ain't cheap either! Try to find out
where the car was serviced and talk to the shop, they may be more
honest about the condition and will know the service history.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


Message: 19
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:56:30 -0500
From: "Henry" <>
Subject: Re: Re: Seeking advice on buying a DeLorean


I think you will find your experience with Fieros to be very similar with Delorean ownership - assuming you get a basically sound car to begin with.  Parts are available, not too expensive, and most of the work, say except for Stainless Steel repair you can do yourself.  I've done alot of the repairs myself, and I don't have a well stocked garage - just good, basic tools.  I've done stuff like replace the distributor (which requires taking off the fuel distributor and air intake); installed stainless steel brake lines; replace the brake master cylinder; installed an CD changer (simple, I know), but then ripped out the stock radio and replaced it with an up to date Alpine head unit; fixed switches and other small components; installed the zillas;.. and alot of other small get the idea.  And I wouldn't consider myself to have half the repair experience you have.    Now, I've also had alot of work done by PJ Grady over the last few years which more quickly added to my Total Cost of Ownership - stuff I could not or did not want to do myself:  exhaust gasket replacement, water pump, new shocks/springs, windshield replacement, window motors, minor frame repair, and lots of other things.  This year he'll be swapping a transmission for me.

But the bottom line is that I can jump into my car pretty much any day and drive without worrying about anything going wrong or needing repair.  

I don't think you'll have any problem buying, maintaining, or enjoying a Delorean. Good luck!

-Hank  #1619


Message: 20
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:13:48 -0800
From: "jdub" <>
Subject: RE: Electrical question

Does the voltmeter in the dash read the voltage directly across the battery?



Message: 21
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:50:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Shannon Yocom <>
Subject: Re: Famous TV/Movie Car Poll --- RESULTS

Hagerty has released the results...

Ha Ha Ha 
Once again the DeLoreans (#4) beat the Ford Torinos (#9)!
More braging rights for Evansville this Fall.

Shannon Y

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search - Find what you’re looking for faster


Message: 22
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:42:06 -0000
From: "content22207" <>
Subject: Re: Carbureted PRV

You've got Volvo's nomenclature a bit off:
B27 - 2.664 liter displacement PRV, available in A E & F series. Used
B28 - 2.885 liter displacement PRV, available in A E & F series. Used
B280 - 2.885 liter displacement *VERY DIFFERENT* PRV. Used 1988-?.
Also imported by Chrysler as the "3 liter" (rounded up for marketing
purposes) engine in its Eagle Premier (not to be confused with AMC's
Eagles, which used an inline 6 cylinder engine).
A series - single barrel Weber carburetor.
E series - high compression fuel injected (Bosch K Jetronic).
F series - low compression fuel injected (Bosch K Jetronic).

I just purchased a new in the crate A series engine. Will upload pics
as soon as I get them developed (35mm -- am a tad old fashioned). Is
*MUCH* easier to work on than E or F series. Note that after 1975, A
series was basically relegated to industrial applications. Renault
continued to carburete its PRV's, but Volvo switched to fuel injection
in production automobiles.

B27 and B28 are essentially the same engine. Only difference is
displacement, and correspondingly larger cylinder heads. The imfamous
"oil passage problem" to camshafts applies to both engines. Plus Volvo
used a weaker oil pump in its PRVs than Renault, exacerbating the problem.

There are slight differences in fuel injection between B27 and B28 --
fuel/air mixture unit is identical, but the lower body is a one piece
casting with integral throttle plates (vs isolated throttle plates
adopted for B28) and the throttle plates have no deceleration valves.
This is identical to Renault Z7 series BTW. I have a spare B27F. Will
photograph it and upload as well (now I know what to shoot the rest of
the roll of film on!).

One major difference between B27 and B28 CIS (Constant Idle Speed) is
the use of an auxiliary air valve vs an idle speed motor. Aux air
valve takes off from the same location under the fuel distributor, but
uses a nipple pressed into the lower mixture body rather than a loose
tube sealed with an O ring -- MUCH less prone to vacuum leaks.

Getting back to your carburetor question: Renault had great success
carbureting the PRV in its Apline sports car (another rear engine
application). Two versions: a dual carburetor setup (a single barrel
linked to a two barrel at full throttle), and a triple carburetor
setup of 2 barrels. Note however that both used high compression
blocks. Would probably be too much carburetion for an F series block.

I know a fellow with a brand new single venturi A series intake
manifold who may sell it if you're interested. Contact me off list:
brobertson(at) Will bolt right up to a DeLo block. You'll
need to plug the old K Jetronic injector ports too.

Bill Robertson


Message: 23
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 19:07:15 -0000
From: "James" <>
Subject: Re: Speedometer Button Question

The trip reset shaft can be replaced, though technically it requires the speedo to be 
recalibrated as you must remove the face (and therefore the needle) to replace the shaft. I 
seem to recall Marty Maier had a method of doing it that did not require recalibration. 
Perhaps he will chime in.

The other thing to consider is that the shafts themselves were an AC/Delco part that has 
since been discontinued. We recently bought a handful of this old stock, and each and 
every one has a crack in the plastic "toothed" portion where it meets the metal pin that 
sticks out. This means that it won't take much use to break again.

We're having the shafts remanufactured both to have a supply again, and also to correct 
the flaw that appears in the originals. These should be available later this spring.

Binnacle removal has been covered several times on the DML, and can be found here"

James Espey
DMC (Texas)

--- In, "Adam Lee" <delorean852003_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> It seems that a previous owner of my car thought it would be a good 
> idea to break off the button that resets the trip mileage. Is this a 
> seperate piece or do I need a new speedometer?  Also is it hard to 
> take off the binnacle? There is a bug inside my case behind the 
> clear plastic cover of the binnacle. I have tried to blow him out 
> with an airhose with no success. Can you take off the cover?
> Adam Lee
> VIN 6906


Message: 24
Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 19:08:37 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <>
Subject: Re: Volvo's new female designed Gullwing Sports Car

--- In, Gus Schlachter <gus_at_dml_a...> wrote:
The Delorean doors use dual striker-pins, but that does not mean a
striker-pin cannot be
made safe.  All my other "normal" car doors use a single pin.  You're
right that there should
be more safety catches, but isn't this car a prototype?

You're right, it is a bit wrong to be so critical about prototype
designs. But I've not seen much progress in this car's design over the
past couple of years. Let me explain.

Even with traditional side mounted doors that are horizontally hinged,
you still have a door that is tethered by two points horizontaly
(hinges & striker pin). So with a side impact, you're going to see the
door pull on the A & B pillars on the car keep the door sides from
intruding in (and side impact beams to prevent it from folding). With
a singe striker pin on the bottom, you just can't get this protection.
With gullwing door/hatch doors where the securing points are mounted
verticly, they could inadvertantly act as an axis for the door to spin
on, and allow the front and rear portions of the door to flex too
much, and dangerously intrude into the passenger compartment, and/or
allow the opposite ends to open. In a word, it would extremely suck to
have the front portion of a door to intrude in and cut into my legs,
just as it would for the rear to open up, and allow my arm or head, or
worse yet, that of a child whom was not secured properly in the front
or rear seats to be caught in the door as it rebounds back after an
impact. Or perhaps the latching mechanism fails, or is just plain
sheared off from the rocker panel, and the door opens.

Chrysler had the same problem with their Caravan line when they used a
single striker pin, in the center of their rear hatches, whereas Ford
was using double striker pins on both sides of the hatch. Low speed
collisions would allow the latch to loos grip, and the door to open.
Looking at photos, Chrysler has since switch over to looped latches
for their rear hatches. Not even the Bricklin used striker pins for
it's gullwing doors, and while the DeLorean prototype did use a
striker pin mounted to the rocker panel, it still countered with
another pin mounted to the A pillar.

And while this is only a prototype, the other problem with with lack
ofover lap on the doors. As you'll always see, auto manufacturers
design all doors, and hatches to overlap, which also help teather the
door in place. In every stage of this car being a prototype, they've
yet to intergrate this overlapping.

So you can see, the time and effort that went into the DeLorean was
quite a bit, and you can really appriciate it when compared to other
car designs.

As for the marketing, well that's up to the marketing people.  This
can be
tailored without
changing the nature of the car's design.  I don't see why age is a
demographic but gender
is not.

Anyway, the Pontiac Aztec was ruined not by bad marketing as much as
crappy design.  :-)  And
what about the failure of the Delorean?  Was that bad marketing?  Bad
design? (Personally I
think it was bad timing...)

Marketing can be pretty tricky. The DeLorean is an example of how
you've got a great product, but you've poorly marketed it. Save for
the US Tennis open, my parents never saw a single ad on TV. And almost
every single shot of the DeLorean used in their marketing campaign was
of the car just sitting there, looking pretty. Action shots of a car
with wheels spinning, and a blurred background can do allot to inspire
a buyer.

I cited the Aztek, but didn't word my statement properly. The Aztek is
an example of where instead of developing a marketing campaign to sell
a particular product, you create a campaign, and then develop a
product to try and match an unwaivering campaign. Which is what this
Volvo is comming to. More emphasis is being placed on proving that
this is a car "by women, for women", than is on function. And the
"functions" that are included are actually controversial. While most
women are not mechanics, a good number of them have quite a desire to
learn, but have been shunned away from it. And if you watch any TV
shows about Sport Compact Cars, you'll notice that more and more women
are starting become mechanics, and are wrenching on their own cars.
While Volvo is trying their best to market themselves as a hip,
progressive company that wants everyone's input, their logic here is
goning to come back and bite them, as it can also be percieved as
being quite narrow minded, and has the potential to offend quite a

vin 6585 "X"


Message: 25
Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:32:33 -0500
From: <>
Subject: door adjustment workshop in Pigeon Forge?

I don't know if anybody else needs it . but it seems that my doors need some
The driver door does not align properly with the front body panel. and it
seems that I go through a set of door pistons each year 
Seeing as it's a seasonal car (only used minimally from april to October)
the doors a not used all that often.   My question is , will any door
adjustment gurus be willing to offer up their services?
Please let me know, as I am sure lots of other owners would want an
adjustment as well.
except I call dibs on getting mine done first :-)
005541 <> 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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