From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1903
Date: Monday, March 08, 2004 12:10 PM

There are 22 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Filled Front Antenna hole....
From: "ctdmc83" <nmastrocinque_at_dml_sikorsky.com>

2. Re: DMCH's performance engine..
From: Rod Dillman <rhdillman_at_dml_yahoo.com>

3. Re: Starting problem
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

4. RE: Starting problem
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

5. Re: DMCH's performance engine..
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>

6. Dash Clock
From: "Robert Moseley" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>

7. Electrical Problem : Door Lights, Acc Fuse 10 Amp
From: "Robert Moseley" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>

8. Electrical problem update
From: "Robert Moseley" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>

9. Fw: Starting problem
From: "Roland Smith" <roland_at_dml_dnai.com>

10. Hotstart (new accumulator and pump)
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>

11. Frame Numbers
From: "Stephen Card" <stephen_at_dml_procomroofing.com>

12. Re: Starting problem
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>

13. RE: DMCH's performance engine..
From: "Scott Mueller" <scott.a.mueller_at_dml_mchsi.com>

14. Re: DMCH's performance engine...and visit to DMC
From: "sonnyvr2000" <sonnyvr2000_at_dml_yahoo.com>

15. Scoping out the dwell and RTFM
From: "drdhdmd" <doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com>

16. Mid-Atlantic Site Events Calendar and Updates
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>

17. JZD Estate/Trump Golf Course
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>

18. Replace/convert interior
From: "Alex" <alex_wolf_at_dml_sbcglobal.net>

19. vac advance question
From: "TalksToGod" <5n-_at_dml_gmx.net>

20. RE: Fw: Starting problem
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

21. Re: Scoping out the dwell and RTFM
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>

22. Engine running half rich half lean.
From: Enid/Jeremiah <hispanicangeleyes_at_dml_yahoo.com>





Message: 1
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 16:18:09 -0000
From: "ctdmc83" <nmastrocinque_at_dml_sikorsky.com>
Subject: Re: Filled Front Antenna hole....

My car has evidence of having had the front antenna hole "filled", 
but it was never properly blended, so from certain angles the 
difference between its surface finish compared to the rest of the 
fender can be clearly seen.  I have run my hand over the area and it 
is completely smooth, just not "matching" with the rest of the 
fender.  I would appreciate specific suggestions and equipment to 
blend this in so that it essentially becomes invisible.  Thanks all!




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Message: 2
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:29:08 -0800 (PST)
From: Rod Dillman <rhdillman_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: DMCH's performance engine..

Adam, Stephen Wynne's personal DeLorean is an automatic with the performance engine.  I am sure he will be of help. Prior to purchasing one of his restored DeLoreans, I asked him for names of persons who had purchased one and would be willing to provide me a reference. He checked with previous customers and I was able to talk with them about their experience. Stephen had his car at the 2002 Memphis show and he offered to let me drive it since I am somewhat interested in the upgrade. Unfortunately,the show ended and I didn't get around to driving it. If he has the car in Pigeon Forge maybe the offer will stand. Rod  10921


Adam 16683 <acprice1_at_dml_hotmail.com> wrote:I was just wondering if anyone on this list had the performance engine from DMC Houston, or knows enough about it to answer my general questions.



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Message: 3
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 17:33:44 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Starting problem

I would start with making sure you have spark. Remove a spark plug
wire and stick something in it and lay it so it is close to the metal
of the motor. While cranking the motor you should see a fat blue
spark. No spark or a weak yellow one would indicate a problem with the
ignition system. Check the connections to the white ballast resistors.
You may need a new pick-up coil in the distributer. If you do get a
nice blue spark then put the wire back on and shoot a SMALL amount of
ether into the intake. That should make it run for a couple of seconds
confirming a fuel problem. Now make sure the fuel pump is runing,
check the inertia switch and then listen for the pump. If it isn't
running check the #5 fuse. If it is running you may need some more
gas. You could have a bad suction hose. Check if you are getting power
to the fuel pump and that the ground connection is good. It could be
something as simple as a bad fuel pump too. The thing here is to try
to narrow down the possible causes, start by figuring out if it is
electrical or fuel.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Roland Smith" <roland_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> This evening my wife and I stopped at a store after about a ten mile
drive.
> After an hour of shopping, we returned to the car..........The
> engine stopped and would not start again.



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Message: 4
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:44 -0600
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: RE: Starting problem

Roland, A few things you need to check or figure out.
#1.Is it the original fuel sending unit and is it accurate.
#2 Is the fuel pump the original one. If so then it may be worn to the point
it won't prime easily unless there is more fuel in the tank. Also the fuel
screen in the old pick up baffle may not be flat on the tank causing it to
suck some air. There could also be a tear in the pickup hose.
#3. Is the accumulator the original, If so then the hot start problem may be
showing up because of the age.

My feeling is if you had put at least 1/2 tank of gas in the car then the
lower part of the pump would not have to prime and it would start. Again,
Due to the age and wear it may start having a pressure problem.
Very common.
John Hervey
www.special;tauto.com



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Message: 5
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:48:26 -0800 (PST)
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: DMCH's performance engine..

A number of people (including myself) have automatic
transmissions on Turbo cars.  I know of no one who has
had any reliability issues with the Auto trans with
the additional power of a Turbo engine.

I believe the specifications for HP and Torque for the
Houston engine are less than the Turbo, so I don't
think you should have any problem with it.

A call to DMCH may yield a more accurate answer to
your question.

As far as opinions on the Houston setup, I do not own
one but having seen them demonstrated at past events I
think they are WAY too loud.  



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Message: 6
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 19:16:11 -0000
From: "Robert Moseley" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Dash Clock

Does anyone have a working clock for the console?

Mine works everyonce in a while, I mean it keeps time all the time
but the back lighting seems to work when it wants too.
Has anyone else ever had this problem?

If you have a nice working clock, or know of some sort of a
replacement let me know, thanks!
- Videobob
VIN#5278




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Message: 7
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 19:40:02 -0000
From: "Robert Moseley" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Electrical Problem : Door Lights, Acc Fuse 10 Amp

I was doing a little wire work on my car Saturday, first I did the
conversion to make the side markers blink with the indicators.
A simple operation of connecting the black ground wire from the marker
light to the green & red wire of the indicator.
I tested it and it worked.
I mention that I did this because I do not know if it is related to my
problem.

After doing this I noticed that my door lights were not working.
(I had both doors open, and have converted the #194 bulbs with LED 
replacements, so you can leave the doors open all day without using
much power)
I tried wiggling the switch on the drivers side since we all know
these can stick every once in a while.....and the weirdest thing happened!
It seemed like the polarity was reversed!
Because when I pushed the switch IN, the lights came ON!
I pushed it in and out a few times, and then the lights went off all
together.
I checked the fuse, a 10 AMP and it was blown so I replaced it.
It immediately popped.

I was checking the manual and it mentioned some DIODES that are in
place to prevent electrical back flow.
Does anyone know WHERE these are because it doesn't say!
Is there a relay or a module that controls this?

Has anyone ever had this problem?

Thanks.
- Videobob
VIN#5278





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Message: 8
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 20:24:36 -0000
From: "Robert Moseley" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Electrical problem update


I found the problem, and of course it was my own fault!
Since I have the hood off, and the front wire loom laying all over,
when I was re-attaching the connections I accedentily connected the
two wires intended to connect to the lamp on the hood. - causing a short.
I simply unplugged it and the problem was fixed.

I am busy trying to kick my own ass right now.
- VB




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Message: 9
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:29:24 -0800
From: "Roland Smith" <roland_at_dml_dnai.com>
Subject: Fw: Starting problem

Additional developments to my email.

This morning I went to the store where I parked the car and it started right
up.

I filled the gas tank and it took only 6.5 gallons which seems to support
the one-half full indication on the gas gauge.

There are two elements to what occurred.  First, the engine sitting at idle
just died without any warning.  It was a now you hear it-now you don't
event.

What could have been the cause?

Second, the engine would not restart.

Was it flooded or starving for fuel?

Please help with your own knowledge.

Roland Smith
6667
Oakland, California




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Message: 10
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 15:50:06 -0500
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>
Subject: Hotstart (new accumulator and pump)

I was having a hot start problem, the accumulator was known to be bad so it was replaced. The hotstart persisted so the check valve on the pump was also replaced. I still have a hot start issue and dont want to guess. No matter how long I crank, it wont start, it has to cool for about 2 hours. Doing a plug swap does not allow it to start, and did not allow it to start since I've had the problem. It should be noted, the hot start came with the car, it didnt show up recently.

I put a pressure tester on the system, as the tech manual shows on page 62. After running the engine and letting it warm up (about 30 minutes of running), the valve was closed to the line from the pressure regulator (so the guage shows pressure at the top of the distributor) and the engine turned off. The pressure dropped down to ~3.5 bar, then after about 10 minutes settled around 2.9 bar. I have managed to confuse myself as to what I am measuring. I am unsure if i'm measuring the control pressure, or the primary pressure.

If I am measuring the primary pressure, then that would mean the accumulator and check valve in the pump are good, so my hotstart is from something else (note, my distributor has been messed with in the past). If I am measuring the control pressure, then how do I measure the primary pressure (turn guage around? Thought that would measure pressure back to the tank).

Samuel





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Message: 11
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 21:26:54 -0000
From: "Stephen Card" <stephen_at_dml_procomroofing.com>
Subject: Frame Numbers

I disassembled the rear fascia from my car last evening and found 
number written in black marker on the rear crossmember of the frame. 
The numbers were 3581. My vin is 3601. Should they match? 
Thanks,
Stephen
Vin 3601




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Message: 12
Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 18:15:46 -0500
From: Samuel <samuel_yahoo_at_dml_lightspeed.cx>
Subject: Re: Starting problem

It is possible, I have not taken that connection apart yet. I would 
still like to know which area of the system I pressure tested so I can 
identify if the pressure is falling thru that portion of the system. If 
I measured the primary, then it seems to be holding proper from what I 
read in the manual (minimum 1.7 bar after 10 minutes sitting). If I 
didnt measure primary, then do all I have to do is turn my tester around 
to measure primary?

Samuel



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Message: 13
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:03:04 -0600
From: "Scott Mueller" <scott.a.mueller_at_dml_mchsi.com>
Subject: RE: DMCH's performance engine..

Contact DMC Houston.  They will give you the straight scoop on there
products.

Scott Mueller
002981
RNDOLA
DOC-UK 357 Magnum
DOA
 


-----Original Message-----
From: Adam 16683 [mailto:acprice1_at_dml_hotmail.com] 
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 5:15 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] DMCH's performance engine..


I was just wondering if anyone on this list had the performance 
engine from DMC Houston, or knows enough about it to answer my 
general questions. 

Does the upgraded engine get about the same gas mileage as the stock 
engine, is it worse or better perhaps?

Does it idle rougher, smoother, any difference from stock?

Also I am looking for opinions about using the upgraded engine with 
an automatic transmission. Does anyone out there have the performance 
engine with an automatic? 

Thanks!

adam




To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
Yahoo! Groups Links



 




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Message: 14
Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 01:14:16 -0000
From: "sonnyvr2000" <sonnyvr2000_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: DMCH's performance engine...and visit to DMC

Adam -

I was passing through Houston last week on a business trip and I called over to DMCH and 
asked if I could come visit. Their place is a few minutes from the airport (Bush?) and James 
came over to pick me up and brought me to their facility.

All I can say is WOW! The pics on their site really don't do it justice. You can't imagine how 
much stuff they have unless you have been there. I counted 36 DeLoreans, plus the two 
"half" cars in their showroom. James took the time to give me the guided tour and 
answered all my questions and put up with me for a good solid hour before I had to go 
back to the airport. It was also nice to meet Warren, Julie and Bill - I've spoken to all of 
them on the phone and they are just as nice in person.

Anyway, about the engine. Seems they are building two new company cars, and are selling 
the two they have now - actually the five-speed used in the Players Run and seen on the 
cover of their last magazine has already been sold. Their black painted automatic is for 
sale now. It has the performance engine, suspension, HID lights, heated seats, and on and 
on and on. James let me take it out for a drive, and it really goes. I have an automatic, and 
it's hard now to drive mine knowing what it *could* be like. I obviously didn't drive it 
enough to get a feel for mileage, but James told me that it gets about the same mileage as 
a stock engine.  Also sounds a lot "tougher" with the new exhaust.

Also got to see their new grey leather/vinyl seat covers, which came in the same day I did. 
I have a black interior car, and those hadn't arrived yet, but the grey looked really good 
and the vinyl was a good match for the original. I saw some seats in clients cars there with 
"knockoff" seat covers and there is a big difference in how they look. Warren mentioned 
that soon they'll have other interior parts like a-pillar and b-pillar trim, too.

I'm glad I took a chance and called DMC when I was coming through town, if any of you 
are passing through Houston, you ought to stop by.

Sonny V.



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Message: 15
Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 02:43:10 -0000
From: "drdhdmd" <doctorDHD_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Scoping out the dwell and RTFM

It was a beautiful almost "Spring" day so I couldn't resist.  I 
connected my scope to the diagnostic port to "see" what was going 
on.  According to my calculations the frequency of the signal was 70 
Hz which I believe is correct.  The problem is the duty cycle ON was 
only 38.8% with the WOT switch closed.  The manual says 50 - 60.  
Something did not seem right so I went back to the DeLorean Workshop 
Manual and checked all the "Pulse Ratios" on page D:04:15.  
Everything seemed to be inverted, that is, the lower part of the 
square wave pulse signal got bigger when the WOT switch was closed.  
I tried all the test configurations and the all were right except 
they were inverted.  Attaching a known voltage and polarity to the 
scope proved that + was indeed up.  I was confused. It was getting 
dark and I had to close up shop.  Now sitting here something I read 
popped into my head. It talked about connecting the dwell meter to 
the pinS on the diagnostic plug.  A quick check of the schematic 
revealed the problem.  I had connected my dwell meter and scope to 
one pin on the diagnostic plug and ground. (They way we used to check 
dwell on a car with points.)  It seems that the other pin of the 
diagnostic plug is not ground but rather positive 12 volts.  Thus all 
my measurements were off and I guess I adjusted the CO to around 60 
instead of 40.  Now I have a project for next weekend!

I believe this has been address in the past but none of the answers I 
have found seem to make sense...to me.  When using a DWELL meter to 
measure these "ratios"  What scales and setting do you use?  Since we 
are talking about something that in theory can go from 0 to 100 
percent, it doesn't seem correct to use even the 4 cylinder range 
because that maximum is only 90%.  Does anyone have an answer with an 
explaination?  (I know I am asking alot but remember what the old 
wise man said about giving a fish vs teaching someone how to fish...)

When all else fails Read The Manual.  Fortunately when I was 
flying Pipers I ALWAYS used my checklists and went by the book 
carefully.

Thank you,

Dave and 6530



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Message: 16
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:06:47 -0500
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>
Subject: Mid-Atlantic Site Events Calendar and Updates

Midatlantic club is looking to update our 2004 web site "Events" page
with another great year of gatherings and events.

If you are planning on attending an event, know of any events you want
posted, or want to host an event for the club, drop me a line and give
me some details!  (even if they are sketchy future plans at this point,
its ok)

Warm weather is on the way for the Mid-Atlantic region, and we look
forward to seeing you all soon!

BTW:  Plans for the spring social are in the works.hang tight, and we
will have news about it shortly.

Kevin Abato
Vin# 16680
Mid-Atlantic Web Master


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 17
Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:18:20 -0500
From: "Kevin Abato" <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>
Subject: JZD Estate/Trump Golf Course

I was at a friends house the other night, and a magazine on the coffee
table caught my eye.

The magazine is a free NJ area publication called "Somerset - Winter
2004" (Somerset is the name of the county).  On the front cover was an
article snipit called "Our Town: Saving the Farm - Trump Tees Off".
WOW!  It had to be an article on the former JZD estate!  Sure enough it
was.  I have scanned the cover, and two page article.  You can read a
copy that I have posted here:
http://www.deloreanmidatlantic.com/lamingtongolf.pdf

Enjoy!


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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Message: 18
Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 04:53:20 -0000
From: "Alex" <alex_wolf_at_dml_sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Replace/convert interior

Is it hard to replace the interior panels? The D I just bought has 
some warp from the sun, and needs a new dash, and some of the other 
panels replaced. Is this something that can be done without going to 
Houston? Also, is it hard to convert the interior to black? I prefer 
the look, but it seems like the parts are harder to come by. Any 
info is appreciated!

Alex




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Message: 19
Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 06:10:21 -0000
From: "TalksToGod" <5n-_at_dml_gmx.net>
Subject: vac advance question

Since my car is in pieces and I am going over everything-I find that
my vacuum advance on my distributor is inoperative. But the car ran
fine and even drove fine with this inoperative, so what are the
effects from having a bad vacuum advance? Thanks




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Message: 20
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:22:34 -0600
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: RE: Fw: Starting problem

Roland, Enrich the 02 setting just a little ( 1/8th turn ) so the plunger in
the fuel distributor will rise just a little when you crank. That feeds the
injectors.Look for any possible vacuum leaks.
John Hervey




-----Original Message-----
From: Roland Smith [mailto:roland_at_dml_dnai.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 2:29 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Fw: Starting problem


> Additional developments to my email.
> 
> This morning I went to the store where I parked the car and it started right
> up.
>
> I filled the gas tank and it took only 6.5 gallons which seems to support
> the one-half full indication on the gas gauge.
>
> There are two elements to what occurred.  First, the engine sitting at idle
> just died without any warning.  It was a now you hear it-now you don't
> event.
>
> What could have been the cause?
>
> Second, the engine would not restart.
>
> Was it flooded or starving for fuel?
>
> Please help with your own knowledge.
>
> Roland Smith
> 6667
> Oakland, California



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Message: 21
Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 14:23:58 -0000
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Re: Scoping out the dwell and RTFM

Page 122 of Technical Information Manual - set the dwell meter to 4 
cylinder scale.

Harold McElraft - 3354


-- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "drdhdmd" <doctorDHD_at_dml_a...> wrote:
> It was a beautiful almost "Spring" day so I couldn't resist.  I 
> connected my scope to the diagnostic port to "see" what was going 
> on.  According to my calculations the frequency of the signal was 
70 
> Hz which I believe is correct.  The problem is the duty cycle ON 
was 
> only 38.8% with the WOT switch closed.  The manual says 50 - 60.  
> Something did not seem right so I went back to the DeLorean 
Workshop 
> Manual and checked all the "Pulse Ratios" on page D:04:15.  
> Everything seemed to be inverted, that is, the lower part of the 
> square wave pulse signal got bigger when the WOT switch was 
closed.  
> I tried all the test configurations and the all were right except 
> they were inverted.  Attaching a known voltage and polarity to the 
> scope proved that + was indeed up.  I was confused. It was getting 
> dark and I had to close up shop.  Now sitting here something I 
read 
> popped into my head. It talked about connecting the dwell meter to 
> the pinS on the diagnostic plug.  A quick check of the schematic 
> revealed the problem.  I had connected my dwell meter and scope to 
> one pin on the diagnostic plug and ground. (They way we used to 
check 
> dwell on a car with points.)  It seems that the other pin of the 
> diagnostic plug is not ground but rather positive 12 volts.  Thus 
all 
> my measurements were off and I guess I adjusted the CO to around 
60 
> instead of 40.  Now I have a project for next weekend!
> 
> I believe this has been address in the past but none of the 
answers I 
> have found seem to make sense...to me.  When using a DWELL meter 
to 
> measure these "ratios"  What scales and setting do you use?  Since 
we 
> are talking about something that in theory can go from 0 to 100 
> percent, it doesn't seem correct to use even the 4 cylinder range 
> because that maximum is only 90%.  Does anyone have an answer with 
an 
> explaination?  (I know I am asking alot but remember what the old 
> wise man said about giving a fish vs teaching someone how to 
fish...)
> 
> When all else fails Read The Manual.  Fortunately when I was 
> flying Pipers I ALWAYS used my checklists and went by the book 
> carefully.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Dave and 6530




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Message: 22
Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:18:07 -0800 (PST)
From: Enid/Jeremiah <hispanicangeleyes_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Engine running half rich half lean.

This is a unique problem.  When I start my car now, the engine will run half lean and half rich.  The driver's side (4,5,6) all run rich (spark plugs are charcoal colored), and the passenger side (1,2,3) are lean.  The mixture screw has been adjusted properly, and these sparkplugs have been replaced recently.  I assume the fuel distributor sends fuel out equally, so I'm pretty sure the problem doesn't lie there.  Could it be dirty/faulty fuel injectors?  I'm kind of lost on this one.  
 
   The car does something else unusual.  The engine will idle fine when cold, but as the car warms up, the idling becomes very erradic.  It will "jump" around when in drive or park.  Don't get this confused with high idling or idling up and down in a cyclic motion - this idling goes fast then slow and repeats this pattern very rapidly.  It's very uneven and just all over the place.  It almost sounds like the car will literally die when sitting at a stop light or a traffic light.  When this idling problem occurs, I get alot of "spitting and sputtering" when going from a dead stop to acceleration.  After it spits and sputters for about 3 seconds, I get a sudden burst of acceleration (almost as if one of the cylinders isn't opening, and then WHAM! it opens all of a sudden)  The car will do this generally around the time the cooling fans on for the first time, and then after about 10 minutes the idling is perfectly normal.  When the idling is normal, there is no more "spit and sputter"
 either; the car runs completely normally.  Any ideas anyone?



________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


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