From: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
To: <dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 2280
Date: Sunday, October 17, 2004 7:12 AM


There are 23 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. RE: Protecting the DMC Name
From: "Dan RC30" <danrc30_at_dml_hotmail.com>

2. Brown Leather in a DeLorean
From: "Tom Porter" <treehouse2000us_at_dml_yahoo.com>

3. "use of the DMC logo"
From: Holler <thehauntfactory_at_dml_att.net>

4. Re: The Trailing Arm Bolt Saga
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>

5. Re: Buying Car Parts On eBay
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

6. Re: PDC's Redesigned Trailing Arm Attachment
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>

7. Re: DMC Logo
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>

8. RE: What is a "proper vendor" (was: Dashes and Binnacles (reproductions))
From: "Gary Hull" <Specialty_at_dml_IN2TIME.com>

9. Re: Trademarks, and DMCH
From: "malevy_nj" <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>

10. #1 cylinder update
From: S E Ableman <s.ableman_at_dml_worldnet.att.net>

11. Re: Protecting the DMC Name
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_charter.net>

12. Beck Arnley Sale Parts
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_verizon.net>

13. Re: The Trailing Arm Bolt Saga
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_charter.net>

14. Re: Changing oil question
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_charter.net>

15. Re: Re: indicator panel (was: Delorean rear view camera)
From: Jan van de Wouw <delorean_at_dml_home.nl>

16. Delorean in Hemmings Classic Car Magazine
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>

17. Re: The Trailing Arm Bolt Saga
From: "spaceace3113" <spaceace3113_at_dml_yahoo.com>

18. Re: Trailing Arm Bolt Removal
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>

19. Re: Changing oil question
From: DMCVIN6683 <dmcvin6683_at_dml_wi.rr.com>

20. Re: PDC's Redesigned Trailing Arm Attachment
From: tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com

21. Trailing Arm Bolt Maintenance
From: tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com

22. DeLorean in Sydney Newspaper
From: Andrew Prentis <aprentis_at_dml_rocketmail.com>

23. Delorean in North Carolina
From: "ashtonorlan" <ashtonorlan_at_dml_yahoo.com>





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 15:37:01 -1000
From: "Dan RC30" <danrc30_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Protecting the DMC Name


I'm going to single out this comment from the paragraph below... "the only 
possible outcome is destruction and irresponsible use.  I would consider 
that a tragedy."

A "tragedy"? "destruction"? Oh please... people... it's just a car!!! 
Everyone... just shut up and drive it already!!!

---Evil Dan (ABB)





Message: 21
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 16:17:56 -0400
From: Mike Substelny <msubstel_at_dml_lorainccc.edu>
Subject: Protecting the DMC Name


Marc Levy speculated about the motivation for protecting the DMC name:

>With all that said, each time this topic comes up I
>again think about why it even matters..  The same
>conclusion every time, it boils down to greed on the
>part of DMCH.
>
With all due respect, protecting the DMC name, logo, and image MATTER
VERY MUCH TO ME as a DeLorean owner.

What could be more important to the community of DeLorean enthusiasts
than protecting the DMC name and logo?  Anyone familiar with the
DeLorean saga knows that parts, hardware, even body dies can be remade,
but a reputation is destroyed forever.

I want to see someone, anyone, protect the DMC name and logo.  But
regardless of who offers it or the legal strength supporting it, I
cannot imagine anything more dangerous to our community than these
constant and unrelenting attacks on this protection.  These assaults
cannot possibly lead to any enhancement in prestige or responsible use
of the name and logo, the only possible outcome is destruction and
irresponsible use.  I would consider that a tragedy.

I have tried to rationalize the motivation behind this belligerence
toward something so important to all of us, but I cannot reach a certain
answer.  Because I am a moderator on this list as well as a concerned
DeLorean owner, I shall politely refrain from the sort of defamatory
speculation  I quoted in the opening of this message.

Mike Substelny
VIN 1280, 10 years

_________________________________________________________________
Check out Election 2004 for up-to-date election news, plus voter tools and 
more! http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 2
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 01:41:47 -0000
From: "Tom Porter" <treehouse2000us_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Brown Leather in a DeLorean



Just catching up on posts.. I think this fell through the cracks 
somewhere in all the mess of ownership of the DMC logo and such.  I 
couldnt get the link to work, but unless its custom seats an owner 
put into it, its probley from an early prototype.  At least one, or 
possibly a couple prototyes pre-dating Jan 1981 had brown leather 
interior, most likely the earliest models from the late 1970's.  This 
can be seen in a couple of 70's Mags.  Of course other things like 
bus sliding windows, fiberglass facias, completely computerized dash, 
airbag (or mock up of one) along with countless other changes.  FYI.

PS.. unless its one of the gold DeLoreans... they had factory 
interior, only dyed brown.  Couldnt tell with a non-working link.








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 3
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 21:58:56 -0400
From: Holler <thehauntfactory_at_dml_att.net>
Subject: "use of the DMC logo"


It is my understanding that if you have a trademark (or copyright), it
is the owners RESPONSIBILITY to protect it.
If the owner fails to acknowledge it's unauthorized use by others,
without sending some sort of letter asking them to stop, the owner loses
their rights!
(I'm sure a lawyer could word this much better.)
In my opinion, if DMCH even remotely thinks they might own the logo, it
is their responsibility to actively safe guard it.  (So don't take cease
and desist letters too personally.  Any logo owner is required to be
diligent about this.  
Yes, ownership (of anything!) can be a big pain to keep up with!
I personally like the idea of someone owning the logo.  (As long as the
owner would never passively allow it to be used to hurt the reputation
of our cars, like permitting DM-Cocaine tshirts, etc. to by
manufactured, for example.)
What's to object with, #1.Asking permission?  #2.Paying a licensing fee?

Just my opinion. No legal experience, but I do love my DeLorean!:)
Oliver Holler
VIN#10694





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 02:45:55 -0000
From: "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_webspan.net>
Subject: Re: The Trailing Arm Bolt Saga



I submit that if your trailing arm bolt is bent AT ALL you should
consider changing it. Under normal use it should not bend ever unless
it has been subjected to an overstress or it has fatigued to near the
point of failure. The trailing arm bolts cannot be properly inspected
visually if they are not bent. You cannot see how many stress cycles
it has been subjected to by looking at it. It is also difficult to
tell if it is bent unless you at least loosen the nut and attempt to
rotate the bolt and see if it is bent. Since you say you already have
a replacement set then the smart thing to do is just replace them and
forget about it. Cheap insurance for peace-of-mind. Knocking (or
clunking) can come from many sources. The jack and lug wrench could be
sliding around in the compartment, a body bolt can be loose, stuff in
the boot (trunk) can be shifting, a rear bearing can move, the C/V
joints may need to be cleaned and lubricated. The last item is the
most common for a clunking in the rear. Check the line pressure on the
trans. If it is too high it can cause hard shifts. Make sure the
vacuum modulater is hooked up, the vacuum line is not leaking, and the
modulater isn't stuck. Hard shifts are better than soft shifts but if
they are too hard you can overstress the mechanicals inside. Soft
shifts prematurely wear out the clutch packs. I like firm (not hard)
shifts. It shouldn't feel wishy-washy, you should definately know and
feel the shifts. From your description of the problems you have had
none seem to be too unusual. 
David Teitelbaum
vin 10757


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "artbywarren" <artbywarren_at_dml_y...> wrote:
> 
> 
> I happened to see some discussion on the subject of TAB's within the 
> last couple of days, and I'd like to pose my own questions about them.
> First And Foremost!.. when I give these examples, I'm only relaying 
> facts. I am not saying anything good or bad about the people involved 
> or the advice they gave me. Again, I'm only relaying what happened. 
> 
> OK... herewego..
> 
> 








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 5
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 03:07:53 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: Buying Car Parts On eBay



Buying car parts (or complete vehicles for that matter) on eBay is not
for the faint of heart. There are potential pitfalls. For example, PRV
water pumps come in both "right handed" and "left handed" versions,
both of which bolt up to the block identically but only one of which
will mate to a stock DeLo internal water pipe. Technical advice after
the sale is of course non-existent. And caveat emptor is the rule of
the day.

If you're mechanically inclined, are some real bargains to be had.

Otherwise, buying from a DeLo specific vendor may be your wisest
course of action.

FWIW: John Hervey is my vendor of choice. Are quite a few parts I buy
from him exclusively.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_s...> wrote:
> 
> Ryan, All vendors my be over $250.00 but since by the recent
definition by
> James Epsey of what a proper vendor is, then I'm a Delorean parts
supplier.
> I sell the new compressor for $219.95 with a new clutch or and if
you want
> just the clutch it's $59.95.
> John Hervey
> www.specialtauto.com
> Delorean parts supplier.
> 









________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 03:21:01 -0000
From: "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_carolina.net>
Subject: Re: PDC's Redesigned Trailing Arm Attachment



Have you studied Bryan Pearce's redesigned trailing arm attachment
(ball joint)? Infinitely superior to the Lotus design. And it's so
simple and inexpensive that one has to wonder what Lotus was thinking
of with stationary lateral bolts. They could have saved us all a lot
of trouble by engineering the trailing arms properly to begin with.

Bill Robertson
#5939

>--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, tobyp_at_dml_k... wrote:
> 
> 
> Hello List - I wanted to make two comments on this thread, so please 
> bear with me.  When I decided to commission the first batch of TOBY-
> TAB's, somebody put together a poll on this very list to find out 
> what the "fleet experience" was with the trailing arm bolts.  In 
> round figures, one third of those responding had found bent, 
> corroded, or broken TAB's at some point; one third had looked and 
> found nothing amiss, but said that they were continuing to inspect 
> these joints (this is a good thing, regardless of what type of bolt 
> you have); and one third had no idea what we were talking about, and 
> didn'y really care.  As I said back then, it's the one third that 
> didn't (and still doesn't) have a clue that *really* bothers me.
> 
> The second comment is in response to Joe's note - I just thought that 
> I would point out that there should be no rotation of the bolt in the 
> trailing arm when everything is torqued up.  This is a very common 
> misconception of the function of this joint.  All rotation in this 
> joint should be in the rubber part of the rubber bushing, with all of 
> the individual components in the stack-up stationary relative to one 
> another.  There is a tendency in the fleet to find the sleeve in the 
> rubber bushing disbonded from the rubber, which then allows the 
> rotation to occur between the sleeve and the rubber.  However, the 
> design was originally supposed to have all rotation in the rubber 
> only.  I just wanted to clarify this point, because this illustrates, 
> in part, why there should be weight on the suspension before final 
> torqueing of the bolts ... to set the rubber bushing in the rest 
> position prior to locking it down through the joint clamp-up.  The 
> anti-seize compound is crucial for protecting the steel trailing arm 
> and sleeve from further corrosion inside.  However, since the TOBY-
> TAB's are made from Inconel, they are impervious to corrosion.  
> Okay ... I am done with my lecture for today, although I can very 
> easily get wound up about that last one third of the fleet.
> 
> Toby Peterson  VIN 2248 "Winged1"
> DeLorean Parts Northwest, LLC
> www.delorean-parts.com
> 









________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 7
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 20:27:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Marc Levy <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: DMC Logo


Use of the DMC Logo did pre-date the DMCH
registration, yet the trademark office accepted it.

As you point out, the claim would need to be
challenged in court.  Given evidence that the use pre
dates the registration, it would then fail..  Which
was the point of what I wrote.

I do believe my information is correct.  I further
think you have said essentially the same thing I did.


--- Peter Lucas <lucas_at_dml_Maya.com> wrote:
<SNIP>
> 
> >  It is
> > difficult if not impossible to enforce a trademark
> > registration when the logo use predates the
> > registration.
> 
> This isn't correct.  As documented above,
> registration isn't required 
> at all, much less prior to use.  Indeed, proof of
> prior use is 
> necessary for a full registration.  It is true that
> if somebody *else* 
> is actively using a mark at the time you attempt to
> register, you will 
> likely not succeed.
<SNIP>



		
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 8
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 22:49:00 -0700
From: "Gary Hull" <Specialty_at_dml_IN2TIME.com>
Subject: RE: What is a "proper vendor" (was: Dashes and Binnacles (reproductions))


James and List,

Please take this as it is intended - as honest feedback.

Personally, I disagree with the apparent DMC-T decision to cut off specific
vendors - supposedly because they don't have a "dealer-like" business -
rather than setting up reasonable wholesale prices based on volume. But it
seems to be their decision to make - for better or worse.

However what really upsets me is DMC-T's arrogance and lack of ethics in
essentially calling specific vendors "Improper" - by referring to selected
vendors as "Proper". 

There is more than enough hate and discontent on this list without adding
fuel to the fire by using this term on a regular basis.

Please be honest and just refer to DMC-T's chosen "dealer-like" vendors as
DMC-T's "Selected Vendors".

Thanks,

Gary
IN2TIME







________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 12:26:49 -0000
From: "malevy_nj" <malevy_nj_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Trademarks, and DMCH



I believe he has alienated a significant segment of the market.  But 
having a monopoly on the parts inventory gives DMCH the ability to 
strong arm anyone who owns a DeLorean (even if it is by proxy through 
another vendor).

DMCH has taken plenty of opportunity to fill the needs of DeLorean 
owners in a responsible and reasonable way, and they have plenty of 
opportunity in the future to continue to do that all adding to the 
legitimate profit they earn.  That is good business.  I never said I 
had a problem with any vendor making money, so please do not put 
words in my mouth.

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "gullwingmagazine" 
<SNIP>
> DMCH is in business to make money, and if Stephen Wynnw is worth a 
> darn as a businessman, he is in business to make as much as he can 
> without alienating his market.  If you don't like a vendor making 
> money, don't buy from them.  
<SNIP>








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 09:31:35 -0400
From: S E Ableman <s.ableman_at_dml_worldnet.att.net>
Subject: #1 cylinder update


Dear List,

    In the past, I stated that #1 cylinder would carbon up so bad that 
it would no longer fire and raw gas would get into the crankcase. I had 
a chance to spend a few hours working on it. I did several things all in 
the same time frame. First I changed the oil & filter for the 3rd time 
in 50 miles. I wanted to make sure I didn't have gas in the oil. I also 
added RXP to the gas, an additive to remove carbon deposits. I also 
bought a new set of plug wires and replaced the one for # 1 cylinder, ( 
it was the only one with a problem ). Even thought I made several checks 
to test the wire, several of you suggested I replace it, and because of 
all the pulling , twisting and such that I did to it, there was some 
question as to its integrity. I also swapped the #1 injector with #2.  I 
drove the car for 30 minutes on the interstate at 65 MPH and in 4th 
gear. Then I returned home and checked the plugs, #1 has a nice white 
color to the porcelain, it has a light amount of carbon on the plug. A 
slight touch with my little finger takes it off. Prior to this test, the 
carbon was so bad that soot would ball up on the plug. All other plugs 
looked normal. I checked the dip stick and could not smell any gas 
present. I hope this is the fix, I'll know more after longer running. I 
think the problem was the plug wire all along. High voltage breakdown 
would be my guess. No amount of testing beats replacement.
    Thanks to all for your suggestions.

Steve






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 07:04:09 -0700
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_charter.net>
Subject: Re: Protecting the DMC Name


I have hesitated to enter the Logo thread as mine is NOT a popular view.  I
think this all is blown completely out of proportion!!   We DeLorean owners
have a marque that sure does not include very many members.   IF this
discussion were about a company with a few million cars built like GM or
Ford it might be different.  Why even bother worrying about who has what?
All this pontification about the D Logo is making me want to throw up!  The
subject/thread should have been dropped weeks ago in my opinion.  I KNOW all
the reasons so don't throw them at me again please!!  I delete all the
entrees that say Logo without reading.
Murray
Vin: 05962
Lic:  DMC-XII






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 12
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 10:14:15 -0400
From: "Dave Sontos" <dsontos_at_dml_verizon.net>
Subject: Beck Arnley Sale Parts


There is a closeout sale on some Beck Arnley parts at
http://www.sherco-auto.com/beck.htm

 

I'm not sure if any of them are ours but the prices looked good.

 

Dave Sontos

Vin 02573



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 13
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 07:17:50 -0700
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_charter.net>
Subject: Re: The Trailing Arm Bolt Saga


WEll, I have had your same experience pretty much re the TA Bolts.  Like
you, I was concerned when I read all the horror stories so decided just
arbitrarily have them replaced.  I got the Toby bolts and when the mechanic
took out the old ones I watched every move he made.  He took the old ones
out and they were perfect....no sign of any distress and we checked them for
any bends and they had zero.  He and I both could see there was reallly no
need to replace them,but for "good measure" he did anyway.  Total cost with
his labor was $200!  This is an automatic car so more problems getting that
one bolt out....he called Toby and did what he suggested...just cut the old
bolt in two on the one side and reinserted the new one from the other
direction.  Easy.     As far as I am concerned, I am glad I had it done and
watched the process.  My mind is at ease now......I guess I should say that
probably one of the contributing factors in the condition of the bolts is
that when I got the car it had 3K miles on it and now has 8K and they have
been very easy miles, by a little old 83 year old guy!!
Murray
Vin: 05962
Lic:  DMC-XII
8 years






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 14
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 07:25:25 -0700
From: "Murray Fisher" <murrayfw_at_dml_charter.net>
Subject: Re: Changing oil question


Anyone that can afford a 50K DeLorean can afford a ten dollar Snap On
adapter to fit the oil drain plug!!

Murray
Vin: 05962
Lic: DMC-XII
8 years






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 15
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 17:53:53 +0200
From: Jan van de Wouw <delorean_at_dml_home.nl>
Subject: Re: Re: indicator panel (was: Delorean rear view camera)


On Mon, 11 Oct 2004 22:23:04 -0000, "James" <james_at_dml_usadmc.com> wrote:

> I like the small LCD, and it makes me wonder if something
> similar could be done to fill the hole next to the rheostat
> left when the clock is removed. Because of the location, angle
> and small size, probably wouldn't be much good as a backup camera.
> But I remember Jan Van De Wouw did a neat indicator panel there
> showing cooling fans, etc. Hopefully he will chime in on that.

Yes, it was me who did that:

<http://members.home.nl/delorean/monitor/>

It shows power to the Fuel Pump, Power to the AC-clutch,
both Fans getting power (showing my Fan Zilla cycling),
the Otterstat coming on and it indicates the status of my Alarm.

Since my first release of pictures I have rebuilt (parts of)
this system 4 times, being on revision 7 or 8 as it stands...
The clock really isn't usefull becuase of position and deviation
of about 5 minutes per week (on mine at least), this I CAN use...

It's helped me diagnose some trouble with my RPM-relay so far
that would have been tricky to diagnose elsewise, since I didn't
have anything to do electrical tests with me then...

The succes on my DeLorean has even inspired me to work on
something similar on my regular car, but insteda of making
the panel myself, I'm using unused indicator-positions on
my retrofitted digital dash for that...

Any questions are welcome, but I will NOT sell them...

JAN van de Wouw

Thinking Different...   Using a Mac...
Living the Dream...   Driving a DeLorean...

#05141 "Dagger" since Sept. 2000
--------------------------------






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 16
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 16:29:06 -0000
From: "erikgeerdink" <erikgeerdink_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Delorean in Hemmings Classic Car Magazine



While at Barnes and Noble I picked up Hemmings Classic Car Nov.#2  

On page 86 is an article about a guy named Marvin Tamaroff who has 
quite the collection of classic cars.  One is an 81 Delorean with a 
picture of it.  He states the car only has 80 miles on it.  Pretty 
good article too.  There is a segment in there about how he got the 
Delorean.  He was an initial investor in the company back in 1977.  
He plunked down the $25000 for the rights.  In his collection is his 
stock certificate along with a Delorean dealership sign.  
One interesting thing about his Delorean is that he states its an 81, 
but it clearly has an 83 hood on it (badge and flat hood).  WIth 80 
miles I wouldn't think he would have replaced his hood.  Hmmm.
Turns out this guy lives in Southfield, MI.  pretty close to where I 
live.  I might look him up and take a visit to his collection if he 
would have me.  I'll let you know.

Erik Geerdink
04512








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 17
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 21:22:26 -0000
From: "spaceace3113" <spaceace3113_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: The Trailing Arm Bolt Saga




Generally speaking, I would do whatever Rob suggests. I have nothing 
but the best to say about the man,if it concerns you, just bite the 
bullet send the car to Rob for the winter and address the bolts and 
whatever other issues you might have. Finances permitting of course, 
otherwise maybe just have the other guys change them. Word to the 
wise though, Never ever ignore Robs advice, the man is a saint and 
probably the best thing that ever happened to the Delorean 
community. Just my two bits

Harry Vin #2696








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 18
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 23:15:25 -0000
From: "cruznmd" <racuti1_at_dml_delorean.com>
Subject: Re: Trailing Arm Bolt Removal



I realize that this thread is getting long so I'll keep my .02 short:

Speaking as a guy who snapped a trailing arm bolt at only 40 mph, if 
you "don't care" about and have never inspected these bolts you are 
literally living on borrowed time.

I was decelerating and had my foot poised above the brake pedal when 
mine snapped. That's the -only- thing that kept the car from 
flipping over. The car whip-sawed so violently, that I pulled a 
muscle in my back.

There won't be any warning when it snaps people.

Rich A.
#5335
--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, Noah <sitz_at_dml_o...> wrote:
> 
> On Fri, Oct 15, 2004 at 02:27:06PM -0000, David Teitelbaum wrote:
>  
> > It turns out the bolt would turn inside the bushing but it was 
SOLID
> > in the trailing arm. The shop was very surprised when it took 20 
TONS
> > to break it loose and get it out of the trailing arm. It turns 
out
> > also that the bolt was bent by the head and corroded inside the
> > trailing arm. 
> 
> 
> Just for the sake of illustration, any chance of pics of the bad
> bolts?
> 
> > This would have caused electrical problems. Most owners
> > have never seen the underside of their cars but everything under 
there
> > is VERY IMPORTANT. 
> 
> I agree completely; my car "looked" fine, but I went out and bought
> tobytabs regardless, just for peace of mind. Low and behold, the
> driver-side bolt was bent (not much; was able to pry it out with a 
LOT
> of leverage and a little blood/swearing). 
> 
> 
> --noah
> #2867
> 
> -- 
> <huey> dd of=/dev/fd0 if=/dev/flippy bs=1024
> <huey> ^^^ Making Flippy Floppy








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 19
Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 22:13:52 -0500
From: DMCVIN6683 <dmcvin6683_at_dml_wi.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Changing oil question


Well i dont have a $50,000 Delorean and i think there are only a few 
who do own one.

Mark V


On Saturday, October 16, 2004, at 09:25  AM, Murray Fisher wrote:

>
>
> Anyone that can afford a 50K DeLorean can afford a ten dollar Snap On
> adapter to fit the oil drain plug!!
>
> Murray
> Vin: 05962
> Lic: DMC-XII
> 8 years






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 20
Date: Sun, 17 Oct 2004 05:16:09 -0000
From: tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com
Subject: Re: PDC's Redesigned Trailing Arm Attachment



Bill and List - Yes, I have studied the PDC design, and it is much 
more robust, as you suggest.  The key with his design is to load up 
the bolt in double shear, which means that both ends are supported, 
and the load is applied in the middle.  This essentially doubles the 
amount of load that can be carried for a given amount of bending 
stress.  Or, put another way, for a given load, it cuts the bending 
stresses in half.  (Note to you purists out there - the numbers 
actually vary a little from that, but I'm talking in round figures 
here) There are a couple of design details that I would do a little 
differently that Pearce, based on my experience with high-
performance jet aircraft structural design, but his configuration is 
much better than the stock DeLorean.  Tell me ... what is the 
perceived demand for a retrofit kit to convert the average DeLorean 
to a similar more robust design, without changing the entire frame?  
This can be done, but it would be quite a bit more expensive than 
simply replacing the bolts.  That was the main reason that I went 
that way ... to make some kind of solution practical to the typical 
DeLorean owner.  I would be interested in getting some feedback on 
that question.  Keep the shiny side up!

Toby Peterson  VIN 2248 "Winged1"
DeLorean Parts Northwest, LLC
www.delorean-parts.com  


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "content22207" <brobertson_at_dml_c...> 
wrote:
> Have you studied Bryan Pearce's redesigned trailing arm attachment
> (ball joint)? Infinitely superior to the Lotus design. And it's so
> simple and inexpensive that one has to wonder what Lotus was 
thinking of with stationary lateral bolts. They could have saved us 
all a lot of trouble by engineering the trailing arms properly to 
begin with.
> 
> Bill Robertson
> #5939









________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 21
Date: Sun, 17 Oct 2004 05:32:03 -0000
From: tobyp_at_dml_katewwdb.com
Subject: Trailing Arm Bolt Maintenance



Hi Gang - I wanted to bring out a good point that was shared with me 
in an email message off-list.  The typical DeLorean owner has heard 
that they should check the torque on the TAB's on a semi-regular 
basis.  This is an excellent practice, but it doesn't go quite far 
enough, as illustrated by David T.'s story of his corroded and 
seized TAB.  The point that was brought up to me is that a simple 
torque check will not show a seized bolt, but will only check for 
the tightness of the nut.  If the bolt is corroded and seized in 
place, there is a very real possibility of inadequate clamp-up in 
the joint, which is why the bolts are torqued in the first place.  
The proper maintenance steps are to loosen the nut, spin the bolt to 
verify straightness and freedom to spin, check all elements in the 
joint for condition (flat washers, shims, rubber bushings, and 
bushing retainer plate and attachment bolts), and then retorque the 
bolt if all is found in acceptable condition.  I am going to suggest 
that everybody do these things, even if they have TOBY-TAB's 
installed, so that the condition of all the other bits are 
monitored.  As was pointed out to me ... the TOBY-TAB's will never 
corrode, but everything around them can.  Always use anti-seize 
compound with any and all bolts that you work with ... you'll be 
glad you did.

Toby Peterson  VIN 2248 "Winged1"
DeLorean Parts Northwest, LLC
www.delorean-parts.com  








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 22
Date: Sun, 17 Oct 2004 04:21:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andrew Prentis <aprentis_at_dml_rocketmail.com>
Subject: DeLorean in Sydney Newspaper


For those in Australia with access to the Sunday
newspaper "The Sunday Telegraph" there was a nice
article and photo of a DeLorean just bought by the
author Matthew Reilly.It is nearing the end of a Right
Hand Conversion at the moment and is a nice car.The
article had the facts right for a change which was
nice.It is on P.5 of the "Cars Guide" section.

Andrew
VIN 2883
Sydney



	
		
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 23
Date: Sun, 17 Oct 2004 05:55:39 -0000
From: "ashtonorlan" <ashtonorlan_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Delorean in North Carolina



I saw a Delorean on ebay in N.C. greensboro area, and im currently 
in M.N. I was wondering if anyone knew the car or was willing to 
mabey look at it for me if convient. That would be wonderful! My 
husband has a Delorean and i would like one to match. Thanks Andrea
ashtonorlan_at_dml_yahoo.com








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    dmcnews-unsubscribe_at_dml_yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
 
------------------------------------------------------------------------