From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 1970
Date: Saturday, April 17, 2004 5:29 PM

There are 13 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. free Carfax reports promo
From: "Lauren" <LPLand_at_dml_earthlink.net>

2. Re: Manifest 10
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

3. Re: No Start problem
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

4. Re: Jacking it up.
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

5. Re: No ex-employees ?
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

6. Re: Angle Drive Failure
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>

7. Re: Jacking it up.
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

8. Re: Jacking it up.
From: "rendycheng" <rendycheng_at_dml_yahoo.com>

9. Re: Angle Drive - A new Angle
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>

10. Re: gas cap
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>

11. Re: Jacking it up.
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>

12. Re: Angle Drive - A new Angle
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>

13. Price Shopping rebuttal
From: Tom Watkins <dmctom_at_dml_earthlink.net>





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 19:02:22 -0700
From: "Lauren" <LPLand_at_dml_earthlink.net>
Subject: free Carfax reports promo


I just found out that CARFAX is running a promotion and offering 
free reports.  Really, I'm not sure how long this will last, but for now 
at least, I got a free report on the DeLorean I have my eye on (2031 
if anyone knows more about it).

http://www.carfax.com/cfm/promo.cfm?name=komo

...........................LP



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Message: 2
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 02:12:41 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Manifest 10

This is a wild educated guess but I think it is refering to the boat
manifest. Each time a batch of cars was shipped they had to create a
"manifest" or list so this is probably the 10th batch of cars shipped.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Lauren" <LPLand_at_dml_e...> wrote:
> 
>   On the DeLorean Production Chronology of the FAQ, can anyone 
> tell me what "Manifest 10" means under the Notes column?  



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Message: 3
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 02:30:55 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: No Start problem

Was the electrical problem a dead (straight from the battery) short?

Re: no fuel from the injectors -- ensure you can at least meter fuel
without trying to start the engine as follows:
- Pop out an injector and place it in a container 
- Jump the RPM relay to force the pump to spin (accessory/main relays
don't even need to be activated)
- Manually lower the air sensor plate
If the injector does not spray as you lower the plate by hand you have
either a horrifically clogged system or a main line pressure problem
(too low).

If the injector behaves normally, you may just need to lower the CO2
screw a bit more to crack the injectors at idle, especially since you
have changed the system's geometry with the new hoses. Believe it or
not just 1/4 revolution of the screw can have a dramatic effect. I
managed to get Louie Golden's *WAY* too lean once (experimenting on
his car, not my own). Returned it to a proper setting by cranking the
engine with the air sensor plate lowered by hand (only way it would
run), making minor adjustments of the CO2 screw, then letting up on
the plate to see if metering was rich enough yet for the engine to
continue running on its own. Was back to normal within a minute or two.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "TalksToGod" <5n-_at_dml_g...> wrote:
> Again my car fails to start. I fixed the electrical problem but now it
> seems no fuel is injecting into the engine.



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Message: 4
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 02:16:57 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Jacking it up.

I use a floor jack with a short (12") 2x4 laying on it. I position it
under the frame just ahead of the engine with the 2x4 pointing toward
the wheels. You can cover the 2x4 with a rag if you don't want to
scratch the paint. When jacking up the back be sure to chock the front
wheels so it doesn't roll. I usually pick up the front first so it
can't move when I pick up the back.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, doctorDHD_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Cn the D be jacked up at the rear at some central point so both
wheels come 
> off the ground at once?
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Dave & 6530




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Message: 5
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 02:21:05 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: No ex-employees ?

It could be that they are not monitoring the DML. You might have
better luck going to google.com and typing in their names. Another
good people finder is switchboard.com. There are also other Delorean
Yahoo groups that you could try. I think one is dedicated to former
Delorean employees.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "David Thompson" <oneyogi2000_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> Hello again all I posted a message about a month ago looking for any 
> ex-Delorean employees and didn't get much of a response so I thought 
> I would ask again. 



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Message: 6
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 06:05:41 -0000
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Angle Drive Failure

Bob mine has worked fine so far, reverse & forward for all of the 7 
miles I have driven since it was installed. Did you check to see if 
it went back and forth correctly with no drag or no lock ups? One 
quick other note I thought your origonal post said you got your 
angle dribe from Hervey, I really didn't know there were this many 
choices for angle drives out there.

For a bit of humor on my part, and something for other owners to 
check for. I ended up not needing the angle drive after all. I have 
the new one installed and working now, but after a successful 
install and reassembly I still had no speedo. Turns out the lower 
speedometer cable had managed to back off the Lambada and come 
disconnected. Found that out only this morning as I was cleaning 
little odds n ends on the car. 

A few harsh words later, I simply reconnected the lower speedo cable 
and all is fine again. I guess I should have looked a little better 
as I thought it was odd that I had NO warning or ticking telling me 
that there might be a problem with the angle drive. It just didn't 
work the next time I drove it. Guess I looked before I lept and 
assumed speedometer not working = bad angle drive. But at least I 
now have the weak point in the speedometer fixed and the lower 
speedo cable in the correct bracket now. Gotta love the little 
quirks of these cars sometimes. :)


Joe OBrien

2524 & 16634






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Message: 7
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 02:43:59 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: Jacking it up.

Under the engine cradle. That's also where you can position the jack
stands (by the lower connecting arms). I'm not a big fan of jacking
the car up by its fiberglass underbody. Too many horror stories.
Besides, all other vehicles (in-line drive train) are jacked up by
their crossmembers...

Never work under a car supported by the jack alone. Jack stands,
however, are very safe -- I'd argue even safer than ramps, especially
on the driving wheels.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, doctorDHD_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Cn the D be jacked up at the rear at some central point so both
wheels come 
> off the ground at once?
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Dave & 6530




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Message: 8
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 02:51:38 -0000
From: "rendycheng" <rendycheng_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking it up.

I usually place the floor jack underneath the cross frame (the one goes under the engine).  
I find the central position and place a piece of wood between the car and the jack.  Once 
the car is high enough, I place two jack stands on the side of the cross frame.  Again, I 
have a piece of wood between the car and the jack stand to protect the frame.

rendy #4220

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, doctorDHD_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Cn the D be jacked up at the rear at some central point so both wheels come 
> off the ground at once?
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Dave & 6530




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Message: 9
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 06:16:28 -0000
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Angle Drive - A new Angle

I didn't know Rob had them in new remanufactured. I only thought he 
had the older style. The nut removal plain SUCKS, hardest part 
period. Had I known that I would have bought his with the nut. Then 
it would have been a 20 min job. I still have another D with an 
origonal angle drive, but seeing as it never gets driven, up on 
blocks in a carcoon, it might be a while before I need it.


Joe OBrien

2524 & 16634



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "rendycheng" <rendycheng_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> I have recently bought an angle drive from PJ Grady for $60.  This 
one already has a big 
> bronze nut installed.  All I have to do is remove the old angle 
drive assembly and install 
> the new one.   I can do all this within 1/2 hour.  Am I missing 
something?
> 
> rendy #4220




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Message: 10
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 06:21:11 -0000
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: gas cap

With the gas flap hood I have the locking gas cap. But given the 
fact that I don't take the car to work, or use it for regular 
transportation, I find the locking gas cap to be a pain. Since it is 
never out of my sight when out of the garage, I have been 
considering just replacing it with a standard cap, and storing the 
locking one. Then just use the regular one so I don't have to take 
the keys out of the ignition when I get gas. Just my .02


Joe OBrien


2524 & 16634



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "rendycheng" <rendycheng_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> Hi 
> 
> I need to get a new (locking) gas gap for my #4220.  I don't mind 
getting one from one of 
> the Delorean vender, but I can get one locally, it would be 
better.  Does any one which is 
> the right one?  Either locking or no-lock version is fine with me.
> 
> thanks!
> 
> rendy




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Message: 11
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 06:37:04 -0000
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Jacking it up.

I place a wide flat piece of lumber I keep handy just for jacking up 
the Delorean and place it on my floor jack on the piece if frame 
right in front of the oil pan. The you just jack it up. I use cloths 
on my jackstands to prevent any chipping of the epoxy as an extra 
preventative. There may be other methods, but that method works the 
eastiet for me.


Joe OBrien

2524 & 16634




--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, doctorDHD_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Cn the D be jacked up at the rear at some central point so both 
wheels come 
> off the ground at once?
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Dave & 6530




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Message: 12
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 06:27:47 -0000
From: "joeyoseppi" <joeyoseppi_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Angle Drive - A new Angle

I tried exactly that method for about an hour, even using fine 
jewelers screwdrivers. I'm very good usually with small objects and 
fine movements. But that damn ring wasn't budging at all. Wish mine 
would've worked this way, even though it sounds easy. Best of luck 
to anyone else though. Let us know if you have any success future 
angle drive recipients. Aslo Bill, how did you repair your origonal 
drive and what was the secret the 3rd time which makes it still work?


Joe OBrien

2524 & 16634




--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_c...> 
wrote:
> My reply to Bob's post apparently got lost in the ether...
> 
> The angle drive nut retaining ring isn't hard to remove. I popped 
mine
> out 3 times as various repairs to the factory unit were attempted
> (repair #3 is still going strong BTW).



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Message: 13
Date: Sat, 17 Apr 2004 08:47:43 -0400
From: Tom Watkins <dmctom_at_dml_earthlink.net>
Subject: Price Shopping rebuttal

All,

Let me set something straight here as some of you have taken issue and 
are posting some rather interseted things that are simply nowhere in my 
post.   I have had numerous private emails supporting my post and I am 
grateful to those of you who posted publicly.

#1 - There is a difference between  "price shopping" and "price 
hopping".   Louie seems to be the perfect Delorean Customer by doing his 
research first and then making a purchase.   Louie, don't take 
offense....your one of the good ones.
 
Price hopping is done by some of you where you call with a list and get 
prices from all the vendors and then start a bargaining session with 
numerous phone calls back and forth to them trying to get them to 
"outbid" the other vendors......"well DMCH will sell it to me for $2.00 
less"  etc........  THIS is what I am talking about.   You know who you 
are, and I am saying that if there are people in our community who want 
to play this kind of game, go buy a car where you have lots of places to 
call and get the "very best price you can".  

#2 - AngularTableKnight wrote that:

 <That's one of the most absurd things I've ever read. Just because the DeLorean is a rare car doesn't mean that the vendors are obligated to treat their customers like crap.> 

I agree!!!!  I am not defending D1's policy or the demeanor to some of the poeple who have called.  I am simply trying to give people who are upset another viewpoint as to "why" this situation may have become what it is.  There is always another side to examine.  Since Ed will not post here I feel it was important to give my opinion on why he has chosen to stop dealing with people calling to price things.  
 
 <In fact, letting the vendors stick it to the consumers is the surest way to kill the car. In a free market economy, and yes the DeLorean is part of a free market economy, it is competition that drives such things as advances in technology that will make the DeLorean more reliable, refinements in engineering that make parts less costly, and other such things that can only lengthen the longevity of the car.>

I don't think any of our vendors try to "stick" it to consumers.  Some claim that D1's prices are higher but we have a limited number of cars so any advancements are only going to be made by vendors (or individuals) who can afford to do the research and try and make their investment back.  If people are wasting the vendors time with B.S. price hopping tactics it seems to me like this makes them lose money therefore driving down the chance of them to be willing to put more money into R+D.   
 
 <Consumers shopping for the best price is an integral part of that system, as is comparing notes on the vendors, and so forth. Dealing with that is part of the vendors' job.>

I agree to the first part but understand that one vendor has already choosen to no longer "deal with It".  I am trying to say that MORE vendors may take this position if this kind of "over-the-top" abuse continues.  With a community so small it is unacceptable for a small percentage to waste the valuable time of our major vendors.  Do you know how many more cars our vendors could get to in a day if they didn't have to deal with the people who call for prices and have no intention to buy parts?  Do you really think our vendors need to deal with calls like "I can buy it for $5.00 less at Pepboys....will you match it?"  Rob knows that if I call him with a question and I need a part I will buy it from him.  

Would it be fair if I called Rob and took up his time about a problem and have him steer me in the right direction as to what to check for and then turn around and decide to buy the part I need from someone else?  Or worse, Tell Rob thanks for helping me with my problem but I will only buy the part from you if you sell it to me for $xxx because I found it for less at another vendor.  I feel that's B.S.   

If anyone would like to discuss this further please e-mail me privately.  I enjoy the debate.

Tom
#05732





So....let me state again......If you are not one of the people who are haggling with our vendors please don't take offense. 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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