From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 2172
Date: Friday, August 13, 2004 6:03 PM

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

2. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

3. Re: Greasy, cloudy windows
From: DMCVIN6683 <dmcvin6683_at_dml_wi.rr.com>

4. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "Matt Spittle" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>

5. Orlando Owner Seeking Help... Ahh!
From: "motox45" <motox45_at_dml_yahoo.com>

6. Re: glove box
From: "Matt Spittle" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>

7. RE: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "Joseph Kuchan" <josephkuchan_at_dml_hotmail.com>

8. Re: Do fuel accumulators die overnight??... I'm stumped here.
From: Peter Lucas <lucas_at_dml_Maya.com>

9. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: kevin creason <kcreason77_at_dml_yahoo.com>

10. Re: Do fuel accumulators die overnight??... I'm stumped here.
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>

11. Re: Do fuel accumulators die overnight??... I'm stumped here.
From: "Joe OBrien" <joeyoseppijoe_at_dml_yahoo.com>

12. RE: Re: Greasy, cloudy windows
From: "Video Bob" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>

13. RE: Early '81 VIN 961 going up for sale
From: "Matthew David" <DMC5524_at_dml_hotmail.com>

14. Re: Greasy, cloudy windows
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>

15. Re: Full Throttle Microswitch Wanted!!!!
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>

16. Re: Interior LED lights
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>

17. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>

18. Re: Re: Greasy, cloudy windows
From: "Rustproof" <Rustproof_at_dml_comcast.net>

19. Interior LED lights
From: klaus.steiner_at_dml_t-online.de

20. Wanted: Door Key Lock
From: "Matt Spittle" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>

21. After MArket Cruise Control Removal...Help! :)
From: "Mike" <mike.bosworth_at_dml_btinternet.com>

22. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>

23. DeLorean TV Sighting - VH1
From: Shannon Yocom <ssdelorean_at_dml_yahoo.com>

24. Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>

25. Info about VIN 6441 Red Delorean
From: "Wizard" <wizard_at_dml_tdgllc.com>





Message: 1
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 23:06:38 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

The ONLY thing you haven't replaced is the ignition ECU...

Do you understand how coils build up HT electricity? Normally grounded
breakerless module (or points) momentarily breaks that ground, causing
the coil to suddenly build up a high voltage charge, which is then
passed to a plug as the distributor rotor passes it. If it for some
reason fails to break the ground -- no spark. If it doesn't break
ground long enough -- weak spark. If it breaks ground too long --
burned up coil.

Bosch ECU of course has to adjust dwell times to yield a consistent
spark over the entire RPM range. Yours may not be doing that. Try
swapping it with Mike's.

Bill Robertson
#5939



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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 23:22:12 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

I seem to recall you had the car that ran badly and when you replaced
a connection (or a wire I am not sure) to the ignition coil it ran
much better. I am guessing you still have some wiring problems that
have not been sorted out yet. When you accelerate you are putting the
ignition system under a heavier load than idling so whatever is
happening is happening under the increasd load. Check out the entire
wiring system for the primary ignition system. This includes the
wiring harness, the white ballast resistors, the bypass relay, and all
of the plugs and connections. You are correct, the timing light should
not go out. This indicates you are not getting secondary voltage to
the spark plugs. Try putting the timming light on the wire from the
ignition coil to the distributer. If it stays lit up then you are
loosing the power in the distributer. I once had a rotor short out and
I couldn't get a spark to come out of the distributer even though I
knew I was getting the power going in! Just because you put new parts
in doesn't mean you couldn't have a defective one, or maybe it got
damaged when you installed it.
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757 



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Message: 3
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:26:10 -0500
From: DMCVIN6683 <dmcvin6683_at_dml_wi.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Greasy, cloudy windows

I have a leak at the o-ring seals near my right front tire and when i 
turn the a/c on i get a fine oil mist spray that gets on the window. 
This could be what you are experiencing.

Mark V




On Wednesday, August 11, 2004, at 11:25  PM, Christian Williams wrote:

> For some reason, I can not get my windows clean.



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Message: 4
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 00:39:08 -0000
From: "Matt Spittle" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

Might be a long shot, but have you checked your grounds and "hots" 
on the car?  Especially check those nearby the ignition coil and 
make sure they are clean and tight from BOTH sides.  

Matt
#1604



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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 00:30:06 -0000
From: "motox45" <motox45_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Orlando Owner Seeking Help... Ahh!

Hey thanks to anyone who can help me :) Ok heres my problem i just 
got a new alternator from specialTauto the 150 amp, put it in 
correctly followed the instructions the whole 9 yards including 
putting in the new bulb... OK so i charged my battery fully and 
started the car my apmage thing was and went compltely down and when 
i would give it some gas it would go up to about 10 amps then just 
drop back down. and then soon as i shut the car off it wouldnt start 
back up it would give the ol click click click but i checked the 
volts on it and it said 12.01 so granted that means i have a preety 
full battery and the car should start but its acting like i have a 
dead battery.. Iv cleaned all the contacts to the grounds and done 
all that and still the same problem. GRanted my old alternator 
before never made my ampage go past about 10 amps. So preety 
frustrated and stumped so any help would extremely appreciated! 
Thanks




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Message: 6
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 00:57:27 -0000
From: "Matt Spittle" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>
Subject: Re: glove box

This is the procedure I used to fix my glove box:

- Attach the 2 bolts & nuts that hold the bottom part of the latch, 
LOOSELY to
the fiberglass.

- LOOSELY attach the upper portion of the latch with the single 
phillips screw. 

- With your glove box hinges SEMI-LOOSELY attached, go ahead and try 
to close the glove box so that it latches.  This will likely require 
you manipulate moving the lid around as well as moving the upper 
part of the lower latch (the part that attaches with the phillips 
screw) with your hand.  With your third hand, go ahead and squeeze 
the latch release buttons together on the lid to facilitate getting 
the damn thing to latch, period.  

- If you're good, you've got it latched, and all of the fasteners 
are loose.  

- Tighten up the 2 bolts that hold the lower part of the latch.  
This part of the adjustment is done.

- Open the lid again, and tighten the hinges so that the lid sits 
well on the dash.  This takes some eyeballing.  

- Now the most critical part, adjusting the upper part of the lower 
latch (where the phillips screw attaches).  This seems to be the 
difference between a box that latches shut and doesn't.  You've 
gotta move it up and down and all around, finding the sweet spot, 
tightening it each time, until you find a magical position where you 
can close the lid and it will latch.  

-Reinstall passenger side kneepad.  If you did all of the above 
correctly, this will reinforce this area of the dash and it will 
latch even better than while the kneepad was still not installed.  

Hope it helps.


Matt
#1604





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Message: 7
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:51:58 -0500
From: "Joseph Kuchan" <josephkuchan_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

There's a condenser that goes from the coil to ground. It's located next to 
the coil and has a single yellow wire. Have you checked that? Try 
disconnecting it. It shouldn't hurt anything, but if it is defective your 
problem may disappear when it is disconnected.

-Joe Kuchan



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Message: 8
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:12:50 -0400
From: Peter Lucas <lucas_at_dml_Maya.com>
Subject: Re: Do fuel accumulators die overnight??... I'm stumped here.

On Aug 12, 2004, at 4:32 PM, Enid/Jeremiah wrote:

> To summarize everything you've said, I have the exact
> same identical situation with the exception that my
> timing isn't dead on.  All your "lukewarm" symptoms -
> I experience all of them as well.  To coincide with
> you, I as well have replaced every single fuel
> component, except the accumulator and cold start
> valve.  I have guesstimated/determined it's probably a
> dead accumulator.  Hopefully at least =P.

Well, I have a mild version of this "warm-start" syndrome as well. If I 
hit just the wrong engine temperature (not too hot and not too cold), I 
have starting trouble. But I have checked my fuel hold pressure 
directly, so I know for sure that it is not an accumulator issue.  I 
have also recently replaced my thermo-time switch. Switching the plugs 
to force the cold-start valve always allows a start. Evidently there is 
a temperature window between the thermo-time switch's idea of "cold"and 
the engine's.  My next step is to test my new thermo-time switch to see 
if perhaps it is miscalibrated.

John Hervey's web site suggests the alternate theory that this can be 
caused by a worn O-ring in the primary pressure regulator:
http://specialtauto.com/delorean-parts/fuel-injection.html
John, can you tell us any  more about this?

At any rate, I can attest that this "warm-start" phenomenon is 
definitely distinct from the classic "hot start" problem.

--Pete Lucas
   VIN #06703




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Message: 9
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 19:30:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: kevin creason <kcreason77_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

I know the events you speak of.
I've got the Bosch 18kv coil, too. It seems fine
idling in the driveway, at the stop light (warmed up).
But, the light turns and hit go I see two spots where
it runs rough: 900-1300 rpms (where it'll almost and
has died on me-- most embarrassing), and then
2400-2900 it just runs rough like choppy seas. It's a
little better with the a/c off.
Sometimes it's not so bad, most of the time it is.

I just haven't been sure about my alternator, though.
It's on the verge of going out. When it's over 90, it
may not put out enough to charge the battery back up.
And then, my accumulator appears to be going south
too. 

I'm not in Florida, and it's still pouring! Just not
the kind the lawn needs.




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Message: 10
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 02:33:49 -0000
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Re: Do fuel accumulators die overnight??... I'm stumped here.

If the fuel accumulator has never been replaced then you are waaay 
overdue. After 20+ years that is one item for which you should "just 
do it". I cannot imagine that there is a single D out there with an 
original accumulator in it that is still good. Well, maybe one.

Harold McElraft - 3354

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Joe OBrien" <joeyoseppijoe_at_dml_y...> 
wrote:
> Or do they gradually start to die? All the ones I have dealt with 
> seem to just not allow the car to start when hot.
> 
> sunk several hundred into it.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Joe O'Brien
> 
> 2524 & 16634




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Message: 11
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 02:53:48 -0000
From: "Joe OBrien" <joeyoseppijoe_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Do fuel accumulators die overnight??... I'm stumped here.

After talking it over with a few people, and after reading the 
replies, I am almost positive it is the thermotime switch. Once the 
engine reaches operating temp the fuel mixture smooths out and it 
runs perfectly again. I was almost about to remove the new CPR and 
slap on the old one, but I'm sure I'll be safe just replacing the 
thermotime switch. That and the radiator are the only cooling system 
parts that haven't been replaced. After I change the switch I'll 
post the results. Thanks for the suggestions once again. I might as 
well change the radiatior so that it is out of the way, since it 
will be the next to last origonal piece left. :-)


Thanks,


Joe OBrien

2524 & 16634








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Message: 12
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:55:09 -0500
From: "Video Bob" <videobob_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Greasy, cloudy windows

A temporary or maybe permanant soltion might be to use a moisture absorbing 
device.
You can go to Home Depot and they sell a bucket of little white absorbant 
sand that is
used to absorb moisture in closets, gun safes, etc.
It is simular to silica gel.
(I forgot what it is called)
It is only a few bucks and you can toss it in the back or under the seat.

I used this in my car when I had a small roof leak.
After the rain the whole inside was fog up in the heat from the moisture.
I put one of these in and it dried it up inside quick!
- VB




>
>
> > For some reason, I can not get my windows clean. Every time I clean
>them, with soap and water, windex, armor all window wipes, invisible
>glass, etc... within about 4 days, they're so cloudy that they're
>bordering on dangerous.



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Message: 13
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 03:07:38 +0000
From: "Matthew David" <DMC5524_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Early '81 VIN 961 going up for sale

>Fellow DMLers...
>
>I am offering my early '81 VIN 961 up for sale...

>Matt Metzinger
>Arkansas City, KS
>VIN 961 - KS Tag: TIMELES
>

I would like to chime in here. I have known Matt for a few years now and had 
actually looked at the car he is now selling before he bought it.

He is very modest. It is a beautiful car and he has done a very good job of 
updating a low mileage car. Whoever ends up with this machine will be 
incredibly lucky. I don't post often. Just wanted to give a good reference 
for Matt and VIN 961.


Matthew Cooley
Wichita, KS
VIN 5524 - KS Tag: WHENRWE





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Message: 14
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 02:51:02 -0000
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Re: Greasy, cloudy windows

When I lived in Houston years ago and my D was an everyday driver, 
it would cloud up in a week or less. I used the AC all the time and 
the D would be parked outside for an hour or two in the late 
afternoons. I check for a heater core leak, etc. and all was ok.

I never found a cause that I was sure about. It slowed down when I 
changed leather conditions. I use the original D cleaning kit stuff 
and switched to a Zymol conditioner and, what I think really helped, 
I started leaving the AC mode switch on "vent" when I closed up the 
car. I sort of forgot about it after that because it was minimal 
then.

Harold McElraft - 3354


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Christian Williams <delorean_at_dml_f...> 
wrote:
> For some reason, I can not get my windows clean. Every time I 
clean them,
> with soap and water, windex, armor all window wipes, invisible 
glass,
> etc... within about 4 days, they're so cloudy that they're 
bordering on
> dangerous.
> -Christian
> 
> 
> 
> (for the archives, I have streaky windows, greasy windows, cloudy 
windows,
> smeared windows, dirty windows)




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Message: 15
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 03:16:26 -0000
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Re: Full Throttle Microswitch Wanted!!!!

I assume yours is missing completely? The OEM for automatics is a 
stack of two switches - and they are EXPENSIVE. At least I think so 
for what they do. (5 speeds have just one switch)

One of the two "stacked" switches on the automatic is a "kick-down" 
for the transmission that I believe is unnecessary. The kick-down 
from throttle position is, in my opinion, adequate and the electric 
kick-down can cause severe shifting patterns - eg three to first 
shifts, etc. The other is the full throttle enrichment (FTE). The 
FTE on a five speed is effective. Also on an automatic without the 
kick-down switch the FTE is effective. But, I doubt if you would 
ever know it was on the car with an automatic and the kickdown 
switch is functioning - at full throttle the RPM is very high and on 
the down side of the torque curve.

My point? - If you find one I would recommend just the FTE.

Harold McElraft - 3354


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Mike" <mike.bosworth_at_dml_b...> wrote:
> Hi All
> 
> Does any one have a full throttle microswitch with the wiring and 
the 
> littlesecuring plate /bolts? lying around.... if so i need 
one :).....
> To suit an automatic ( if they are differnet to a manual ??)
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> #2001
> doc403
> hull, uk




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Message: 16
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 03:21:30 -0000
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Re: Interior LED lights

Couldn't you also just "jumper" around the delay module? You would 
not have a light delay but the leds should work with the door action 
then.

Harold McElraft - 3354



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_v...> wrote:
> By replacing the regular incandescent lamps with LED's you've 
lowered the resistance in the electrical circuit that the lamp delay module 
uses to shut off the lamps. You either need to insert a resistor in the circuit 
or live with the regular lamps.



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Message: 17
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 03:48:09 -0000
From: "Harold McElraft" <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

One thing for sure - under load, poor spark does yield the symptoms 
you describe. The light goes out because there is weak spark.

The diagnosis probably rests in the effect the ECU is having on the 
coil. I haven't studied the relationships on the D but I do know 
that a match is essential. As an example, I recently opted to go 
with a Nology system because of the testing that was done by Nology. 
I noticed that a different coil is not a requirement (they provide 
an amplifier for the coil).
 
I highly recommend the Nology by the way - A noticeable "kick" and 
significantly more power (keeps pulling) at the higher revs.

Harold McElraft  3354





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Message: 18
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 01:42:44 -0400
From: "Rustproof" <Rustproof_at_dml_comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Re: Greasy, cloudy windows

I had this same problem. I thought it was everything from my heater-core to
the AC. It drove me nuts! I finally discovered that it was something called
"Vinyl vapor" from the dash board when left in the sun (or heat) too long.
There is a window cleaner made by "Eagle21" just for this problem. You can
get it at Pep Boys or Autozone. I used it and shazaam, no more fog. If you
reupholstered any part of your car (especially the dash) this may be your
problem.
Rustproof
Vin 1559


----- Original Message -----
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: [DML] Re: Greasy, cloudy windows


> You have something in the car giving off vapors.



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Message: 19
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 10:24:13 +0200 (CEST)
From: klaus.steiner_at_dml_t-online.de
Subject: Interior LED lights

Remove the interior (delay-) relay (#23, white) and everything works
fine.

Klaus 05980 with working interior LEDs
Germany


> Message: 23        
>    I installed LEDs in the passenger compartment, they
> work fine when  turned on and off manually, but will not shut off
when in
> the activated via the doors. The lights work correctly when
> the orignal bulbs are put back in. Suggestions!
> 
> Steve 1089



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Message: 20
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 10:43:57 -0000
From: "Matt Spittle" <supermatty_at_dml_psu.edu>
Subject: Wanted: Door Key Lock

I have been looking around for a month or two now trying to find a 
door key lock.  It would have to be the newer style, like the 83's 
have so that it can be easily removed and installed with the spring 
clip.  I've read that they can be modified to work with the stock 
ignition key, so no door key is necessary.  

Or, if anyone knows a good cross reference, please advise.  I'm not 
interested in paying over $100 for it if I can help it.  

thanks,

Matt
#1604




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Message: 21
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 15:12:22 -0000
From: "Mike" <mike.bosworth_at_dml_btinternet.com>
Subject: After MArket Cruise Control Removal...Help! :)

Hiya All

I have fitted to the car an aftermarket cruise control. although this 
doesnt work and appears not to have any effect the car starting / 
running etc , i want to remove.

One problem is ....i know nothing about how these kits work and 
although i could trace it all back  and remove...i may end up 
removing something that i shouldnt have.... or not put back in 
something thats needed

All i know is thats theres a control on top of the indicator arm, a 
vacumm canistor mounted in the engine bay with 2 differnet size hoses 
coming off it and the larger one goes to the divers footwell and 
hangs above the brake pedal....?

(Where would this hose have gone to ?

Also my full throttle switch has been removed ....no doubt as a 
result of this kit??? my kick down on the auto box works fine

Any advice greatly appreciated.

mike
#2001
doc403
automatic






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Message: 22
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 15:37:37 -0000
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

Uh...I'm not sure you completely read the earlier posts. I have 
indeed replaced the ignition ECU, I was loaned a functional spare for 
testing. There was no improvement.

I do understand how breaker-less ignition works, now that I've been 
reading up on it.

Some new theories are:

1. Despite the resistance being in spec, the pulse coil is dying, 
giving the ECU a poor signal to amplify and convert. (Garbage 
in=garbage out)

2. The ECU is poorly grounded. (check grounds)
3. The shielded cable from the ECU to the dizz is faulty. (continuity 
check)
4. The white/slate control wire from the ECU to the coil is faulty. 
(continuity check)
5. The mostly-new rotor is faulty (It has a 5k ohm resistor in it, 
resistance check)

I rule out the main coil-dizz wire because I've tried two and there 
was no change in performance. No matter if my timing advance was 
faulty, or if I was starving for fuel, the spark should be strong. It 
doesn't matter if the plugs fire at the wrong time, or on an empty 
cylinder. The timing light should still strobe under those conditions.


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_c...> 
wrote:
> The ONLY thing you haven't replaced is the ignition ECU...
> 
> Do you understand how coils build up HT electricity? Normally 
grounded
> breakerless module (or points) momentarily breaks that ground, 
<snip>




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Message: 23
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 08:44:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: Shannon Yocom <ssdelorean_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: DeLorean TV Sighting - VH1

For those who keep track and record such things... there is a brief rotating
kalidescope image of a DeLorean (front, doors up) on the opening minutes on a
show called "The Fabulous Life Of Classics: The Brat Pack" on VH1.

Re-run times to set the VCR/Tivo/DVR etc to are: 
Fri Aug 13th  7pm & 11:30pm
Sat Aug 14th 11:30am, 3pm & 10pm
Sun Aug 15th 10:30am & 11pm
Tue Aug 17th 1pm
Wed Aug 18th 2:30pm & 11:30pm
Fri Aug 20th 12:30pm
Tue Aug 24th 12:30pm
Sun Aug 29th 8pm

(fine print: all times Eastern Standard Time)

Shannon Y
16506 my drivable icon of the 80's!


	
		
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail 



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Message: 24
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 15:49:18 -0000
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: Still -more- ignition nonsense....

Precisely, even the A/C effect matches what's happening to me. 

For everyone who's replied, you've given me some great ideas and it 
sounds like we're thinking in relatively the same direction.

At this moment, I'm back to running a 12kv coil and it's only a 
little better.

That little condensor hanging from the coil is a ballast or 
electrical "shock absorber" so to speak, it seems silly but it may 
have an effect. I'll pull it and see what happens.

I'll also put the timing light on the main coil wire. That was my 
next idea. If the light always fires under load there, I'll suspect 
my rotor.

Thanks,
Rich A.




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Message: 25
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 11:54:43 -0400
From: "Wizard" <wizard_at_dml_tdgllc.com>
Subject: Info about VIN 6441 Red Delorean

I purchased a 1981 DMC VIN#6441.  It was painted red and the seats were
redone with red racing stripes.  As far as I know the car came from out
west.  Anyone have any info. or background on the car?

Jason



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