From: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2005 2:19 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: [DML] Digest Number 3031

There are 11 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Plastic and Metal Door Guides (or, why *I* love Dave T's posts)
From: "Marv Hein" <marvhein_at_dml_hotmail.com>

2. Question for Toby
From: "Alan Roberts" <twodelo2_at_dml_earthlink.net>

3. Re: Plastic and Metal Door Guides (was: Door Oddity?)
From: "Marv Hein" <marvhein_at_dml_hotmail.com>

4. Re: Something Hot is coming
From: "gullwingmag" <gullwing-magazine_at_dml_sbcglobal.net>

5. RE: Re: Eibach springs/shock set
From: <rob_at_dml_pjgrady.com>

6. Re: Eibach springs/shock set
From: "supremeadmiralsenn" <AdmiralSenn_at_dml_flbb.net>

7. Re: Re: Eibach springs/shock set
From: Chris Shepherd <chrisau79_at_dml_yahoo.com>

8. Cores
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>

9. Stage II engine/SS Exhaust
From: Martin Gutkowski <martin_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>

10. Re: Re: Trans problem-voilent shake
From: mike.griese_at_dml_worldnet.att.net

11. Re: Re: Eibach springs/shock set
From: doki_pen <doki_pen_at_dml_yahoo.com>





Message: 1
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 22:02:14 -0000
From: "Marv Hein" <marvhein_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Plastic and Metal Door Guides (or, why *I* love Dave T's posts)

Yes, seeing as more showed up on the '83 cars.  Any idea why they changed from the metal parts to plastic?  Was it purely a cost issue?

Marv
#10820


--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "James Espey" <james_at_dml_d...> wrote:
>
> There certainly *are* more than 208 sets - my posting said that 208 
> sets complete sets had been received as of Dec 16, 1981 - the month 
> when the cars in question were assembled. More than ONE THOUSAND 
> additional sets arrived at the factory the first week of January, 
> 1982. We have about 100 complete sets of all four pieces remaining
in
> inventory.
> 
> Incidentally, most parts deliveries to the factory stopped about
the
> time they went into receivership, though these records were still 
> maintained by employees at the factory as indicated by on these
cards.
> Later today I'll post scans of these Material Receiving Cards -
which
> as the only known surviving records are better than numbers pulled
out
> of the air - in the forums at:
> 
> http://www.dmchelp.com/
> 
> James Espey
> DMC (Texas)
> http://www.delorean.com








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 2
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 13:54:20 -0800
From: "Alan Roberts" <twodelo2_at_dml_earthlink.net>
Subject: Question for Toby

Hi Toby, I appreciate your lifetime warranty.  Just one question.  Whose life.  The part, the car, the owner, yours?
Al
Al Roberts
twodelo2_at_dml_earthlink.net
#4649/#16049

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 3
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 22:08:14 -0000
From: "Marv Hein" <marvhein_at_dml_hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Plastic and Metal Door Guides (was: Door Oddity?)

You're 10757 and presumably a 12/81 car also?  Just out of curiosity, 
metal or plastic?

Marv
#10820
AZ-D

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_o...> 
wrote:
> David Teitelbaum
> vin 10757









________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 4
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 22:26:43 -0000
From: "gullwingmag" <gullwing-magazine_at_dml_sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Something Hot is coming

Disaster Recovery Plan?

--- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_s...> wrote:
>
> 
> Group, DRP is coming to the Delorean community Jan.1st, 2006. 
> Stand by for more details..
> 
> John Hervey
> 
> www.specialtauto.com
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 5
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 18:43:16 -0500
From: <rob_at_dml_pjgrady.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Eibach springs/shock set



Thank you Kayo for posting your observations on our, and DMCH's, suspension
system. For those of you who don't know it Kayo is an authoritative source
for info on these kits. He has driven many hard (brutal in the winter with
car swallowing pot-holes) New York City and highway miles on our suspension
and pushes his car harder than the average enthusiast. He is good at
deciphering small changes and improvements and so I've often used him as a
highly intelligent "Guinea Pig" for checking performance and longevity of
our and Houston's products.

As some of you know we no longer offer our shock kit mainly because of a
drastic price increase when we went to re-order another batch a couple years
ago. We have been selling Houston's kit for some time now and are happy with
the results. Unfortunately DMCH got hit with a similar price increase
recently from their supplier because of "insufficient production volume" but
I've decided to stick with them to help avoid further price increases. Each
setup has its own advantages but sometimes it's more cost effective to stick
with one setup at the expense of more choices.

As some of you have correctly noted our shocks do provide a more comfortable
ride than either the stock or the Eibach spring/shock kit but therefore
allow more body roll when cornering closer to the handling limits of the
car. Either setup handles far better than the stock setup due to lower ride
height and updated internal valving. 

IMHO most European's (like Martin) will prefer the firmer DMCH setup while
many American's would prefer the more comfortable but slightly less tossable
handling our kit provided. Alas it just wasn't ultimately cost effective for
each of us to offer separate kits so I deferred to the DMCH kit.

We had experimented with hybrid installations between the two kits and don't
think it's necessary to advise against the combination of our front springs,
which we still offer BTW, with DMCH shocks or Eibach springs with our old
shock setup. I think Mark Levy is still using that combination and may wish
to offer his input? They were similar enough to be interchangeable in my
opinion. However I would advise against combining different shocks due to
internal valving differences. My personal favorite at this point in time is
DMCH shocks with our front springs which still allows the rear to be lowered
and is less expensive than popping for the Eibach springs. Hopefully Steve
and James won't be too miffed at me for letting that slip as we've been
getting along famously these days:)!

Hopefully this has resolved some of your questions and concerns.

Rob Grady,

P.J.Grady Inc.

-----Original Message-----
From: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com [mailto:dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
. .
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 4:06 AM
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [DML] Re: Eibach springs/shock set

FWIW.... I had the front and rear shocks as well as the front springs of PJ
Grady in my DeLorean for many years and with over 80,000 miles or more.
This 
combination handled and rode well and they were ready for replacement.

Recently, I had heard so much as how great the DMCH springs and shocks
combination was.  I wanted to see for myself if there was a difference of
the 
DMCH's system versus PJ Grady's system so I had the DMCH complete package of
front and rear springs and shocks installed two months ago by PJ Grady.

My findings to my DeLorean, is that after the DMCH system was installed, the
rear sat way too low and cause the two rear wheels off to be off camber.
The 
rear wheels was doing a split and causing a slight premature wear to the
inner tire.  This situation also causes the rear end to sinks under hard 
acceleration.   I believe that this is where upper or lower adjusting
control arms are necessary to help correct the camber condition. The other
situation was 
that the DMCH front springs are lower then the front "sagging" springs of PJ
Grady's that they had replaced and with the passenger's side about a 1/2"
lower 
then the driver's side.  With all of these conditions, the standing height
was not visually right or physical correct, although the DMCH system is
correctly 
installed.  The DMCH's system ride was also a big disappointment.  Handling
was not very good on turns at higher speeds for the rear was sliding out on 
tight turns causing sway and the ride was generally bumpy and hard.  I
couldn't believe that this is the ride what everyone is bragging about?

Two weeks ago I've taken my DeLorean back to PJ Grady to have the rear shock
adjusted to a higher setting with the rear driver's side adjusted a 1/4"
higher 
then the passenger's rear shock.   This adjustment had made a BIG difference
in the standing height and also correcting the condition of the camber, as
well 
as the ride and the handling ability of the DeLorean -- Offering a total
major improvement in the ride.  Now, it "rides on rails" like everyone
claims.  So, the 
DMCH's front spring and shocks are excelling in handling and offers a "good"
general ride.   

IMO, the PJ Grady's front spring and shocks offers a more comfortable ride
although a bit short in handing as compare to the DMCH's system, but this
can 
be due to the original OEM rear springs which prompts the rear to be higher
then the DMCH's rear springs.  

As of now, the DMCH's system front springs in my DeLorean are not
symmetrical in height as they should be with the passenger's side being
lower of 3/8" 
to 1/2".   I don't know the reason for the differences, for maybe the
springs have a different compression rate or the well housings maybe
different in 
dimensions?  I do know that my frame has not been in an accident as to cause
the differences.  Rob said that he had installed several DMCH systems in 
other DeLoreans and have gotten better results for they were correct in
their standing heights.  Rob suggested that shims could be fitted to the
front 
springs of my DeLorean as to help raised the front and to help the ride.
Rob also suggested driving it for a while until they "settle in" and when he
gets the 
shims made up, the shims will be installed to correct these situations.

So, until the shims are added. The ride of the DMCH is still worth the
money so far and they do feel like the DeLorean is on rails.   Personal, I
still like the 
ride to be softer and I believe that the shocks of PJ Grady may yield that
effect if fitted with the DMCH springs.  I wont know until they are
installed in this 
combination in the future.

For reference, I have the standard OEM rims and the correct sizes of
Michelin Pilots tires for the front and rear.   Oh yes, on tires, I like the
Pirellis slightly 
better, for they are quieter.

Kayo Ong
#5508
Lic  9D NY


----- Original Message -----
From: "Christophe Vieira" <chris_delorean_at_dml_hotmail.com>
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 21:51:01 -0000
Subject: [DML] Re: Eibach springs/shock set

> Hello James,
> 
> I had the shocks from PJ Grady a long time before the Eibach springs
> were available, I did not want to replace them as they were still new
> when I received your springs, this is the only reason.
> 
> I put only 250 miles on them since I got them installed on my car. I
> hope I will get the same result shown on your photos. I did not think
> that the Grady's shocks are in cause because I believe they are
> designed to  work on lowered cars.
> 
> Even if the high is still not perfect, the handling is there and
> really there.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Chris.
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "James Espey" <james_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> >
> > Chris -
> > 
> > The photo you posted shows that something is not right on your car. I
> > question whether the problem is in the shocks or if it's not yet
> > settled in yet.
> > 
> > Here is a photo of our complete setup (Eibach springs and our brand of
> > shocks) after about 1,000 miles:
> > 
> > http://www.delorean.com/eibach.jpg
> > http://www.delorean.com/eibach2.jpg
> > 
> > This is what ALL of our installs look like after they settle in - I do
> > know that our system was designed to be installed as a unit - why did
> > you choose the Grady shocks?
> > 
> > James Espey
> > DMC (Texas)
> > http://www.delorean.com
> > 
> > --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Christophe Vieira"
> > <chris_delorean_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > > 
> > > I installed on my car DMCH Eibach spring and PJ Grady perfo shocks.
> > > I use to drive fast and handling is really great with this setup and
> > > yes, it could be better if ride was a little more firm. We do not use
> > > to drive "barge" in Europe. ;-)
> > > 
> > > The only "bad" point about Eibach spring is that the front is still a
> > > little too hight on my car.
> > > 
> > > You can see the result here :
> > > http://perso.wanadoo.fr/delorean/vin04271-640x480/vin04271-0482.jpg
> > 
> > (SNIP)
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see
www.dmcnews.com
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
>  





To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
Yahoo! Groups Links



 



-- 
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.12/194 - Release Date: 12/7/2005
 

-- 
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.12/194 - Release Date: 12/7/2005
 





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 6
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 23:00:28 -0000
From: "supremeadmiralsenn" <AdmiralSenn_at_dml_flbb.net>
Subject: Re: Eibach springs/shock set

Pictures of the very first Eibach setup:

http://www.angelfire.com/retro/bttf/arrival3.jpg

http://www.angelfire.com/retro/bttf/railsdmc.JPG

http://www.angelfire.com/retro/bttf/hoverboarddmc.JPG

Apparently the design is older than any of us thought. 








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 7
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 15:55:41 -0800 (PST)
From: Chris Shepherd <chrisau79_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Eibach springs/shock set

VERY nice. I really like the wheels and tires.
   
  Chris
  6301

delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com wrote:
  I've put a photo called 6938 in the photo section in the Yahoo site. It was 
the only photo I had handy and my car is hibernating for the winter.

Bruce Benson


> How about posting some pictures?
>
> Chris
> 6301
>
> delornut_at_dml_peoplepc.com wrote:
> I'm an original owner with 25 years of driving the >DeLorean. When I 
> bought
> the car I hated the 4x4 look with the extreme high front 
> >end....................................... 






To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com

For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com

To search the archives or view files, log in at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
Yahoo! Groups Links






  


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 8
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 00:20:10 -0000
From: "John Hervey" <john_at_dml_specialtauto.com>
Subject: Cores

Group,
Never throw anything away on the Delorean if you think it may have 
any core value. If you don't know then call me and I will let you 
know. Here is a list of a few things that I keep for leaner times to 
rebuild and recycle if the factories quit making them. 
Clutch Master
Clutch slave
Brake calipers, Front and back
Brake master
Cold start valve
Freq Valve
Idle speed motors
Original water pump
Clutch disk
Clutch pressure plate
Fuel injectors
Old fuel lines and connectors

Above is just a few things. 
Right now I need ( clutch disk ) if anyone has them to trade or buy.
John Hervey
www.specialtauto.com

 




 








________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 9
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 00:04:12 +0000
From: Martin Gutkowski <martin_at_dml_delorean.co.uk>
Subject: Stage II engine/SS Exhaust

Hi All,

I've added a photo of our Stage II engine to the front page of our 
website. I know there's a lot of interest in the stainless steel exhaust 
from www.stainless-exhaust.com and our Stage II relies on it. This 
particular car had the tranny pulled as well to sort out 2nd and 5th so 
that came back looking pretty. The owner paid to have the engine blasted 
and painted with new M7 hardware. This is not the same as DMC Houston's 
setup. It also has one of our 110A Paris-Rhone alternators. I have some 
more photos from different angles if anyone's interested.

Best Wishes

Martin
DeLorean Motor Cars Ltd
www.delorean.co.uk






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 10
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2005 01:17:54 +0000
From: mike.griese_at_dml_worldnet.att.net
Subject: Re: Re: Trans problem-voilent shake

I think it's the clutch.  Even though it was replaced lately, it sounds like
a classic case of clutch chatter.  If the car didn't behave like this before
the clutch was done, and it does after, you have to go with what was 
changed most recently as a starting point.  

--
Mike


-------------- Original message from "David Teitelbaum" <jtrealty_at_dml_optonline.net>: -------------- 


> If it shakes that bad my guess is the engine is not running correctly 
> at idle so when you start out you have no power unless you rev it up 
> and slip the clutch. The clutch itself and the transmission would not 
> cause the shake. Maybe the brakes are dragging or the e-brake drags, 
> that would make it hard for the motor to get the car moving! Put it in 
> neutral and see if you can roll the car on a flat, level driveway. If 
> nothing is dragging you have to go over the motor and find out why it 
> doesn't have enough power. Start with the mechanical and vacuum 
> advance and the base timing. Make sure both advance mechanisms are 
> working and the base timing is right. 
> David Teitelbaum 
> vin 10757 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "stainlessilusion" <5n-_at_dml_g...> wrote: 
> > 
> > Hey guys, it's been a long time since I've posted here. I haven't 
> > really had the time (5 years to go in the Army). Anyway, my car shakes 
> > violently when starting from a dead stop in first gear until about 5- 
> > 10 mph. This doesn't happen in any other gear including reverse and 
> > the clutch was replaced recently. So, it's obviously internal-anyone 
> > 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address: 
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com 
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com 
> 
> To search the archives or view files, log in at 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/dmcnews 
> Yahoo! Groups Links 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________


Message: 11
Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 17:10:26 -0800 (PST)
From: doki_pen <doki_pen_at_dml_yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: Eibach springs/shock set

I'm concerned with the sides being different heights, I definitely don't want that kind of situation going on, I don't think that's too much to ask for.
 
Jon
#3215

----- Original Message ----
From: . . <klo_at_dml_cidio.net>
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2005 1:06:14 AM
Subject: Re: [DML] Re: Eibach springs/shock set


FWIW.... I had the front and rear shocks as well as the front springs of PJ Grady in my DeLorean for many years and with over 80,000 miles or more.  This 
combination handled and rode well and they were ready for replacement.

Recently, I had heard so much as how great the DMCH springs and shocks combination was.  I wanted to see for myself if there was a difference of the 
DMCH's system versus PJ Grady's system so I had the DMCH complete package of front and rear springs and shocks installed two months ago by PJ Grady.

My findings to my DeLorean, is that after the DMCH system was installed, the rear sat way too low and cause the two rear wheels off to be off camber.  The 
rear wheels was doing a split and causing a slight premature wear to the inner tire.  This situation also causes the rear end to “sinks” under hard 
acceleration.   I believe that this is where upper or lower adjusting control arms are necessary to help correct the camber condition. The other situation was 
that the DMCH front springs are lower then the front "sagging" springs of PJ Grady's that they had replaced and with the passenger's side about a 1/2" lower 
then the driver's side.  With all of these conditions, the standing height was not visually right or physical correct, although the DMCH system is correctly 
installed.  The DMCH's system ride was also a big disappointment.  Handling was not very good on turns at higher speeds for the rear was sliding out on 
tight turns causing sway and the ride was generally bumpy and hard.  I couldn't believe that this is the ride what everyone is bragging about?

Two weeks ago I've taken my DeLorean back to PJ Grady to have the rear shock adjusted to a higher setting with the rear driver's side adjusted a 1/4" higher 
then the passenger's rear shock.   This adjustment had made a BIG difference in the standing height and also correcting the condition of the camber, as well 
as the ride and the handling ability of the DeLorean -- Offering a total major improvement in the ride.  Now, it "rides on rails" like everyone claims.  So, the 
DMCH's front spring and shocks are excelling in handling and offers a "good" general ride.   

IMO, the PJ Grady's front spring and shocks offers a more comfortable ride although a bit short in handing as compare to the DMCH's system, but this can 
be due to the original OEM rear springs which prompts the rear to be higher then the DMCH's rear springs.  

As of now, the DMCH's system front springs in my DeLorean are not symmetrical in height as they should be with the passenger's side being lower of 3/8" 
to 1/2".   I don't know the reason for the differences, for maybe the springs have a different compression rate or the well housings maybe different in 
dimensions?  I do know that my frame has not been in an accident as to cause the differences.  Rob said that he had installed several DMCH systems in 
other DeLoreans and have gotten better results for they were correct in their standing heights.  Rob suggested that shims could be fitted to the front 
springs of my DeLorean as to help raised the front and to help the ride.  Rob also suggested driving it for a while until they "settle in" and when he gets the 
shims made up, the shims will be installed to correct these situations.

So, until the shims are added…. The ride of the DMCH is still worth the money so far and they do feel like the “DeLorean is on rails.”   Personal, I still like the 
ride to be softer and I believe that the shocks of PJ Grady may yield that effect if fitted with the DMCH springs.  I won’t know until they are installed in this 
combination in the future.

For reference, I have the standard OEM rims and the correct sizes of Michelin Pilots tires for the front and rear.   Oh yes, on tires, I like the Pirellis slightly 
better, for they are quieter.

Kayo Ong
#5508
Lic  9D NY


----- Original Message -----
From: "Christophe Vieira" <chris_delorean_at_dml_hotmail.com>
To: dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 21:51:01 -0000
Subject: [DML] Re: Eibach springs/shock set

> Hello James,
> 
> I had the shocks from PJ Grady a long time before the Eibach springs
> were available, I did not want to replace them as they were still new
> when I received your springs, this is the only reason.
> 
> I put only 250 miles on them since I got them installed on my car. I
> hope I will get the same result shown on your photos. I did not think
> that the Grady's shocks are in cause because I believe they are
> designed to  work on lowered cars.
> 
> Even if the high is still not perfect, the handling is there and
> really there.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Chris.
> 
> --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "James Espey" <james_at_dml_d...> wrote:
> >
> > Chris -
> > 
> > The photo you posted shows that something is not right on your car. I
> > question whether the problem is in the shocks or if it's not yet
> > settled in yet.
> > 
> > Here is a photo of our complete setup (Eibach springs and our brand of
> > shocks) after about 1,000 miles:
> > 
> > http://www.delorean.com/eibach.jpg
> > http://www.delorean.com/eibach2.jpg
> > 
> > This is what ALL of our installs look like after they settle in - I do
> > know that our system was designed to be installed as a unit - why did
> > you choose the Grady shocks?
> > 
> > James Espey
> > DMC (Texas)
> > http://www.delorean.com
> > 
> > --- In dmcnews_at_dml_yahoogroups.com, "Christophe Vieira"
> > <chris_delorean_at_dml_h...> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello,
> > > 
> > > I installed on my car DMCH Eibach spring and PJ Grady perfo shocks.
> > > I use to drive fast and handling is really great with this setup and
> > > yes, it could be better if ride was a little more firm. We do not use
> > > to drive "barge" in Europe. ;-)
> > > 
> > > The only "bad" point about Eibach spring is that the front is still a
> > > little too hight on my car.
> > > 
> > > You can see the result here :
> > > http://perso.wanadoo.fr/delorean/vin04271-640x480/vin04271-0482.jpg
> > 
> > (SNIP)
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To address comments privately to the moderating team, please address:
> moderators_at_dml_dmcnews.com
> 
> For more info on the list, tech articles, cars for sale see www.dmcnews.com
> 
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