From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 2270
Date: Monday, October 11, 2004 3:53 PM


There are 26 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Delorean rear view camera
From: Peter Lucas <lucas_at_dml_Maya.com>

2. Emissions in CA
From: "Dani B" <5n-_at_dml_gmx.net>

3. Re: Re: Chevy Engine swap
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>

4. Re: Re: Delorean rear view camera
From: "Cecil Longwisch" <dmc1982_at_dml_msn.com>

5. RE: Fall Tour Urgent Hotel News!!!
From: Kevin Abato <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>

6. WTB: Passenger side knee bolster
From: JDub <doki_pen_at_dml_yahoo.com>

7. Rubber grips on the foot pedals
From: "Owen _at_dml_ Aerodrome" <owen_at_dml_aerodrome.us>

8. How much does the PRV weigh?
From: "Owen _at_dml_ Aerodrome" <owen_at_dml_aerodrome.us>

9. Re: Re: Delorean rear view camera
From: jordan rubin <nuttenschleuder_at_dml_yahoo.com>

10. Re: BTTF Engine Swap comments
From: Josh Haldeman <jhaldeman_at_dml_fuse.net>

11. Re: Lockzilla or WingsAloft???
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>

12. Re: PRV Engine Information
From: Josh Haldeman <jhaldeman_at_dml_fuse.net>

13. Re: PRV Engine Information
From: Andrew Prentis <aprentis_at_dml_rocketmail.com>

14. RE: Interesting new warehouse find...
From: "michael C. Babb" <mcb_at_dml_babbtechnology.com>

15. Dispelling rumors of a V8 in the BTTF cars (Bob Gale)
From: kKoncelik_at_dml_aol.com

16. Re: Chevy Engine swap
From: "ryanpwright" <dmcnews_list_at_dml_ryanwright.com>

17. Re: Chevy Engine swap
From: "ryanpwright" <dmcnews_list_at_dml_ryanwright.com>

18. Battery Light, RPM movement
From: "vtdmc" <wmack_at_dml_vt.edu>

19. Re: Chevy Engine swap
From: "ryanpwright" <dmcnews_list_at_dml_ryanwright.com>

20. Re: Chevy Engine swap
From: "d_rex_2002" <rich_at_dml_outernet-tech.net>

21. Thoughts on brakes
From: "John Rydholm" <ebondefender_at_dml_yahoo.com>

22. Re: New member here
From: "John Rydholm" <ebondefender_at_dml_yahoo.com>

23. Re: Battery Light, RPM movement
From: Jeff Phillips <rvparty_at_dml_gmail.com>

24. Re: Emissions in CA
From: "Owen _at_dml_ Aerodrome" <owen_at_dml_aerodrome.us>

25. Re: Thoughts on brakes
From: "thebrave65" <johnnysher1_at_dml_cox.net>

26. Engine Weight
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>





Message: 1
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 19:52:38 -0400
From: Peter Lucas <lucas_at_dml_Maya.com>
Subject: Re: Delorean rear view camera


Very nice, Jordan. Thanks for the pics. The DeLorean could be the 
poster child for backup cameras.

I did a similar install as part of my on-again, off-again 
computer/vehicle-monitor project. I like the way you capitalized on 
your euro-spec license plate to accomplish a nice, stealth camera 
install. Mine is a little more prominent.  You might find my monitor 
location interesting, though.  Check it out under #6803 in the Photos 
section:

http://tinyurl.com/6yzy8

A couple of notes for people contemplating this:
1) Look for a camera or monitor with a "mirror image" feature (not too 
hard to find). You want it to behave like a mirror, not like a TV.
2) One mistake I made was to have the camera pointing directly 
backwards.  You really want it pointing somewhat *downward*, so you see 
what or whom you are about to drive over. It also avoids exposing the 
camera to direct sunlight, which is not good.

--Pete Lucas
   VIN #06703

On Oct 10, 2004, at 11:15 AM, jordan rubin wrote:
> As some of you know, I have been working on a project
> which has one or more miniature cameras mounted on the
> Delorean which goes to an LCD display up front.
>
> After installing it in the mustang for testing, it
> finally went into the delorean today.  Not installed,
> mearly placed in and ran off of the lighter.
>
> I have provided any photos of this for you to view.
>
> http://retroserver.no-ip.com/gallery/camera/index.html
>
> Thanx
>
> Jordan 11613






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Message: 2
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:22:41 -0000
From: "Dani B" <5n-_at_dml_gmx.net>
Subject: Emissions in CA



To you guys who live in CA...I'm in NY right now and by doing an
engine swap I wouldn't have any problems with inspecting. The problem
is-I'm going to be living in Sacramento next August..So if I have a
swapped engine with no emissions, I would have to get a cat converter
if to pass right? If its going to be a problem with a swapped engine
in CA, then I'm not even going to bother with swapping. Yet another
DeLorean to be in CA eventually -Dani B. #5003








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Message: 3
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 17:35:03 -0700 (PDT)
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Chevy Engine swap


I enjoyed driving the car Darryl, even if it was not
running "at it's best".  If I remember correctly, it
was a bit too loud for me..  And if it were my car, I
would probably adjust the gearing a bit to optimize
the supercharger.

For anyone considering an engine swapped DeLorean,
this would be a good one to look at.  The conversion
was done very well.


--- darryl <darryl_at_dml_techline.com> wrote:

><SNIP>
> other hand is a huge improvement.  [footnote to Marc
> - when you drove the car the timing was severly
> advanced.  I had used the wrong timing marks the
> last time I worked on it.]
<SNIP>

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Message: 4
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:29:56 -0400
From: "Cecil Longwisch" <dmc1982_at_dml_msn.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Delorean rear view camera


Not sure if you have seen it , but Ken Costa  (his car had the blue stripe on it at Pigeon Forge) has had the backup camera in the rear for at least a couple of years. he did a great job of concealing it in the rear bumper and the combination DVD and rear camera screen is built in at the glove box. He usually monitors the list and I am sure will chime in!


Cecil Longwisch
#10663



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






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Message: 5
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:05:11 -0400
From: Kevin Abato <delorean_at_dml_abato.net>
Subject: RE: Fall Tour Urgent Hotel News!!!


Reminder:  There is a cheaper alternative for those who are interested

Days Inn Hicksville Long Island (13 min from Glen Cove)
516 433-1900   
 
I have already booked my room.  $86 per night (with my AAA discount)
Travelocity.com has it for the same price as AAA if u book thru them.

Kevin Abato
Vin# 16680
 

-----Original Message-----
From: turbodmc3113 [mailto:turbodmc_at_dml_hotmail.com] 
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 11:24 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Fall Tour Urgent Hotel News!!!







Last chance room reservations at the $159.00 rate.

Many of you have run into problems with the hotel reservations for 
the Fall Tour.
The last chance to get the $159 rate will be no later than Monday 
Oct. 10th subject to availability. I have worked things out with the 
hotel and if they quoted you a higher price please call them back 
immediately and you should get the adjusted rate YOU MUST DO THIS NO 
LATER THAN MONDAY!

The phone number for the Harrison Conference center is 516 671-6400 

The group rate is under "Fall Tour 5" 

I apologies for any inconvenience to all parties affected by this but 
I assure you it will be
worth it once we are there!

I will spare you all the contractual details of  what transpired but 
it should be ok now
E-mail me or call me at 516 676-9198  if you are still having 
problems.

For people who think they may be coming to the Fall tour for one or 
both days I still need to hear from you, I can waive the late 
registration fee if I know you are planning to come and you contact 
me. E-mail me at falltour5_at_dml_hotmail.ccom  that's falltour5(at)
hotmail.com 

If you want to see photos got to www.falltour.itgo.com  
For registration forms and more info go to the club web page 
http://www.deloreanmidatlantic.com/events/falltour5.htm 

5th Annual DeLorean Fall Foliage Tour Itinerary
 

October 16th & 17th 2004

The Long Island Gold Coast Tour, live the dream!


Saturday   
                             11:15am to 1:00pm

The first meeting point is at the Sands Point Preserve and Museum.
Parking fee is $2.00 (but may be waived?) admission to The Atoms 
Family exhibit is $4.00 (optional).
Sands Point Preserve 95 Middleneck Road, Sands Point, New York 11050  
(516) 571-7900
http://www.sandspointpreserve.org 

1:00pm
We line up for the caravan
Have your two-way FM radios on the DMC 12 channel 

1:30pm to 2:45pm
Arrive at Nassau County Art Museum Roslyn Harbor
145 Acres of Art, Gardens & Sculpture
One Museum Drive, Roslyn Harbor, NY 11576
Parking is free, Café Musee offers lunch and beverages but does not 
accept credit cards!
CURRENT EXHIBITION: The W.P.A. Era: Art Across America admission is 
$6.00 optional.
http://www.nassaumuseum.com 

2:45pm
Caravan to Hotel

Arrive at hotel (approximately) 3:00pm
Note: official check in time is 4:00 , explore the hotel grounds and 
facilities if you cant check in.
                   
                                                                  
5:30-6:45 pm
Dinner at Marra's (Glen Cove)
Family style Italian Buffet $25*paid in advance

6:45pm
Stone Cold Creamery (ice cream)
Starbucks, Liquor Store Etc.
Just steps away from Marra's
Back to the Pub and grounds at the Harrison conference center 
until ?????????????

Note: We adding things to this event, this Itinerary is subject to 
revision 
          and change. Remember to check for updates prior to the tour!

Sunday

Guests of the Harrison conference Center get a complimentary 
breakfast in the dining room (see hotel for serving time)

We will be doing a morning photo shoot of the cars at the hotel (Time to
be determined)


Check out and departure 11:00-11:30 am


Caravan to Road Rally start point (Crescent Beach about 1 mile) Get
ready for an awesome Road Rally! This will include a stop at the 
Welwyn Preserve 
This also has the Holocaust memorial and education center on the 
grounds if you wish to take time to visit it.



The Road Rally finishes in Bayville at the Walls Warf restaurant at 2:30
pm

3:00 Lunch/Dinner
This will be a fabulous dinner!
Choice of 3 entrees and dessert
Views of Long Island sound and Connecticut 
Don't miss this $25

Links:

Registration form 
http://www.deloreanmidatlantic.com/events/Falltour5/regform.pdf  

Mid Atlantic Club Info Fall Tour 
http://www.deloreanmidatlantic.com/events/falltour5.htm

For additional Images http://www.falltour.itgo.com/photo2.html

E-mail falltour5_at_dml_hotmail.com 














To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
Yahoo! Groups Links



 









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Message: 6
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:12:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: JDub <doki_pen_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: WTB: Passenger side knee bolster


Hey everyone, how's it going? I have a D with grey
interior and i'm looking for a good condition
passenger side knee bolster.  Can anybody help me out?
Thanks!

Jon Weiner
#3215





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Message: 7
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:35:43 -0700
From: "Owen _at_dml_ Aerodrome" <owen_at_dml_aerodrome.us>
Subject: Rubber grips on the foot pedals


When I got in my car today, I noticed the black rubber pad from the throttle pedal was lying on the carpet, the pedal itself reduced to the metal.  It's clear from the glue residue that the the rubber was glued right onto the pedal, but the rubber part has a channel in it that suggests it fits _over_ the pedal, and the P.O. glued it for some reason.

I haven't succeeded in coaxing it back on, yet, but I still suspect this is how it's supposed to go on.  Am I right, or should I just glue it?

Thanks in advance!

-Owen
VIN 10470 "1 21 GW"





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Message: 8
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:42:33 -0700
From: "Owen _at_dml_ Aerodrome" <owen_at_dml_aerodrome.us>
Subject: How much does the PRV weigh?


A friend was asking why the car is tail heavy, claiming that the PRV only weighs about 300 pounds.  Is that true?  I don't buy it, but I figure if that number is even close, it must surely be for a dry engine without all of the incidentals (starter, alternator, fuel+air delivery, fluids, etc.).

What _does_ the PRV weigh?

Regards,
Owen





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Message: 9
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 00:06:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: jordan rubin <nuttenschleuder_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Delorean rear view camera


After doing some more playing around I found that two cameras offset 90 degrees, which would also be each camera 45 degrees off of the car would allow for a large viewing area on two screens side by side.  Part procurment is the big issue as I only have 2 sony lcd modules and PAL drivers.  Ill try it out though.
 
jordan
 
11613

Harold McElraft <hmcelraft_at_dml_aol.com> wrote:



Great idea - I am very interested in this. Having owned a D for over 
23 years, every time I back out of a parking place, especially in a 
somewhat busy parking lot, I still get scared. Yesterday was a 
perfect example. Fortunately the fellow behind me realized I 
couldn't see him and backed away from me (over my left shoulder and 
out of mirror view too). When I finally did see him I almost died on 
the spot.

I hope you will continue to share the development with the group.

Harold McElraft - 3354



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, jordan rubin 
wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> As some of you know, I have been working on a project
> which has one or more miniature cameras mounted on the
> Delorean which goes to an LCD display up front.
> 
> After installing it in the mustang for testing, it
> finally went into the delorean today. Not installed,
> mearly placed in and ran off of the lighter.
> 
> I have provided any photos of this for you to view.
> 
> http://retroserver.no-ip.com/gallery/camera/index.html
> 
> Thanx
> 
> Jordan 11613








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Message: 10
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:32:39 -0400
From: Josh Haldeman <jhaldeman_at_dml_fuse.net>
Subject: Re: BTTF Engine Swap comments


Bob Gale, writer and producer of BTTF just wrote a whole article for 
this coming issue of DCS magazine about using the DeLorean, and it's 
many interesting (good and bad) facets, including engine issues.

It's a great read, and he sent me tons of photos, drawings and 
schematics that we've included in this issue.  If you aren't currently a 
subscriber, you can buy the single issue, or subscribe by going to 
www.deloreancarshow.com.

Thanks for the shameless plug space moderators!

-Josh



Tom Watkins wrote:

>I doubt very much that they swapped out the engines just to get the added jet sound.  As a film producer let me explain that just about EVERY sound you hear that are not the actors voices are added in later in post-production.  (footsteps, clock ticking, doors creaking, gunshots, engines running etc...) The DeLorean engine sound in the movie is created by a sound engineer and put in.  They did not put in a V8 just to get the engine growl.  They may have swapped out the engine for other reasons but it is inaccuracte to suggest the sound dept relied on a swapped engine for their effects.    I have worked with dozens of sound guys and they take lots of pride in the fact thay they create their sounds with like an artist.     
>
>Wrote:
>and even in Back to the Future they swapped the engine in 3 cars for a small block V8 
>in order to get an engine growl underneath the added jet sound.
>
>
>
>Tom Watkins
>dmctom_at_dml_earthlink.net
>Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
>moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
>For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
>
>To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>  
>







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Message: 11
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 07:47:04 -0000
From: "therealdmcvegas" <dmcvegas_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Re: Lockzilla or WingsAloft???



I totally agree with you. It's marketing that has certainly
established the 'Zilla line of products, and created such a loyal
demographic. And I also agree that they are not nessisary fixes. Like
I said, they help to point out the weak spots of the car by addressing
them, but they certainly are not as you said, "...what it takes to
keep these cars functioning." Fan Fail jumper (FanZilla), Door
Lock Module (LockZilla), & Tank Sending Unit (TankZilla). No, you
don't need to have a 'Zilla specific product to rectify any of these
issues. But like I say, they are quickly identified as solutions,
because of their names, that are in turn associated with a positive
product line.

Another great example of this are "Toby TABs". If I tell people that I
installed a new set of improved Trailing Arm Bolts, they somewhat know
what I'm talking about. But if I tell them that I've installed a set
of "Toby TABs" on my car, then they identify with exactly what I am
talking about, AND they they are impressed. With the mention of this
brand name product, they associate with the issue the product is meant
to address, the piece of mind that I now have, and their desire to
also follow suit with their own purchase and installation of said
product. When you've got a catchy name that's easy to remember, and
say, the advertising builds even quicker. Toby Tabs have the same
recognition as 'Zilla products, and can both build upon that
recognition, to further endorse products that will later be added to
that line. Sure, there may not be "100% proven" when released, but
that name association alread builds trust in the product, based upon
past reputation, and recognition.

I plan on eventually installing a DPNW door launcher kit, as my
experience with solenoids has not been a pleasant one. Plus, the
products that you (now DPNW) offerd I really like, as you had ALLOT of
improved parts, and performance parts that no one else offers (I just
never got the chance to order these from you in the past, because I
hadn't reached that stage yet). And your door laucher systems are no
exception, as they can even roll down windows, and remote
start. But I gotta tell you one thing. IMO, if there was a common
product line associtated with these products, word would have traveled
faster than you could have believed. I like the "Wings-A-Loft"
product, but I'd bet interest, and sales would increase if people
started refering to them to something else, like "Toby Launchers", or
something of the like. Build upon that past reputation, and turn it
into a sales pitch.

Yeah, you may not agree with the logic, and it may be a little
disturbing to you. But it works. Remember, even if there are
alternative products out there, like the improved TABs that John Hervy
also offers, that kind of marketing can play a big role.

-Robert
vin 6585 "X"



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "darryl" <darryl_at_dml_t...> wrote
<SNIP>
> Now Robert, your statement is a little disturbing: "Aside from
function, use of specificly branded products helps to further one's
pride in one's own vehicle."  That sounds like an advertiser's dream -
pay more for Nike because they spend millions on advertising, whether
or not it's a better product.  I'm having trouble with that one.  Some
of us just don't buy into that logic.  Maybe I am getting old, but I
just don't think that way - I use what works best, regardless of "name
branding"  But I have to agree, when I heard folks talking about all
the Zilla products they had installed, my thoughts were more toward
the power of advertising and image than "that's what it takes to keep
these cars functioning".  They are great products if you really do
need them.  But they aren't a requirement - I had 7 cars over an 18
year period without once needing any of them.








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Message: 12
Date: Sun, 10 Oct 2004 22:35:34 -0400
From: Josh Haldeman <jhaldeman_at_dml_fuse.net>
Subject: Re: PRV Engine Information


The workshop manual, available from the parts vendors, has a great 
section all about the engine...anything specific you're looking for?

Thanks for the shameless plug for the parts vendors space, moderators!  
(haha)

-Josh



Todd Nelson wrote:

>Hey,
>
>  Does anyone know of a reliable source to get information on the stock PRV engine used in the DeLorean?  Either in text or online.
>
>Thanks,
>Todd
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
>moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
>
>For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
>
>To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>  
>







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Message: 13
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 02:50:36 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andrew Prentis <aprentis_at_dml_rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: PRV Engine Information


Todd,
If it's purely technical specifications you are after
then I recommend you buy a Workshop manual from any of
the vendors.The section on the engine has plenty of
information and diagrams of the engine and the engine
management system.
If you would like a more in depth history of the
engine there a several sites on the Net.Just look it
up on Google.
Cheers,
Andrew
VIN 2883
Australia



		
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Message: 14
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 08:05:45 -0400
From: "michael C. Babb" <mcb_at_dml_babbtechnology.com>
Subject: RE: Interesting new warehouse find...


I had one of the 140 MPH Speedos on my former DeLorean.  I used that in
the hit counter on this page: http://www.babbtechnology.com/index2.htm

There are also a picture of it here:
 
http://www.babbtechnology.com/pics/3472images/inside/cluster1.jpg

Michael

-----Original Message-----
From: James [mailto:james_at_dml_usadmc.com] 
Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2004 2:08 PM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Interesting new warehouse find...




On Friday our warehouse manager came to me and said he found a 140mph
speedometer in the crates of new instrument clusters. Turns out it is
a complete 140mph "Euro-spec" instrument cluster - even has a good,
original trip reset shaft!

There were three different instruments clusters for the DeLorean
(85mph, 140mph and 240kmh) though as I know it, only the 85mph and
240kmh were ever used in production. A handful of the 140mph ones
found their way into the converted RHD cars built by Wooler Hodec for
the original DMC back in the day.

The 140mph clusters are different in other ways than just the speedos,
too. The "LAMBDA" word is missing from the cluster as is the text
"unleaded fuel only" from the fuel gauge. Euro-spec cars would not
have been fitted with catalytic converters or oxygen sensors. The fuel
gauge itself is slightly different, with a red marking as you get in
the low fuel range.

I'll get some pictures up on the website next week of all three types.

We're continuing to look through the crates for more, but odds are
that this one, possibly the last new one in the world, will not be
sold. However, we have recently reproduced a 140 speedometer face, and
are fitting it to recalibrated 85mph speedometers here. The cost is
$199 exchange.

http://www.usadmc.com/dmcstore/BuyNow.asp?PartID=2472&Qty=1

Contact me for more details...

Regards,

James Espey
------------------------------------
DeLorean Motor Company
Vice President
james_at_dml_delorean.com
15023 Eddie Drive
Humble, Texas 77396 USA
tel: 800/872-3621
tel2:281/441-2537
fax: 281/441-2813
http://www.delorean.com
Serving DeLorean owners with parts and service since 1981
------------------------------------










To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
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Message: 15
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 08:36:40 EDT
From: kKoncelik_at_dml_aol.com
Subject: Dispelling rumors of a V8 in the BTTF cars (Bob Gale)


 
I asked Bob Gale about  the engine swap of the engine in the BTTF series and 
here is his response to  that question 
Ken: 
We did soup up the  engines on two of the cars in Part 3 so they would drive 
better across the rough  terrain, but to my recollection, they were always 6 
cylinder engines.  We  used the original engines in Part 1. 
We would have never  changed the engine for the sake of the sound.  The cars 
sound the way they  do because of sound effects which are added in post 
production.  The real  sound of the DMC engine is never heard in any of the movies.  
For those who  have any doubts, watch the movie "Tango and Cash."  One of 
our sound  effects editors worked on that movie after BTTF and he used the BTTF 
Delorean  sound for a special van.  We went ballistic when we found out and 
reamed  the guy, and made sure that sound effect would never be used in any 
other  movie. 
--Bob


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






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Message: 16
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 16:10:42 -0000
From: "ryanpwright" <dmcnews_list_at_dml_ryanwright.com>
Subject: Re: Chevy Engine swap



David,

> I figured I might get someone upset with my comment. 

Nope - I wasn't upset at all. My apologies if you got that impression.

> after that! IMHO the more you deviate from stock (in general) the
> lower the value of the car. Service becomes a major issue as does 
> the quality of the work and the reliability and where do you get 
> the parts and just what kind? 

"In general", I tend to agree. However, there are plenty of exceptions
to this. For example, I just sold an '86 Pontiac Fiero with a
supercharged 3.8l engine swap. Added 80-100hp over stock. I got about
double the blue book value for it - the car had a lot of custom work
and the price reflected that.

Look at these kids and their Hondas... Some of these guys pour tens of
thousands into those things, and while they never get their money back
out of it, they do sell for significantly more than stock. Getting
your import to run the quarter mile in 10 seconds tends to make it
worth quite a bit more than it otherwise would be.

> "chevy engine". You MUST have model, make, and year. Many of the 
> parts will be custom fabricated so now where do you go for them? 
> Some buyers may either not care or realize what they are getting 
> themselves into.

Getting parts is no big deal. When I needed engine parts for the Fiero
I bought them for a '92 Bonneville. Owning a custom vehicle like this
isn't for the faint of heart - if you want something fixed, you
generally have to do it yourself, as most mechanics won't touch it.
When you're already in that mindset re-fabricating broken custom parts
isn't an issue.

Your point on buyers is valid. Custom work, especially major items
like engine swaps, will tend to reduce your target market. This does
not mean it reduces the value of the car. Case in point, with my
Fiero, I literally had dozens and dozens of guys from various forums
emailing me virtual drool. Many begging for trades or a lower price.
The price was simply out of reach of most Fiero shoppers, just as a
$30k+ DeLorean is out of reach of most DeLorean shoppers (let's face
it - most of us went looking with a $15k-$20k budget).

Many buyers also don't have the ability or resources to fix these
things, and that further reduces your market. So yeah, it would be
harder to sell, but with today's virtual marketplaces that situation
is vastly improved. I sold my Fiero on eBay the second time around. A
custom DeLorean with engine enough for a 10 second quarter mile would
fetch a hefty price.

As you can tell I've got no problem with engine swaps. In fact I
prefer them when they're done right. If my PRV ever dies, and assuming
I have a month to dedicate to a big project, I'll almost certainly
shoot for a 400hp+ swap. Why, because I can.

-Ryan








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Message: 17
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 16:39:42 -0000
From: "ryanpwright" <dmcnews_list_at_dml_ryanwright.com>
Subject: Re: Chevy Engine swap



Joe,

> I'm all for better modifications to the Delorean, but when people 
> start basically ripping it apart to make it something it isn't. 
> Basically a chevrolet engine, porsche tranny, then specialized 
> plumbing & electricals to make it work, plus all the custom 
> fabrications needed to make it all work, then it isn't really a 
> Delorean anymore.
> 
> Makes for a fun maintenance & upkeep for anyone who inherits or buys 
> a vehicle like this.
> 
> Rich, the scale of vehicles you just mentioned, best scenario to 
> worst, sounds about right for modded cars. I'm not just for 
> Deloreans that have been stripped of the systems that make them a 
> Delorean. 

Again, I must disagree. The systems that make a DeLorean aren't the
goodies under the hood. It's the recognizable stuff. The body, the
doors, the interior, etc. 

For example... Replace everything under the body, drive it anywhere
and people will still say, "Oh look, a DeLorean!" If it's not really a
DeLorean anymore, how come everyone who sees it still recognizes it as
such? This "not a DeLorean" idea is a very tiny minority. The DMV
still says it's a DeLorean, as does your insurance company and
everyone you would ever meet on the street. I'd say that makes it a
DeLorean.

> Just imagine if your car had a chevy vortec engine, a custom 
> transmission, it's own fuel delivery & plumbing setup, how useful 
> would the DML have been then? 

Plenty useful. I could still ask questions relating to the brakes, the
body, interior, doors, seals, glass, most heating & A/C components,
the mode switch, the louvers, audio systems, etc. Need I go on? 

If I've got the ability to drop in a custom engine, tranny, etc, do
you think I need the DML's help in that area? I ask questions about
the PRV because I'm unfamilar with it. If I tore it out and dropped in
a Chevy engine, I wouldn't have to ask questions about that part of
the car. If I paid someone to do this work for me, then I'd go to him
for support. Really, I don't see this as being an issue unless you
bought the car that way and have no idea how the swap was done.

> That is my main beef when people 
> mainly cutomize or butcher just for a minimal speed gain. It is a 
> touring car, and for people that realize that, then this is the car 
> for them, for some it isn't.

Woah - minimal speed gain? A proper engine swap can take this car to
60mph in the 3 second range. I've seen Fieros that run the quarter
mile in under 9 seconds, and the same could easily be done to a
DeLorean. I wouldn't call being able to smoke any car on the road,
Lamborghinis and Ferraris included, a "minimal speed gain".

Even a regular old V8 would drop your 0-60 times down to 5 seconds.
Still not "minimal". 

> repairs & fixes are great. Maybe I gave the wrong impression when I 
> made the first post, the main point was for people not to destroy 
> the car just for a faster 0-60 time, or a faster street drag.

To you the car is destroyed. To me, it's reborn. A stock DeLorean is
slow as molasses. My SUV has better acceleration. Building a custom
DeLorean with the power to suit it's looks is not destruction, it's an
improvement.

But then, I don't see my car as an investment. It's a toy. Something
fun to drive around in - so fun, in fact, that it's my daily driver.
If it was worth $0 today I wouldn't care, because I don't intend to
sell it. I keep it parked in the garage and I baby it, but only for
the purpose of it's lasting for many years to come - not to keep it's
value high. If it were faster, it would just be that much more fun to me.

Besides - if someone swaps out his PRV, that's good for the rest of
you. He won't be needing any of the PRV's parts, leaving more for
everyone else, and a few people might get a great deal on a used
engine, transmission, or other engine component.

-Ryan








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Message: 18
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 11:47:07 -0000
From: "vtdmc" <wmack_at_dml_vt.edu>
Subject: Battery Light, RPM movement





I have noticed recently that while I am driving normally, not sporty 
or pushing the car, every once in a while my battery light will 
flicker and as it does my rpm gauge jumps 500-750 rpms and returns 
back to normal when the battery light goes off.  The strange thing is 
I don't feel any sort of rpm change in the car.  It does not speed up 
or buck, it acts as if nothing is happening with the rpms.

Has anyone seen or heard of this before?

Thanks
Willie Mack









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Message: 19
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 17:15:58 -0000
From: "ryanpwright" <dmcnews_list_at_dml_ryanwright.com>
Subject: Re: Chevy Engine swap



--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Joe OBrien" <joeyoseppijoe_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> 
> The rotary barly sold for just over 16k, it sold to someone who 
> didn't realize all the custom work done to it for 32k, then he/she 
> backed out. The it was on eBay a few more times before hittin the 
> max sum of 16K. That car had only been for sale for the short time 
> of almost 2 years before it sold on eBay for half of what was 
> invested in the car. 

That's surprising. There must have been something wrong with the swap,
then. I know half a dozen people who would have snatched that up in a
heartbeat for $16k, myself included, if it was really as nice as it
appeared to be.

> Mainly that was the point of warning for most, as it will be next to 
> impossible to recoup the investment, and your car will be less than 
> what is was. But to each his own literally. The main point was if 
> you want something to drag race, buy something else.

Wanting gobs of extra power & wanting to drag race are two different
things. I never drag raced my supercharged Fiero in 3 years of
ownership, but it was nice being able to pass someone on the freeway
in the blink of an eye. Passing in the DeLorean can be a scary
proposition... You need a good long stretch of visible road to safely
get around someone.

As for the investment, virtually no cars recoup that. It's doubtful
you could get anywhere near what you've spent on your DeLorean over
the years if you sold it today. I could easily sink forty grand into a
custom DeLorean without even being extravagent. I might get thirty for
it if marketed to the right people. So no, I wouldn't recoup my
investment, but you know what? It'd still sell for an awful lot more
than your stock DeLorean. That's a far cry from being a "destroyed" car.

The BTTF conversions also fetch a significant premium over stock when
they're done well. Are these destroyed? Honestly, to me such a car
would be worthless. I'd never buy it. But I'm not naive enough to
think it's destroyed and has no value. People pay good money for them.

> The only people who would be buying custom Deloreans so altered from 
> their original state for prices like that are people who know 
> nothing about the car, the kind most people dream about selling a 

I guess I know nothing about DeLoreans, then. Funny, since I've got a
multi-page list of work I've personally done to the car, including
some jobs most owners wouldn't attempt themselves (such as last
month's clutch replacement).

Joe, I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this issue. I don't
expect I'll change your mind; my main reason for replying was in hopes
that you'd be able to see my point of view. A lot of generalization
and false information has been thrown about on this issue and I had to
speak up.

My closing thoughts are thus: If you still think a custom DeLorean is
"destroyed", you should go to a car show some day and check out the
custom hot rods. About the only thing stock on these cars is the body.
I saw a '32 Ford 3-Window Coupe with custom leather, LCD displays in
the dash, and a big monster engine, not to mention the countless other
upgrades. One of the most beautiful cars I've ever seen, and there
were a hundred others with equal amounts of custom work. Tell these
guys they've "destroyed" their cars, or for that matter the crowds
drooling over them. You won't get a lot of sympathy.

-Ryan








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Message: 20
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 17:46:40 -0000
From: "d_rex_2002" <rich_at_dml_outernet-tech.net>
Subject: Re: Chevy Engine swap



For those of you new to the list and to the "regulars", I thought
I would once again mention that the 4x4, both hovercrafts and the
convertible were built from salvage cars and all less than perfect
SS panels. I have a re-powered Delorean with an '84 Buick Turbo V6
Grand National engine in it, and like the Delorean 4x4, I purchased
it as a non-running project already in progress.

The Grand National conversion is a bolt-in conversion that could be
reversed and almost all the SS panels on my project Deloreans could
be transplanted to other Delorean if the population of the Delorean
ever falls to only a few hundred or a few dozen examples left.

Unlike the MG built hovercraft, there are no plans for any of my
personal Delorean projects to be damaged or destroyed, and just for
the record, I think Josh is still ahead of MG destroying Deloreans.
(LOL)  Sorry Josh, just kidding.

Later,
Rich W.

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "darryl" <darryl_at_dml_t...> wrote:
> 
> snip <
>
 There are just too few of them to be replacing the engines, or 
chopping them up into hovercrafts, 4X4s, etc.  Just my opinion - 
it's every owner's right to do with them as they please.
> 
> snip <
> 
> Darryl T.
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








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Message: 21
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 18:13:08 -0000
From: "John Rydholm" <ebondefender_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Thoughts on brakes



Hello everyone,
I've been shopping around for brake pads for my own DeLorean and 
wondered what others thought were a good brand/type. I could always 
go the OEM route or through pjgrady.com. Given the fact that I can't 
actually take it to a "Bob's brakes and donuts" kind of place, what 
are your opinions? Thanks, all! -John
PS: So far I believe it's just the pads, due to the slight squeeeaak 
I get when I slow down. But just for the heck of it, go ahead and 
throw calipers into the topic if you want.








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Message: 22
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 18:02:05 -0000
From: "John Rydholm" <ebondefender_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: New member here



Good to know you too! I've been a member of this group for a while, 
but only recently purchased my DMC-12. These people are a great bunch 
and help me out a lot with info and stuff. Welcome aboard :)
---John (DeLorean enthusiast/owner, college student, mediocre-car-
knowledge-kinda-guy, and master Daewoo flipper survivalist)
*Don't ask!*
PS: yes everyone, I really did flip a Daewoo. it was scary!

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, <maple80_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> 
> Hope to get to know you all. I will try to contribute to the 
discussion with my thoughts, knowledge, and opinions.








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Message: 23
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 14:55:23 -0500
From: Jeff Phillips <rvparty_at_dml_gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Battery Light, RPM movement


I've had a similar problem with mine as well.  Try this, start the
engine and open the engine cover.  While reving the engine wiggle the
wire loom that goes to the alternator.  See if you can reproduce the
problem.  If so likely that you simply have a loose connection or
ground some where in the loom.  From there its just a troubleshooting
task to locate exactly where.  I've found a short somewhere going to
my alt that causes the Battery light to come on, it would only do it
at certain RPMs and then later when I hit bumps which clued me on to
it being a loose wire.  I haven't located it becase everything is
securely attached to the alt, so I think its in the loom.  For the
time being I've moved the loom and the problem has gone away!  :) 
Can't wait until it comes back!

Jeff
#10544


On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 11:47:07 -0000, vtdmc <wmack_at_dml_vt.edu> wrote:
> 
> 
> I have noticed recently that while I am driving normally, not sporty
> or pushing the car, every once in a while my battery light will
> flicker and as it does my rpm gauge jumps 500-750 rpms and returns
> back to normal when the battery light goes off.  The strange thing is
> I don't feel any sort of rpm change in the car.  It does not speed up
> or buck, it acts as if nothing is happening with the rpms.
> 
> Has anyone seen or heard of this before?
> 
> Thanks
> Willie Mack
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
>





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Message: 24
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 12:30:29 -0700
From: "Owen _at_dml_ Aerodrome" <owen_at_dml_aerodrome.us>
Subject: Re: Emissions in CA


You'll probably need to take it to one of the referee smog check stations -- they'll do something to reclassify it based on the new engine, but frankly I doubt there's anyway it'll pass without the right emissions gear.

Do something about it anyway, because I sure hate driving behind all those old gas guzzler Mustangs and pickups and what-not that _stink_.  :-P

-Owen



Dani B wrote:
> 
> 
> To you guys who live in CA...I'm in NY right now and by doing an
> engine swap I wouldn't have any problems with inspecting. The problem
> is-I'm going to be living in Sacramento next August..So if I have a
> swapped engine with no emissions, I would have to get a cat converter
> if to pass right? If its going to be a problem with a swapped engine
> in CA, then I'm not even going to bother with swapping. Yet another
> DeLorean to be in CA eventually -Dani B. #5003
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 






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Message: 25
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 20:28:49 -0000
From: "thebrave65" <johnnysher1_at_dml_cox.net>
Subject: Re: Thoughts on brakes



I went with OEM and they work fine.  You might want to check your 
rotors for glazing.  If you can see your reflection in the rotor, 
they are probably what's causing the squeaking.

Case in point: I rebuilt my entire brake system but didn't have the 
rear rotors turned like I did the front.  Now the rear brakes squeal 
with new pads.

Johnny
5518

> 
> Hello everyone,
> I've been shopping around for brake pads for my own DeLorean and 
> wondered what others thought were a good brand/type. I could always 
> go the OEM route or through pjgrady.com. Given the fact that I 
can't 
> actually take it to a "Bob's brakes and donuts" kind of place, what 
> are your opinions? Thanks, all! -John
> PS: So far I believe it's just the pads, due to the slight 
squeeeaak 
> I get when I slow down. But just for the heck of it, go ahead and 
> throw calipers into the topic if you want.








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Message: 26
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 12:05:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Dick Ryan <deloreanbiker_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Engine Weight


For a list of engine weights, including the PRV used
in the DeLorean, go to
<www.team.net/sol/tech/engine.html>.

If you are considering an engine swap, some of these
numbers may surprise you.

Dick Ryan
VIN 16867


		
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