From: <>
To: <>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 2106
Date: Tuesday, July 06, 2004 4:55 PM

There are 17 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. brake update
From: "andy" <>

2. Re: Too much fuel
From: "dukeofclassiccars" <>

3. Re: brakes
From: "Chris" <>

4. Re: DPNW Door Lock Actuator Question
From: "ryanpwright" <>

5. Re: Again-Door Seals; Inner

6. Re: DPNW Door Lock Actuator Question

7. Oil bolt Removal tool
From: "gremishe" <>

8. Re: Pass door lock malfunction
From: "Dani B" <>

9. Re: Bad bearing or...?
From: "Dani B" <>

10. Re: Bill Robertson is a genius! AC retrofit success!
From: "content22207" <>

11. Re: [DMLWhats a Delorean Worth?
From: "gzapf" <>

12. PF concours competition comments
From: "Grimsrud, Knut S" <>

13. VIN 3092 goes to ....AUSTRIA?!
From: "nbrommer2k" <>

14. Gold Delorean in Snyder, Texas
From: Christopher Randazzo <>

15. Re: 2256 is alive
From: "jmlaux83" <>

16. The cooling fans
From: Travis Goodwin <>

17. Re: Angle Drive
From: "thebrave65" <>

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 17:33:40 -0000
From: "andy" <>
Subject: brake update

I attempted to bleed all 4 brakes no fluid to be found. As a couple 
of you guys suggested i broke the lines at the master cylinder and 
mashed the brakes. I got no fluid out of either line here, the 
reservoir is full, what is the next move for me? Bad Master Clinder? 
If how hard is this to replace?


Message: 2
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 18:07:04 -0000
From: "dukeofclassiccars" <>
Subject: Re: Too much fuel

I will check the connectors and voltage tonight.  I did remember that 
I just replaced the CPR/WUR not more than 2 months ago (I've replaced 
so much that I can't remember what I did replace without looking at 
my receipts).  The car did sit for five years prior to 5 months ago, 
but I ran the car for 3 months before replacing the CPR/WUR.  I was 
unaware that the fuel ditributor could cause the same effect and I 
never did get around to replacing it.  Is there a way to check the 
fuel distributor?  Can it be taken apart?  Another thing that happens 
is the car will just die instantly sometimes (just by itself, not 
even struggle) and sometimes it will choke-up when I push on the 
pedal.  I have had no problems with the way the car ran since I got 
her running the first time.  I did check all vacuum hoses again, but 
this problem doesn't seem like a vacuum leak, at least from the 

--- In, "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_s...> wrote:
> Dan, Your right the CPR /WUR could have died,  but has the car been 
sitting because the fuel distributor can also cause the same thing if it got
> varnished up.


Message: 3
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2004 20:00:05 +0100
From: "Chris" <>
Subject: Re: brakes

> I tried to bleed my brakes per the instructions, problem is this I
> get no fluid out of the right rear lines(only one I have tried)....The
> Reservoir is full of fluid, hey guys where do I go from here?

I replaced my master cylinder and when I went to bleed the rear passenger
brake I had the same problem. Due to the new master cylinder the flexible
brake hose had collasped so had to replace it. Just a thought


Message: 4
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 19:09:44 -0000
From: "ryanpwright" <>
Subject: Re: DPNW Door Lock Actuator Question


The new ones work exactly like the old ones. They just use a lot less
power, and they also use outboard relays so there is virtually no
strain on your lock control module. If your remote lock/unlock worked
before your solenoids died, then it will work fine with the new
actuator kit.

I have Toby's door launcher kit - probably the exact same kit you have
- and I also have his new door lock actuators. They work seamlessly


--- In, PRC1216_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Since my door lock solenoids are absolutely shot, I am considering
> the actuators.   My only concern is that I have the door launcher
kit that 
> Darryl Tinnerset used to sell before he sold the business to Toby. 
 Since the 
> door lock module is no longer used with the actuators, can I still
use the 
> remote lock/unlock feature?   As I recall, I wired the control
module into the 
> door lock module to get the doors to lock and unlock.   Its hard to
picture how 
> these new ones work.
> Thanks,
> Patrick
> 1880


Message: 5
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 19:31:08 -0000
Subject: Re: Again-Door Seals; Inner

Murray - We have been talking with the other PNDC members on your 
half of the state about having a tech session someplace over there.  
One member in the Spokane area has volunteered his shop.  I think 
that it would be doable for me to take a swing around Eastern 
Washington to help you with this installation, and then meet up with 
the rest of the crew further north for the PNDC-sponsored tech 
session.  Give me a shout off-List and we can discuss the details.

Toby Peterson  VIN 2248 "Winged1"
DeLorean Parts Northwest, LLC
email toby(at)

--- In, "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_c...> 
> Toby,
> 	Okay, Now I need YOU or someone capable to INSTALL your 
Wings Aloft Kit for me.   I will provide lodging and steaks.   I am 
not able to bring my car there, nor do the work.  I don't "bend" 
like I used to, now that I am 83.


Message: 6
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 19:06:16 -0000
Subject: Re: DPNW Door Lock Actuator Question

Patrick - It may be best to contact me off-list and I can walk you 
through this specific installation.  The short answer is that that 
the new door lock actuator system will work perfectly with the 
previously installed door opening setup that you bought from 
Darryl.  In fact, Winged1 has the current DPNW version of the door 
openers installed right along side the new door lock actuator system 
with wonderful results.  After carefully reading your question, I 
can tell you that the new door lock actuators do continue to use the 
door lock module in order to preserve some aspects of the overall 
functionality such as central locking and automatic unlock with the 
inertia switch tripped.  The key is that the electrical current draw 
from the new system is miniscule compared to those solenoids, so the 
original door lock module should survive indefinitely.  In fact, the 
module sees only the added relay trigger current, which is very 
small.  Shoot me a note off-List and I'll answer any further 
questions that you might have.

Toby Peterson  VIN 2248 "Winged1"
DeLorean Parts Northwest, LLC
email toby(at)  

--- In, PRC1216_at_dml_a... wrote:
> Since my door lock solenoids are absolutely shot, I am considering 
purchasing the actuators.   My only concern is that I have the door 
launcher kit that Darryl Tinnerset used to sell before he sold the 
business to Toby.   Since the door lock module is no longer used 
with the actuators, can I still use the remote lock/unlock 
feature?   As I recall, I wired the control module into the door 
lock module to get the doors to lock and unlock.   Its hard to 
picture how these new ones work.
> Thanks,
> Patrick
> 1880


Message: 7
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 23:11:19 -0000
From: "gremishe" <>
Subject: Oil bolt Removal tool


Can someone please tell me where can I get the Oil bolt Removal tool.
It's a squre type.

Thank you


Message: 8
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 20:41:26 -0000
From: "Dani B" <>
Subject: Re: Pass door lock malfunction

For an update, I adjusted some things so that the contact plate would
move over the contacts enough, and now the problem has gone away.
Sometimes the passenger side won't unlock all the way, but it doesn't
stick or kick back anymore which I'm very happy about. Thank you all
for your help! Dani B. 5003


Message: 9
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2004 20:44:28 -0000
From: "Dani B" <>
Subject: Re: Bad bearing or...?

Turns out the problem is the driver's side rear bearing. I have one on
order and will replace it as soon as I have the time for it. Then the
noise should be greatly reduced along with the vibration-the bearing
in there now is really bad. I have stopped using the car until it's
fixed. I don't want to seize anything. Thanks for all your help guys-
Dani B. #5003


Message: 10
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2004 01:05:17 -0000
From: "content22207" <>
Subject: Re: Bill Robertson is a genius! AC retrofit success!

Actually I'm just an old man in search of some cool air.

Using the engine to vacuum down an A/C system is controversial, so
don't expect everyone to share your enthusiasm. Only pulls 17 inches,
versus 29-30 inches done "properly". But it does work. Evacuates the
moisture, which is what matters. Of course if I had a stand alone
vacuum pump I'd use it instead.

Note that I also use the compressor itself to force flushing fluid
through -- don't have a stand alone air compressor either.

Which oil did you add to your new compressor? (Assuming Hervey sells
them dry) Anyone converting a system without draining an existing
compressor should top it off with Ester oil as needed, not PAG. Ester
oil is compatible with remaining mineral oil from the the R12.

Unless your problem was at the compressor (change those O rings
whenever the hoses are off!) don't expect the system to suddenly NOT
leak now. If it was leaking somewhere else before, it will continue to
leak. As long as you top it off before pressure drops below the
atmosphere, you won't need to vacuum it down again. Don't overfill it
however. A properly charged system holds steady slightly above 30 PSI
on the low side, even as compressor RPMs increase.

I am leery of monkeying with other fittings. Often are rusted
together. Is too easy to rip a pipe out of the condensor or
evaporator. Would rather buy more freon than a new component.

Don't think I quoted the Autozone part numbers I used to make a R134
charging hose to vacuum hose adapter:
- Part #323080   M12 male to 1/8" NPT female
- Part #323317   1/8" NPT male to 1/4" hose barb
Used 1/4" hose because of all the Lincolns. You could just as easily
substitute a 1/8" NPT to 3/16" hose barb.

One of the challenges of owning a vintage automobile is trying to find
outside mechanics to work on it. Most have more than enough business
from cars they know better, and thus aren't interested. Owning a
vintage "exotic" car like the DeLorean only exacerbates the problem.

That's why DeLorean owners must share information and ideas with each
other, and help one another whenever possible.

Bill Robertson

>--- In, "Palatinus, Joe" <jopalatinus_at_dml_d...>
> I finally decided to go for R 134a retrofitting.  I believe I had a
very slow leak in the system while running R12 (shops could not detect
one) but my compressor would begin to cycle rapidly and cooling would
be unacceptable.  I bought a new compressor from John Hervey at PF,
and I followed Bill Robertson's retrofititng instructions on the DMC
NEWs tech page.  They are simply brilliant, especially for those of us
with out  vaccuum pump capable of pulling a good vaccuum on the


Message: 11
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2004 02:36:31 -0000
From: "gzapf" <>
Subject: Re: [DMLWhats a Delorean Worth?

I shopped for, and found, a DeLorean a few months ago... from a
potential buyer perspective, I have a recommendation that may help a
lot:  Add more pictures!  Get some more shots of the interior, dash,
footwell, stereo, cruise, sexy shots with the doors up, etc...  It
looks good from what you have there, but some nice shots of a clean
car go a lot further than words.

Good luck; the car sounds like a great deal!  --Greg

--- In, jwit6_at_dml_c... wrote:
> 6147 has been advertised in Collector Car Trader for about 2 months
now for $18,000 or B/O.
> I got a call about 2 weeks ago from a gentleman in Dallas who said
he wanted it. We were working out the shipping when his wife stepped
in and told him he couldn't have it. Actually she didn't like the way
it looked.


Message: 12
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2004 21:15:32 -0700
From: "Grimsrud, Knut S" <>
Subject: PF concours competition comments

I had the pleasure of participating in the concours competition at the
PF event again, and I wanted to share my experiences and comments with
everyone. I'm sorry my message is a bit late in coming - I have been
running around with my hair on fire since the PF event and have been
struggling to catch up (those of you that have met me know what a sight
it would be for me to run around with my hair on fire).


I always think it's such a thrill to get the opportunity to closely
inspect some of the finest and most meticulously prepared examples of
the DMC marque. Congratulations to both John and Dan for their
outstanding cars and my thanks to both of them for sharing their
exquisite cars with us. I was sorry to see that the third car scheduled
for the event had last-minute issues and unfortunately missed the event.
I don't recall the exact point count, but for those that were not at the
PF event, Dan Deutsch (not the evil one) took first place honors with
his car. 


Ken really outdid himself this time with the accommodations, and the
concours got top billing with the cars taking center stage for both the
judging event and for display the rest of the evening. I hope those at
the show got a chance to examine the cars Saturday afternoon while they
were on display.


This time I got a chance to work with Andy (Soma) who served as judge's
assistant. His assistance not only made the judging a lot of fun but he
was extremely helpful in verifying sightings and scribing all the
information we attempted to cram into the limited space on the judging
sheets. Thanks, Andy, for all your help during the show - I hope you
also found the judging to be interesting and fun. Andy and I were
assigned the undercarriage this time, and of all the different
categories I have judged to date I found the undercarriage to be by far
the most challenging to judge.


I learned a lot from inspecting the undercarriage of the cars. The first
was that when inspecting the undercarriage, doing it indoors at Ken's
show with a clean floor is probably the best situation you can ask for!
The original valve stem caps have apparently become as rare as hens
teeth. I checked my show car as soon as I got home and was disappointed
to see that when I had my tires replaced last time the tire shop
replaced my original caps with the run-o-the-mill plastic ones. If you
have the original metal knurled valve stem caps, I would suggest you
keep close tabs on them and take care to avoid a helpful tire shop
replacing them for you. With both of the competing cars having been
brought in trailers, both cars showed marring of the tow hooks (which I
presume were used for tie-down during transportation). On both cars I
noticed that the trailing edge of the lower control arms appeared to
have a noticeable deflection, and at the time I presumed it was damage
resulting from someone hooking to the lower control arms for tie-down or
for towing. With both cars having the same feature, I suspect now that
it is instead an artifact of the stamping process of the lower control
arm resulting in the training edge having an unusual deflection (I'll
have to look into this). With both cars having the same artifact, it was
not material to the judging. The only other common issue I discovered
with the cars was that a few of the Philips head screws used to secure
the rocker panels were either corroded or marred. The marred fasteners
gave the impression of having been over-tightened resulting in the
Philips head of the fasteners "puckering." This is easy to notice by
running your finger over the fastener and checking for noticeable
protruding sharp edges. I'm sure the hardest part of the prep work (and
the judging) was surely the undercarriage detailing. Having seen how
clean the undercarriage can be and how impressive it looks when dressed
up, I'm inspired to spend some time under my car.


Thanks to the competitors and to Ken for supporting the concours
competition at the PF event. I really enjoyed working with the other
judges and the competitors for the event and look forward to the next
time I might have a chance to participate. If you have considered
participating as a contestant, I would encourage you to do so as the
experience can be quite rewarding. If you have questions about the event
or would like insights on participating, please feel free to drop me a




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Message: 13
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2004 07:38:28 -0000
From: "nbrommer2k" <>
Subject: VIN 3092 goes to ....AUSTRIA?!

Hello Group,

Well, after offering my car on the list...I was forced to sell on 
ebay. Of course, AFTER I start the auction, I got offers for $1000 
more than the final bid price,which was a paltry $7550. You all 
disappoint me, couldn't we do better than that? 

But, being the ethical person I am, I followed through with the ebay 
transaction. Where the hell were you people with the offers for the 
last 2 months?!?!

Anyway, I digress:

Gerhard came from Austria this evening and picked up the car and 
drove it away to Seattle, where it will ship to Bremerhaven, 
Germany. From there he will drive it to Austria, probably will only 
be one of a handful in the entire country!

God Speed, Gerhard! Enjoy living the dream!



Message: 14
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2004 05:28:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Christopher Randazzo <>
Subject: Gold Delorean in Snyder, Texas

Hey group -

I've been a Delorean owner and lurker of this group since the late 90's (I have an 83 D).  Some of you on here know me, but for the most part, I stay pretty much quiet and just watch you all...

Anyways, this 4th of July weekend I drove (not in my D) across Texas (from where I live in Dallas to my hometown of El Paso) and decided to see if I could visit the gold Delorean in Snyder, Texas (all the other times I make the trip it's on a weekend and I figured the bank would be closed - this time, it was a Friday).

The bank was super easy to find in downtown Snyder and I got the first parking spot right up front.  Had my cameras waiting and was really excited. I walked in to the bank (it was nice - very big lobby) and looked around for the car.  In the middle, there was a platform, with glass walls, but it was empty.  I really couldn't tell if this is where the car should be or not.  I kept looking around, but was starting to get some stares... ( I guess an out-of-towner standing in the bank looking all around looked kinda suspicious).  So I asked the nice lady behind the counter:

"Excuse me.  This may sound kind of silly, but is there suppose to be a car in here?"  I asked.

Her response:  "I'm sorry, honey.  Yes.  It sat it the glass case behind you for over 20 years.  It was moved out last month."

The gold Delorean in the Snyder Texas bank is no more.

The lady went on to explain that the owners of the bank (and the Delorean) recently sold the bank and retired to California, taking the car with them.  She said it was quite a site to see the car being rolled out of the bank - they had to remove the bank doors and slowly wheeled it on the trailer.  According to her, the car had no miles, never had gas in it, or oil.

Obviously I was disappointed.  For over 20 years I had been making the trip across Texas, and I missed seeing the car by a month.

Just thought I would share my story with you all.

83 Delorean #15786

Buy and sell stocks in NFL teams! Get paid dividends every time your team wins! Free limited-time trial at


Message: 15
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2004 09:20:27 -0000
From: "jmlaux83" <>
Subject: Re: 2256 is alive

my car is once again idling like crap. the rpm's are fluxuating 
between 800 and 1200 and the oil pressure gague moves from around 1/8 
to 1/2. I am positive that it is a vacuum leak some where. I did 
replace the belts and they did squeal but I tightened them up so 
thats not the problem. I am thinking that the whistling may be the 
air flow sensor plate. Does that sound right to anyone? Good news is 
that I changed my oil the other day and didn't see any signs of a 
broken head gasket. I also was able to back her out of the garage; so 
no probs with the transmission so far.

Here is a list of all the things I have replaced so far inorder to 
better diagnose my problem.

clutch master cylinder
fuel pump
fuel filter
fuel distributor
cap and rotor
spark plugs, wires, coil
replaced seals for entire upper engine (minus elec. distributor and 
valve covers)
new hoses for water pump
new vacuum line hoses. (not original thickness temps. from the auto 
vacuum switch



Message: 16
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2004 08:42:57 -0400
From: Travis Goodwin <>
Subject: The cooling fans

Here's one for debate: What are the drawbacks of running the fans all the


Message: 17
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2004 15:26:30 -0000
From: "thebrave65" <>
Subject: Re: Angle Drive

Did you check the upper and lower cables to see if they spin freely?  
I replaced an AD in a fellow members car, but before she took it out 
for a drive, I removed the lower cable from its tube, greased it up 
and removed the lambda and checked it over.  I also gave the upper 
cable a few good spins just to make sure it was ok.

That's the beauty of the DeLorean's speedometer:  simplicilty.

What about your dust cover?  Is it is good condition?  After you 
installed the angle drive, did it move freely on the large nut?  It 


> Ok, just thought I would find out how many of us are out there that 
have installed a new angle drive and have it splinter apart when you back out of the driveway the first time?
>   Dustin
> #6746


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